"Donald Trump is their [Russian propagandists] favorite weapon against America. Trump is described as a friend and ally, "our Trumpushka" and "Donald Fredovych." Out of office, he is described as Russia's great hope. He is "sorely missed"; Russia is "ready to elect you again". Russia propagandists had no trouble predicting that Trump would try a coup when he lost in 2020, because that is a familiar sort of behavior to them. They rejoiced when he did , because they thought that this could lead to a civil war in the United States. Their coverage of Trump's coup attempt was at first highly positive. When it failed, a very awkward pivot was made to the position that it had all been some sort of provocation by the Democrats.
One of the things that Russian propagandists expect not to be noticed, but which is brought home in the book [Julia Davis's new book on Russian television propagandists, In Their Own Words] , is that they believe that Trump is an idiot. Of course, it's hard to see, from their perspective, how they can believe anything else (except, perhaps, that he is a traitor, as is also sometimes hinted). In their public worldview, destroying the United States is the main aim, and here is an American who follows their talking points."
I think what neither HCR nor Snyder mentions is the elephant in the room: the foreign manipilators are not just counting on the candidates they prop up being useful idiots. They are operating under the assumption that the social media black hole in and of itself has made a whole population of useful idiots.
I am apparently one of a disappoingly slim percentage of my age cohort who does not have any sort of social media and never has. Avoiding being smug about it becomes more challenging by the day. People can always point to some benefit they feel they are getting out of it, yet they seem unwilling to do the cost part of cost/benefit analysis. The benefits are so dwarfed by the costs, on both an individual and global level. People of my brothers' age (24) have never been without it, so could be extended some sympathy for buying into the perception of social media as necessary, omnipresent, and inevitable. Yet I am flabbergasted at the number of older people who act as if they couldn't do without something that they did not need nor want for much of their adult life. This is not the invention of the telephone or the clothes washer we are talking about here! There is nothing that this product offers that could not be achieved just as well with another mode of communicative technology (or no technology), and it actively eats time from people's day rather than giving it back to them.
I am trying to impress upon people that literally everything you read, see, or hear on these sites that has anything to do with current events should be disregarded. If you aren't getting information from the online source of a reputable print journalism outfit, just assume it is not real. Period. Social media when it comes to news is wildfire inside a hurricane, an uncontrollably destructive whirl of disinfo and "hot takes." People understand by now that how "friends" represent themselves on Instagram is an unreliable view into their "authentic" lives. Why on God's Green Earth would you expect the representation of public figures or breaking news - positive or negative - to be any less of a crock? The constant influx of negative stimulus is definitely breeding paranoia among users, but why would one not take the chance to direct your conspiratorially-minded energy back to the stream of media itself? If experts are to be believed, seems like the one thing you actually have some cause to be paranoid about, no?
Long story short, everyone needs to give themselves a gift and get off this ride. I will be sitting under a tree reading a book. Come on over, it's nice here, you aren't missing anything you wouldn't want to miss. I promise!
I note that many of my social media contacts are people I "met" through forums (motorcycling and tuba playing) that I participated in from 2004 until either their demise (an amazing motorcycle forum where I have met some wonderful people) or until some changes in management (the tuba forum) really chased a lot of us away.
I cancelled my Facebook "page" the day I found out Mark Fukerberg sold data to Cambridge Analytica. Read "Burn Book," and listen to Pivot with Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway so at least you understand how unsocial social media is, how unintelligent AI is, how the Internet has deninished your choices not expanded them (Beyonce and Swift). It is about making the big four richer and richer. Facebook is Oxy for the masses and Mark cares zero about the patient, like the Sacklers. Media has lost to silicon valley.
I just never got the appeal of Facebook. I reconnected with people I thought I wanted to get to know better as adults. It was interesting but not enriching. No regrets about not following anybody or not being followed. Never had a twitter or tictoc account. Why do I need them?
Lately I've been wondering if I actually need a subscription to the NYTs (I'd miss the recipes and games) or WAPO (tepid tea)....because I've noticed a subtle change....one not so positive article about Biden interspersed with 10 articles about the latest Trump manifesto and spin pieces in guest opinions. Did the "media" learn nothing from 2016? I just don't understand why the average person doesn't already understand that their independence has been surrendered and the only way they can get it back is by abandoning the internet sites designed for narcissists and haters.
Instead of outright ‘Yellow Journalism’ of the late 19th century, they are practicing a beige-color journalism signifying a kind of marketing for the greatest number but still appeasing the capitalistic marketplace instead of import truthing.
I cancelled my NYT subscription after a week of finding nothing at all worth reading. And then they put up a very sweet video about the power of, of all things, knitting.
I would miss the recipes.
Just fyi, when I signed up again I got it for a dollar a week for six months. So every six months I'll cancel again. Until they figure it out,
I miss Facebook. I had friends from childhood to my work colleagues, hundreds, lost when it crashed in March. They want my SSN, driver's license /passport, so I will not be rejoining. Also banned on x.
IMHO it's because of my political views. I'm not alone.
Daniel, I missed fecebook when I first deleted my account in 2000, but now like a recovering addict consider myself fecebook-free for 4 years. (maybe I'll get a triangle tat with a 4 in it:) I missed a lot of friends from there, but were they? Those that I was quite close to connected by e-mail and I occasionally get response from them. The others are just digital manifestations that I thot were friends. I did find a half-sister that I lost contact with for 40 years and have since visited her and keep in touch by fone & e-mail. Before leaving, I discovered a very loving, liberal friend I knew from the '70s had become a MAGAt with her new husband so blocked her just as I did with any tRump supporter I knew IRL.
Oh, I have also been twit free-for 2 years and never missed it. My only social net now is MeWe and wish ppl & agencies would stop linking to fecebook & twit as if everyone is still wading in those cesspools.
Just a quick comment--I had become increasingly disappointed with the NYT, but love the crosswords and games (and didn't want to break my crossword streak, haha). I recently switched to "games only," which is about $6/month, and I now get the content I want. It was hard at first to let go of the recipes, but I can find much better recipes by googling, so aside from downloading a few favorites, I'm content to live without the recipes.
I still have. an fb account but don’t use it, aside from forwarding the occasional post I make to Instagram. But even that is becoming something of a hellscape, full of bots and/or knuckle-draggers in the comments anytime somebody has something to say about lgbtq+ issues or Gaza. I’m an artist but thank goodness I don’t try to promote anything there because it’s become completely useless for engagement.
As for the Times, I had a sub to them for a time but their continued both-sides slant made me give up. I moved to the WAPO…same thing happened. Then I landed on the Guardian and they do it as well. I bailed the day they published an article about that ridiculous “report” came out about Biden’s memory issues, with absolutely no mention of the political nature of the thing. So I’ve pretty much given up on these fronts. The daily Letters is about all I need (or can handle) for the ugly parts of the world.
Never signed up for Facebook but did start to signup for Linkedin thinking it was better suited to professionals I'd want to stay in touch with or converse with. It quickly turned into a mess with requests coming out of nowhere, or links to people I knew of in sensitive positions. The absolute worst was quickly finding out that many of the requests that appeared to come from people I knew didn't come from them at all.
I never look at LinkedIn any more since a woman I thought was a close friend started sending me Alex Jines stuff there, I should have known who she really was when she started praying for me and put a Ben Carson sticker on her company car, calling on scientists, whom I'm pretty sure would not at all appreciate her political beliefs. Smfh
I didn't have the problem of actual friends sending such stuff, I think because I started calling them to see if it was actually them who sent requests for links. Since half of them weren't actually from friends (just appeared to be from them), I had called the first dozen or so to tell them I wasn't going to respond to any Linkedin notices. That made it much easier to just let them know anytime I received something supposedly from them. I suspect that pretty much curbed their enthusiasm for Linkedin, too.
I cancelled my NYT subscription of 17 yrs due to their obvious bias for trump & anti Biden. It's over the top & ridiculous how they seem to be doing what they can to get trump elected. I don't believe anything in the NYT anymore & now I buy crossword books instead.
I never bother with the Post and I read selected bits from the NYT and always do the crossword and some other puzzles. I like the recipes, the science section, and the book review. Our local rag long ago ceased to be a newspaper when it was bought by Gannett.
One of the worst is the selling of AI, it’s neither! It’s just code, written by people, badly, to mind the work of others through the stealing of digitized bits. And if the digitized is racism, sexist, violent, stupid, old, bad, refuted, it doesn’t matter!
But folks ‘act’ like it’s manna from heaven! Give me a good climate model, ground-truthed by good information, tested and retested…now that is maybe at least intelligent, still not artificial! People, dogs, porpoises, whales, 🐙 are intelligent. Well some people… some act like ‘AI.’ Feeding on misinformation like it’s the greatest drug ever!
You lost me after the Sackler comment. Are you inferring Zuckerberg, Sackler and by extension, Jews are dishonest and not to be trusted? Don't even tell me about your views on Israelis.
Facebook was likened to “Oxy” which is oxycodone—the highly addictive pain pill that The Sackler Family—owners of the company that promoted Oxy to doctors, encouraging them to write more prescriptions.
Call me paranoid! I'm accustomed to the siren calls. I see it in the propaganda used here in this country everyday of the week. I see it on college campuses, where Jews are being singled out for their religion. I hear it from attendees to religious institutions that have experienced these subliminal accusations. Yes, I see it in the commentary, where what most would call an innocent comment gets a ground swell of praise because the writer doesn't come right out and say what they think. Sought of like tRump. He doesn't have to say what he wants, his followers are well aware of what he wants, and they fall into line.
Lest you believe I am prejudiced, think again! My daughter married a Christian. My son is going with a religious Catholic. My granddaughter is in a serious relationship with a christian. I love them all. What gets my feathers up are comments like Fuckerrberg and Sackler. This isn't the first time Martha has made comments like these
Well stated. Since I retired, I got back into reading more and more. Something to the tune of 120 books since 2016. Read so much while working, did not take time to expand my brain. I will join you with a book. If you read my posts today, it will confirm what you are saying about how the MSM and social feeds are being used against us. Flood the zone with s..t is what those that seek to tear down democracy works. The social media universe is a perfect vehicle to do what they do and it is also the perfect example of how unregulated (libertarian) capitalism is dangerous for society.
As a retired academic librarian and 86, I applaud your reading of more books. I also receive the wise words of Phillip Gulley, a Quaker pastor in Indiana.
Ah yes, libertarian capitalism, in which the only acceptable objective is quarterly profit for the few, where there are no citizens, only consumers in search of new things to consume…in which soon the capital itself is consumed, leaving only a wasteland.
Propganda is a booming business. PhysOrg reports that the number of phoney/partisan news portals now outnumber mainstram news sites, and they're frequently employing AI to produce their content:
While I do spend time on the internet, I believe I am selective enough to actually benefit from the sources I've learned to respect. Beau of the fifth column is one of these. Heather is another. I also Like cat videos. 😊 But I agree wholeheartedly with many of the points you raise. I no longer always carry my phone with me. I ignore many of the feeds Google sends me since so many of their headlines turn out to be click bait. And yes, I have recently returned to actual book reading since I now have time away from my screens. So thank you for your post and have a great day under that tree of yours. 🌳
Will, using social media is not a bad thing...if you compare notes, you can discerne the truth. But, social media platforms need to be more accountable for ferreting out foreign manipulators.
I utilize FB as an amazing educational resource. I follow a wide variety of pages that cover topics of art, architecture, history, gardening, astronomy, animal rescues, vintage ceramics, cooking, kayaking, photography, gardening, and more. Plus I can easily stay in touch with friends & relatives around the world. And yes, I also follow political analysts like Heather Cox Richardson & Jay Kuo., and read books , too. So you can be smug if you like, but you might be underestimating what you are also missing.
Same! I love seeing what far-flung family and friends are up to. The rest of my Facebook feed is animals, photography, recipes, gardening and art. People who call Facebook a cesspool are interacting with content that causes the algorithm to create a cesspool.
Yes, I think unfortunately many people just don't realize how positive & enriching FB can be. They also don't utilize their power to shape their feed by simply deleting content that is objectionable, and electing to view pages that are more uplifting. I have a network of many amazing, talented friends who also use FB as a positive resource, so I know you & I are not alone. 😊
About social media. I have learned a lot about art, flowers, antiques, etc. The NatGeo site is great for following animals, archeology, and so much more! This is not to mention how much I love the photos sent by family and friends here and abroad.
I hear you, but without social media, we are left with mainstream media, which had been downplaying the threats, and both-sidsing the issues. I found HCR, Jay Kuo, Joyce Vance and others on social media. It's a two-sided coin--back in the day, we all had one news source (like Walter Cronkite), and we all believed what we were told, because that was pretty much all we had access to. That's kind of the problem now--lots of older folks watch and trust Fox News, because they assume it's a regular news channel, like the ones they had when they were younger. Misinformation is here to stay, whether it's in social media on on TV. It's our job to discern facts from propaganda. It's not easy!
They do not think it is their job to ethically manage what is posted, nor do they care to because they will lose money. It's a platform for making shareholders money, not a newspaper or a network. In that regard, hate, outrage, threats, blood, and sex sell, truth is not part of the algorithm.
I hear you and I’m on social media and it’s like the ridiculous things people write, I’m like is that a real person or a bot.... it feels like click baiting
I am with you young person. FB made is really difficult to officially delete. Instagram is overwhelming. And journalism/truth was once more reliable. It’s easy to see the bias and propaganda through some news writers. Such a shame. Bring on book reading!
Refreshing to hear. There was a time when people from diverse backgrounds kept themselves actively informed. My father who never finished grade school and mother who got her GED at age forty got their information from our small town’s two local papers and nearby larger Scranton Times and Scranton Tribune. And in addition on Sunday on our way home from church we brought home two of the New York City newspapers. Now reputable resources like those above are going under and replaced by sensationalizing lazy “ journalism “ spreading disinformation and propaganda that gives us the pablum we want. In place of taking an active skeptical and critical approach to getting our information we become cynical and complacent
I too avoid social media. I read books, a few substack authors, and articles from trusted news organizations.
We urgently need government
regulation of the SM platforms that includes taking down the bad actors and their bots. Immediately. Everyday. They should not be able to cross the digital line and post their divisive propaganda on any SM platform.
Very frightening to say the least. The key is to get families talking about politics, arguing out what they think American democracy is and means; that is, to re-engage in republican citizenship. NOTE: reference to a recent article in 'The Economist' deleted.🤔
By the way, Trump has called on the members of the 06jan21 Committee to be indicted for destroying evidence. I wonder if he is saying that because he wants to destroy evidence if he wins; that is, obstruct justice and blame it upon the special committee. 💔
EXTREMELY IMPORTANT regarding predictive model from The Economist (and others): Do not take it as an accurate assessment. IGNORE IT. Do not repeat it or share it with anyone.
The Economist model is going against the 538 Model (Biden ahead), the Moody's Model (Biden ahead), and the Economist's own polling averages (!!!) as of recently (Biden ahead). In 2022, that same model incorrectly predicted a bunch of losses that did not materialize. I'm not saying they built a poor model on purpose or anyone should be paranoid or only listen to the models that give you answers you like. But OMG people, I'm begging you, stop taking an individual poll or model as gospel, and don't assume that because something is shared more it is more true!
The idea that Republicans are winning against all historical precedent is a central - maybe THE central - component of their narrative right now. They are trading off the *perception* of having the upper hand because they don't actually have it. People like backing a perceived winner. This illusion of strength is essential to the rise of every authoritarian movement. Acting like pro-democracy candidates have "sobering" chances of success, when they have actually been on an almost unbroken winning streak nationally for six whole years, plays into those hands. We literally just had a special Congressional race in Ohio where the Dem overperformed by TWENTY points despite spending essentially no money. That doesn't happen if your party is weak and your standard-bearer is behind. It just doesn't.
In politics, you need to act like the presumptive champ even if you aren't ahead. To act like you are behind when you are actually ahead is simply inexcusable.
It shouldn't be surprising that the Economist, a publication that loves welfare for the rich, tax cuts, and anything that drives profits upward would support Cheetolini. They know he is a blithering idiot and a danger to the nation, but short-term, he promises to trash the economy once again with massive giveaways to corporations and the wealthy (i.e. their benefactors). Their opinions are less than worthless.
You'd THINK that would be true but the model espoused by (it seems) almost every high-end business school is that profits should be taken as often and as much as can be done, without regard for long-term economic health or any kind of shared, profit-sustaining prosperity across the socio-economic spectrum. In 2016, I was convinced that Big Money would eschew the kind of instability that Trump represented. Now we know they will embrace any potential for rapacious gains, the future be damned.
I'm a chemist not an economist, so when I subscribed when I was avidly reading economics, I was appalled at the absolute tripe it published. Total bullsh!t. I guess you had to be fully indoctrinated in the Chicago school to go along with it. Actually a bit frightening if it represents what policy is based on.
I thought this in 2016. Up until Comey. This does not nullify your point, but in Texas, the fix is in. I hope that is not the case everywhere. And I support Beto and every Dem in Texas. As to optimism, as Winston said, of what use is it to be anything else. He knew how to go from loss to loss with no drop in enthusiasm. The fight is on all fronts. Assume nothing.
So very disappointed in Texas. Lived there so long, am a native born, and refuse to admit being from there now. Family homestead was in Bosque County where sundown laws (not officially) still exists in some small towns.
Loved it when I moved here from East coast. Even rural areas were sane, except for one sign I saw W of Ft Worth calling the UN a communist front. Otherwise OK until Rove came with the savior W in 1994. At least on my turf.
I have been to the lone star state a few times for business. Have always rather liked its culture. But, from a distance, I am not crazy about the politics.
The politics used to be just fine. The change has been the result of lies, dirty tricks, and the most egregious actions. Bought by many who should have known better. And, of course, the macho guys I knew who bought an image that was total bullschitt.
You are right on, Jeri; starting in 1968. Though my parents were Midwestern moderate conservative supporting the ghastly war in Viêt Nam, I remember how sad my mother was when Senator Humphrey lost in 1968. 😢 Senator shady J.D. turns my stomach with his opportunism and he is an educated member of the cognitive under-class; much like the intellectuals flocking to the S.S. under Himmler. 🤢
1st DRAFT of this RESPONSE DELETED. I was getting, ahem, fussy. I will likely pull my initial response, too. Will has made some fine points and I need to chew the cud.
I liked your comment because of your suggestion that the "key is to get families talking about politics, arguing out what they think American democracy is and means; that is, to re-engage in republican citizenship." That is what's missing right now and badly needed. Nobody wants to talk about it. It's considered rude to even mention politics in certain circles. I have neighbors that ignore me. lol.
Fortunately, my neighbors are still talking to me even after we put up our Biden/Harris sign. The ONLY one 😔here in my neighborhood peninsula of nearly 800 people in Magaville, Florida .Come on HCR peeps, join us! 🪧 And while you’re at it ,sport a Biden/Harris t-shirt. I’ve been wearing one since Feb. and only ++ comments/discussions.👕🛒
As the weather heats up here in the land of “no climate change”, I’ve been encouraging my younger family members,with their frequent pool parties😎🍻, to have those conversations with friends.A GOP Admin that would restrict access to condoms and prioritize the rhythm method of birth control seems to get their attention. Fortunately they’re still talking to me too !
I’ve been using talking points from Andra Watkins, who has read and dissected Project 2025.⬇️
It was former Representative Kinzinger (R-IL) who called for this in his closing remarks in one of the 06jan21 Committee hearings. ✌️EDIT: but, hey, I worked in government long enough to learn how to take credit when and where it is not due. 🤫
Ned, if you need another resource to review here on Substack that undergirds Will’s points, read Simon Rosenberg’s Hopium Chronicles. Rosenberg is admittedly a Democrat but his analysis of current polls includes a much broader scope of statistics and methodology than most - and he correctly predicted that there would be no “Red Wave” in 2022 - something nearly every mainstream media outlet was leading with (I’m looking at you, NYT!).
Polling is a social science. It is nigh on impossible to do it without skewing the results to match the politics of those doing the work. And Republican pollsters are constantly flooding the zone with polls that are more propaganda than science - which then leads to red wavy bs being pushed around as gospel truth.
The Economist has a perspective. That perspective is definitively Capitalist- with a capital C. They are less concerned with my wellbeing as an American than with the wellbeing of the stock and financial markets. My point is to read any poll with an eye towards the politics of the polling agency. Polls are a snapshot in time and a skewed one. Better to spend time helping get out the vote, something that actually can change the outcome of this election!
Funny thing is, I usually do not pay attention to polls. I decide how I am going to vote and say so, if provoked, asked, or giving in to my curmudgeonly ways.
This is a great point. THe control of the MSM has consolidated to a very few right wing nuts out there. I call them nuts, because they deny facts and insert their own beliefs in place of facts. Like Reaganomics being so great, racism no longer a problem, and taxing the wealthy not good.
Sinclair is awful but what can we make of the NYT and WaPo embracing ridiculous memes about Biden's alleged mental decline over fair reporting about Trump's far more obvious lack of both intellect and stability?
Maybe "owns" should be in quotes, I don't know, but the station's DC news segment is always from Slanted Sinclair. For example, in covering President Biden's executive order re the border, with right-wing criticism about "too little too late," the anchor person never mentioned that the reason the bipartisan deal fell through was because Trump ordered his Congressional toadies to kill it.
I didn't realize Sinclair owned some CBS stations. Overheard the "news" broadcast at 6 pm at somewhere other than my house, and was surprised to see a CBS logo at the bottom of the screen. In suburban DC, that was the only identifier. If there'd been an honest one, I would have backed off like I'd come across a rattler or copperhead. Full info please!
Given the idiotic rhetoric coming out of the so-called "paper of record", the New York Times, one has to wonder if they, too, are Russian operatives . . .
When hearing about this poll or that poll, I always say “How many people did they talk to” What is the demographic” “Who are they talking to?”……Well, recently I was at a friends house when his phone rang and it was a pollster. As i sat and listened to my friend answer questions……contrary to what i know to be true about him, he was not truthful with the pollster. He was yanking the guys chain with ridiculous answers and even said he will vote for Rump. Now, I have known this person a very long time and i know that would never happen!! So, It goes to show…..people do yank the chain of the pollsters so you cant even trust those.
That is also a good point. There was some discussion after the 2016 election that some people had misrepresented their positions in polls because they did not want to admit to supporting Trump.
I'm going to express the same meaning in different words.
Don't be naively optimistic, but whatever you do, don't be pessimistic because pessimism is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If I act based on the assumption I won't catch a fish, then I won't fish, and then I won't catch a fish.
Very good point about pessimism. I do despair at times. Still trying to figure out what the HELL happened to 'my' America of the Great Society with Big Business support.
Back then, moderate conservatives, like my parents, viewed themselves as part of a larger system that included liberals. Like the pick used by an ice climbers, liberals would throw the pick ahead (prudently with the influence of moderate liberals).
The moderate conservatives would pull the rest of us in by making the progressive policies fiscally sustainable; at times the further right conservatives might intervene when a policy had failed or was repudiated by the populace.
It does show that what made the W.W.II generation was not the Depression; that made the generation good. Not the war; that made the generation great. It is what those men and women did AFTER W.W.II through 1968 that made them the Greatest Generation.
But that is likely my naïve view. After all, I was a deeply informed intellectual at the age of eight back then.
By describing the conservative/progressive interaction pattern, you're accurately describing a specific manifestation of a frequently observed and frequently described phenomenon that I would argue has been recurring for thousands of generations since the origin of our species. So, I would say your view is not naive. Instead, it's in the right direction. Keep going, and you'll get there.
Alternatively, click on my profile link. I think I can save you a lot of time, energy, and attention.
"Donald Trump is their [Russian propagandists] favorite weapon against America. Trump is described as a friend and ally, "our Trumpushka" and "Donald Fredovych." Out of office, he is described as Russia's great hope. He is "sorely missed"; Russia is "ready to elect you again". Russia propagandists had no trouble predicting that Trump would try a coup when he lost in 2020, because that is a familiar sort of behavior to them. They rejoiced when he did , because they thought that this could lead to a civil war in the United States. Their coverage of Trump's coup attempt was at first highly positive. When it failed, a very awkward pivot was made to the position that it had all been some sort of provocation by the Democrats.
One of the things that Russian propagandists expect not to be noticed, but which is brought home in the book [Julia Davis's new book on Russian television propagandists, In Their Own Words] , is that they believe that Trump is an idiot. Of course, it's hard to see, from their perspective, how they can believe anything else (except, perhaps, that he is a traitor, as is also sometimes hinted). In their public worldview, destroying the United States is the main aim, and here is an American who follows their talking points."
- Timothy Snyder
I think what neither HCR nor Snyder mentions is the elephant in the room: the foreign manipilators are not just counting on the candidates they prop up being useful idiots. They are operating under the assumption that the social media black hole in and of itself has made a whole population of useful idiots.
I am apparently one of a disappoingly slim percentage of my age cohort who does not have any sort of social media and never has. Avoiding being smug about it becomes more challenging by the day. People can always point to some benefit they feel they are getting out of it, yet they seem unwilling to do the cost part of cost/benefit analysis. The benefits are so dwarfed by the costs, on both an individual and global level. People of my brothers' age (24) have never been without it, so could be extended some sympathy for buying into the perception of social media as necessary, omnipresent, and inevitable. Yet I am flabbergasted at the number of older people who act as if they couldn't do without something that they did not need nor want for much of their adult life. This is not the invention of the telephone or the clothes washer we are talking about here! There is nothing that this product offers that could not be achieved just as well with another mode of communicative technology (or no technology), and it actively eats time from people's day rather than giving it back to them.
I am trying to impress upon people that literally everything you read, see, or hear on these sites that has anything to do with current events should be disregarded. If you aren't getting information from the online source of a reputable print journalism outfit, just assume it is not real. Period. Social media when it comes to news is wildfire inside a hurricane, an uncontrollably destructive whirl of disinfo and "hot takes." People understand by now that how "friends" represent themselves on Instagram is an unreliable view into their "authentic" lives. Why on God's Green Earth would you expect the representation of public figures or breaking news - positive or negative - to be any less of a crock? The constant influx of negative stimulus is definitely breeding paranoia among users, but why would one not take the chance to direct your conspiratorially-minded energy back to the stream of media itself? If experts are to be believed, seems like the one thing you actually have some cause to be paranoid about, no?
Long story short, everyone needs to give themselves a gift and get off this ride. I will be sitting under a tree reading a book. Come on over, it's nice here, you aren't missing anything you wouldn't want to miss. I promise!
Except that I found HCR on social media.
As did I and let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater!
HCR and so many others.
I note that many of my social media contacts are people I "met" through forums (motorcycling and tuba playing) that I participated in from 2004 until either their demise (an amazing motorcycle forum where I have met some wonderful people) or until some changes in management (the tuba forum) really chased a lot of us away.
And I for one, am glad I met you here, Ally.
And I, you.
I found her on Facebook. I feel so blessed to have accidentally had a pop up that I read. I have learned so much in the last few years.
I connected with friends from elementary school! Baby & the bath water for sure…
I cancelled my Facebook "page" the day I found out Mark Fukerberg sold data to Cambridge Analytica. Read "Burn Book," and listen to Pivot with Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway so at least you understand how unsocial social media is, how unintelligent AI is, how the Internet has deninished your choices not expanded them (Beyonce and Swift). It is about making the big four richer and richer. Facebook is Oxy for the masses and Mark cares zero about the patient, like the Sacklers. Media has lost to silicon valley.
I just never got the appeal of Facebook. I reconnected with people I thought I wanted to get to know better as adults. It was interesting but not enriching. No regrets about not following anybody or not being followed. Never had a twitter or tictoc account. Why do I need them?
Lately I've been wondering if I actually need a subscription to the NYTs (I'd miss the recipes and games) or WAPO (tepid tea)....because I've noticed a subtle change....one not so positive article about Biden interspersed with 10 articles about the latest Trump manifesto and spin pieces in guest opinions. Did the "media" learn nothing from 2016? I just don't understand why the average person doesn't already understand that their independence has been surrendered and the only way they can get it back is by abandoning the internet sites designed for narcissists and haters.
Instead of outright ‘Yellow Journalism’ of the late 19th century, they are practicing a beige-color journalism signifying a kind of marketing for the greatest number but still appeasing the capitalistic marketplace instead of import truthing.
I cancelled my NYT subscription after a week of finding nothing at all worth reading. And then they put up a very sweet video about the power of, of all things, knitting.
I would miss the recipes.
Just fyi, when I signed up again I got it for a dollar a week for six months. So every six months I'll cancel again. Until they figure it out,
That's how I do it. I think I get a 3 months for 5 bucks deal about every 6 months (after dropping it after 2 months and 29 days).
I am thinking of it too. But I would miss the editorials by Thomas Friedman.
Me too because I like the recipes.
I miss Facebook. I had friends from childhood to my work colleagues, hundreds, lost when it crashed in March. They want my SSN, driver's license /passport, so I will not be rejoining. Also banned on x.
IMHO it's because of my political views. I'm not alone.
I ask people who are on Facebook to protest.
Daniel, I missed fecebook when I first deleted my account in 2000, but now like a recovering addict consider myself fecebook-free for 4 years. (maybe I'll get a triangle tat with a 4 in it:) I missed a lot of friends from there, but were they? Those that I was quite close to connected by e-mail and I occasionally get response from them. The others are just digital manifestations that I thot were friends. I did find a half-sister that I lost contact with for 40 years and have since visited her and keep in touch by fone & e-mail. Before leaving, I discovered a very loving, liberal friend I knew from the '70s had become a MAGAt with her new husband so blocked her just as I did with any tRump supporter I knew IRL.
Oh, I have also been twit free-for 2 years and never missed it. My only social net now is MeWe and wish ppl & agencies would stop linking to fecebook & twit as if everyone is still wading in those cesspools.
Just a quick comment--I had become increasingly disappointed with the NYT, but love the crosswords and games (and didn't want to break my crossword streak, haha). I recently switched to "games only," which is about $6/month, and I now get the content I want. It was hard at first to let go of the recipes, but I can find much better recipes by googling, so aside from downloading a few favorites, I'm content to live without the recipes.
Yes I quit FB then too Martha for all the same reasons. It was such a relief. I find the practice of mindfulness is the enrichment ingredient now.
I still have. an fb account but don’t use it, aside from forwarding the occasional post I make to Instagram. But even that is becoming something of a hellscape, full of bots and/or knuckle-draggers in the comments anytime somebody has something to say about lgbtq+ issues or Gaza. I’m an artist but thank goodness I don’t try to promote anything there because it’s become completely useless for engagement.
As for the Times, I had a sub to them for a time but their continued both-sides slant made me give up. I moved to the WAPO…same thing happened. Then I landed on the Guardian and they do it as well. I bailed the day they published an article about that ridiculous “report” came out about Biden’s memory issues, with absolutely no mention of the political nature of the thing. So I’ve pretty much given up on these fronts. The daily Letters is about all I need (or can handle) for the ugly parts of the world.
Never signed up for Facebook but did start to signup for Linkedin thinking it was better suited to professionals I'd want to stay in touch with or converse with. It quickly turned into a mess with requests coming out of nowhere, or links to people I knew of in sensitive positions. The absolute worst was quickly finding out that many of the requests that appeared to come from people I knew didn't come from them at all.
Unfortunate that LinkedIn actually was begun as a legitimate place for business/resumes/job searching/hiring.
I never look at LinkedIn any more since a woman I thought was a close friend started sending me Alex Jines stuff there, I should have known who she really was when she started praying for me and put a Ben Carson sticker on her company car, calling on scientists, whom I'm pretty sure would not at all appreciate her political beliefs. Smfh
I didn't have the problem of actual friends sending such stuff, I think because I started calling them to see if it was actually them who sent requests for links. Since half of them weren't actually from friends (just appeared to be from them), I had called the first dozen or so to tell them I wasn't going to respond to any Linkedin notices. That made it much easier to just let them know anytime I received something supposedly from them. I suspect that pretty much curbed their enthusiasm for Linkedin, too.
I cancelled my NYT subscription of 17 yrs due to their obvious bias for trump & anti Biden. It's over the top & ridiculous how they seem to be doing what they can to get trump elected. I don't believe anything in the NYT anymore & now I buy crossword books instead.
I never bother with the Post and I read selected bits from the NYT and always do the crossword and some other puzzles. I like the recipes, the science section, and the book review. Our local rag long ago ceased to be a newspaper when it was bought by Gannett.
That "molasses" accident must have been something to have actually experienced, actually living there, right on your street! Gawwwd!!!
One of the worst is the selling of AI, it’s neither! It’s just code, written by people, badly, to mind the work of others through the stealing of digitized bits. And if the digitized is racism, sexist, violent, stupid, old, bad, refuted, it doesn’t matter!
But folks ‘act’ like it’s manna from heaven! Give me a good climate model, ground-truthed by good information, tested and retested…now that is maybe at least intelligent, still not artificial! People, dogs, porpoises, whales, 🐙 are intelligent. Well some people… some act like ‘AI.’ Feeding on misinformation like it’s the greatest drug ever!
You lost me after the Sackler comment. Are you inferring Zuckerberg, Sackler and by extension, Jews are dishonest and not to be trusted? Don't even tell me about your views on Israelis.
Facebook was likened to “Oxy” which is oxycodone—the highly addictive pain pill that The Sackler Family—owners of the company that promoted Oxy to doctors, encouraging them to write more prescriptions.
Just an observation - you are the one 'inferring' things. You're trying to say that the person you're writing to is 'implying' them.
Call me paranoid! I'm accustomed to the siren calls. I see it in the propaganda used here in this country everyday of the week. I see it on college campuses, where Jews are being singled out for their religion. I hear it from attendees to religious institutions that have experienced these subliminal accusations. Yes, I see it in the commentary, where what most would call an innocent comment gets a ground swell of praise because the writer doesn't come right out and say what they think. Sought of like tRump. He doesn't have to say what he wants, his followers are well aware of what he wants, and they fall into line.
Lest you believe I am prejudiced, think again! My daughter married a Christian. My son is going with a religious Catholic. My granddaughter is in a serious relationship with a christian. I love them all. What gets my feathers up are comments like Fuckerrberg and Sackler. This isn't the first time Martha has made comments like these
Cancelled mine awhile ago, the WAPO too
It has become a cesspool, and we are as stuck as the people in the flood of molasses in 1919. But some of us can wade out.
Well stated. Since I retired, I got back into reading more and more. Something to the tune of 120 books since 2016. Read so much while working, did not take time to expand my brain. I will join you with a book. If you read my posts today, it will confirm what you are saying about how the MSM and social feeds are being used against us. Flood the zone with s..t is what those that seek to tear down democracy works. The social media universe is a perfect vehicle to do what they do and it is also the perfect example of how unregulated (libertarian) capitalism is dangerous for society.
As a retired academic librarian and 86, I applaud your reading of more books. I also receive the wise words of Phillip Gulley, a Quaker pastor in Indiana.
I love cats and Mysteries. 🐈⬛🐈
I am also a retired librarian, high school and I have always been a reader. And while we no longer have a cat, we do read lots of mysteries.
Flood the zone....
It's the firehose strategy.
https://yadontknow.blogspot.com/2022/02/a-gloved-fist.html
Ah yes, libertarian capitalism, in which the only acceptable objective is quarterly profit for the few, where there are no citizens, only consumers in search of new things to consume…in which soon the capital itself is consumed, leaving only a wasteland.
Propganda is a booming business. PhysOrg reports that the number of phoney/partisan news portals now outnumber mainstram news sites, and they're frequently employing AI to produce their content:
https://phys.org/news/2024-06-phony-news-portals-surpass-newspaper.html
Good Lord, Goebbels would be orgasmic
BRAIN BLEACH, STAT!!!!
Lower than whale-poop.
Now I can't unthink that.
It is as disgusting as it gets
While I do spend time on the internet, I believe I am selective enough to actually benefit from the sources I've learned to respect. Beau of the fifth column is one of these. Heather is another. I also Like cat videos. 😊 But I agree wholeheartedly with many of the points you raise. I no longer always carry my phone with me. I ignore many of the feeds Google sends me since so many of their headlines turn out to be click bait. And yes, I have recently returned to actual book reading since I now have time away from my screens. So thank you for your post and have a great day under that tree of yours. 🌳
Will, using social media is not a bad thing...if you compare notes, you can discerne the truth. But, social media platforms need to be more accountable for ferreting out foreign manipulators.
I utilize FB as an amazing educational resource. I follow a wide variety of pages that cover topics of art, architecture, history, gardening, astronomy, animal rescues, vintage ceramics, cooking, kayaking, photography, gardening, and more. Plus I can easily stay in touch with friends & relatives around the world. And yes, I also follow political analysts like Heather Cox Richardson & Jay Kuo., and read books , too. So you can be smug if you like, but you might be underestimating what you are also missing.
Same! I love seeing what far-flung family and friends are up to. The rest of my Facebook feed is animals, photography, recipes, gardening and art. People who call Facebook a cesspool are interacting with content that causes the algorithm to create a cesspool.
Yes, I think unfortunately many people just don't realize how positive & enriching FB can be. They also don't utilize their power to shape their feed by simply deleting content that is objectionable, and electing to view pages that are more uplifting. I have a network of many amazing, talented friends who also use FB as a positive resource, so I know you & I are not alone. 😊
Sunni, this is exactly how I feel
About social media. I have learned a lot about art, flowers, antiques, etc. The NatGeo site is great for following animals, archeology, and so much more! This is not to mention how much I love the photos sent by family and friends here and abroad.
I hear you, but without social media, we are left with mainstream media, which had been downplaying the threats, and both-sidsing the issues. I found HCR, Jay Kuo, Joyce Vance and others on social media. It's a two-sided coin--back in the day, we all had one news source (like Walter Cronkite), and we all believed what we were told, because that was pretty much all we had access to. That's kind of the problem now--lots of older folks watch and trust Fox News, because they assume it's a regular news channel, like the ones they had when they were younger. Misinformation is here to stay, whether it's in social media on on TV. It's our job to discern facts from propaganda. It's not easy!
Bullseye!
"Lots of older folks" listen to 2 minutes of Fox Entertainment and say: "WTF??" The disability goes deeper than age, imho.
Or, we can pull on our big girl panties and learn how to operate within the newest technology while protecting ourselves.
Yeah but we succeeded in building the tower where Nimrod failed. So there’s that.
They do not think it is their job to ethically manage what is posted, nor do they care to because they will lose money. It's a platform for making shareholders money, not a newspaper or a network. In that regard, hate, outrage, threats, blood, and sex sell, truth is not part of the algorithm.
I hear you and I’m on social media and it’s like the ridiculous things people write, I’m like is that a real person or a bot.... it feels like click baiting
I report the profiles that are clear bots and propaganda. Not that the platform does anything
with their references to "Russian Times & Epoch times"....meh
I am with you young person. FB made is really difficult to officially delete. Instagram is overwhelming. And journalism/truth was once more reliable. It’s easy to see the bias and propaganda through some news writers. Such a shame. Bring on book reading!
Refreshing to hear. There was a time when people from diverse backgrounds kept themselves actively informed. My father who never finished grade school and mother who got her GED at age forty got their information from our small town’s two local papers and nearby larger Scranton Times and Scranton Tribune. And in addition on Sunday on our way home from church we brought home two of the New York City newspapers. Now reputable resources like those above are going under and replaced by sensationalizing lazy “ journalism “ spreading disinformation and propaganda that gives us the pablum we want. In place of taking an active skeptical and critical approach to getting our information we become cynical and complacent
I too avoid social media. I read books, a few substack authors, and articles from trusted news organizations.
We urgently need government
regulation of the SM platforms that includes taking down the bad actors and their bots. Immediately. Everyday. They should not be able to cross the digital line and post their divisive propaganda on any SM platform.
The people who believe the propaganda you are talking about are not reading your post.
Very frightening to say the least. The key is to get families talking about politics, arguing out what they think American democracy is and means; that is, to re-engage in republican citizenship. NOTE: reference to a recent article in 'The Economist' deleted.🤔
https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6946424340980645888/ 🗽
By the way, Trump has called on the members of the 06jan21 Committee to be indicted for destroying evidence. I wonder if he is saying that because he wants to destroy evidence if he wins; that is, obstruct justice and blame it upon the special committee. 💔
EXTREMELY IMPORTANT regarding predictive model from The Economist (and others): Do not take it as an accurate assessment. IGNORE IT. Do not repeat it or share it with anyone.
The Economist model is going against the 538 Model (Biden ahead), the Moody's Model (Biden ahead), and the Economist's own polling averages (!!!) as of recently (Biden ahead). In 2022, that same model incorrectly predicted a bunch of losses that did not materialize. I'm not saying they built a poor model on purpose or anyone should be paranoid or only listen to the models that give you answers you like. But OMG people, I'm begging you, stop taking an individual poll or model as gospel, and don't assume that because something is shared more it is more true!
The idea that Republicans are winning against all historical precedent is a central - maybe THE central - component of their narrative right now. They are trading off the *perception* of having the upper hand because they don't actually have it. People like backing a perceived winner. This illusion of strength is essential to the rise of every authoritarian movement. Acting like pro-democracy candidates have "sobering" chances of success, when they have actually been on an almost unbroken winning streak nationally for six whole years, plays into those hands. We literally just had a special Congressional race in Ohio where the Dem overperformed by TWENTY points despite spending essentially no money. That doesn't happen if your party is weak and your standard-bearer is behind. It just doesn't.
In politics, you need to act like the presumptive champ even if you aren't ahead. To act like you are behind when you are actually ahead is simply inexcusable.
It shouldn't be surprising that the Economist, a publication that loves welfare for the rich, tax cuts, and anything that drives profits upward would support Cheetolini. They know he is a blithering idiot and a danger to the nation, but short-term, he promises to trash the economy once again with massive giveaways to corporations and the wealthy (i.e. their benefactors). Their opinions are less than worthless.
Interesting since with a full economy are the Dems corporate profits are doing "just fine" thank you!
You'd THINK that would be true but the model espoused by (it seems) almost every high-end business school is that profits should be taken as often and as much as can be done, without regard for long-term economic health or any kind of shared, profit-sustaining prosperity across the socio-economic spectrum. In 2016, I was convinced that Big Money would eschew the kind of instability that Trump represented. Now we know they will embrace any potential for rapacious gains, the future be damned.
I'm a chemist not an economist, so when I subscribed when I was avidly reading economics, I was appalled at the absolute tripe it published. Total bullsh!t. I guess you had to be fully indoctrinated in the Chicago school to go along with it. Actually a bit frightening if it represents what policy is based on.
Give me Stephanie Kelton any day.
I thought this in 2016. Up until Comey. This does not nullify your point, but in Texas, the fix is in. I hope that is not the case everywhere. And I support Beto and every Dem in Texas. As to optimism, as Winston said, of what use is it to be anything else. He knew how to go from loss to loss with no drop in enthusiasm. The fight is on all fronts. Assume nothing.
So very disappointed in Texas. Lived there so long, am a native born, and refuse to admit being from there now. Family homestead was in Bosque County where sundown laws (not officially) still exists in some small towns.
Loved it when I moved here from East coast. Even rural areas were sane, except for one sign I saw W of Ft Worth calling the UN a communist front. Otherwise OK until Rove came with the savior W in 1994. At least on my turf.
Rickey and Jeri,
I have been to the lone star state a few times for business. Have always rather liked its culture. But, from a distance, I am not crazy about the politics.
I miss friends and Texas food. Don't miss the dust storms of the south plains.
The politics used to be just fine. The change has been the result of lies, dirty tricks, and the most egregious actions. Bought by many who should have known better. And, of course, the macho guys I knew who bought an image that was total bullschitt.
You are right on, Jeri; starting in 1968. Though my parents were Midwestern moderate conservative supporting the ghastly war in Viêt Nam, I remember how sad my mother was when Senator Humphrey lost in 1968. 😢 Senator shady J.D. turns my stomach with his opportunism and he is an educated member of the cognitive under-class; much like the intellectuals flocking to the S.S. under Himmler. 🤢
1st DRAFT of this RESPONSE DELETED. I was getting, ahem, fussy. I will likely pull my initial response, too. Will has made some fine points and I need to chew the cud.
I liked your comment because of your suggestion that the "key is to get families talking about politics, arguing out what they think American democracy is and means; that is, to re-engage in republican citizenship." That is what's missing right now and badly needed. Nobody wants to talk about it. It's considered rude to even mention politics in certain circles. I have neighbors that ignore me. lol.
Fortunately, my neighbors are still talking to me even after we put up our Biden/Harris sign. The ONLY one 😔here in my neighborhood peninsula of nearly 800 people in Magaville, Florida .Come on HCR peeps, join us! 🪧 And while you’re at it ,sport a Biden/Harris t-shirt. I’ve been wearing one since Feb. and only ++ comments/discussions.👕🛒
As the weather heats up here in the land of “no climate change”, I’ve been encouraging my younger family members,with their frequent pool parties😎🍻, to have those conversations with friends.A GOP Admin that would restrict access to condoms and prioritize the rhythm method of birth control seems to get their attention. Fortunately they’re still talking to me too !
I’ve been using talking points from Andra Watkins, who has read and dissected Project 2025.⬇️
https://open.substack.com/pub/project2025istheocracy/p/reader-question-what-does-project?r=fqsxl&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
Just imagine the fun we could drum up if we were neighbors!! I appreciate your passion so much. Thank you for sticking your neck out there.
I have shirts like “Make Racism Wrong Again.” Nothing political as yet, but one coming up.
Your enthusiasm is infectious, Kathy.
People won’t talk in Texas, unless you are a cult nut.
It was former Representative Kinzinger (R-IL) who called for this in his closing remarks in one of the 06jan21 Committee hearings. ✌️EDIT: but, hey, I worked in government long enough to learn how to take credit when and where it is not due. 🤫
Ned, if you need another resource to review here on Substack that undergirds Will’s points, read Simon Rosenberg’s Hopium Chronicles. Rosenberg is admittedly a Democrat but his analysis of current polls includes a much broader scope of statistics and methodology than most - and he correctly predicted that there would be no “Red Wave” in 2022 - something nearly every mainstream media outlet was leading with (I’m looking at you, NYT!).
Polling is a social science. It is nigh on impossible to do it without skewing the results to match the politics of those doing the work. And Republican pollsters are constantly flooding the zone with polls that are more propaganda than science - which then leads to red wavy bs being pushed around as gospel truth.
The Economist has a perspective. That perspective is definitively Capitalist- with a capital C. They are less concerned with my wellbeing as an American than with the wellbeing of the stock and financial markets. My point is to read any poll with an eye towards the politics of the polling agency. Polls are a snapshot in time and a skewed one. Better to spend time helping get out the vote, something that actually can change the outcome of this election!
Thank you for the suggestion of Mr Rosenberg.
Funny thing is, I usually do not pay attention to polls. I decide how I am going to vote and say so, if provoked, asked, or giving in to my curmudgeonly ways.
Cud can be useful sometimes
😇
P.S. as a moderate conservative, long gone from the G.O.P., consider me not part of the 'new' right but the 'moo' right. 🤭🤫😊
This is a great point. THe control of the MSM has consolidated to a very few right wing nuts out there. I call them nuts, because they deny facts and insert their own beliefs in place of facts. Like Reaganomics being so great, racism no longer a problem, and taxing the wealthy not good.
Read my post about the Sinclair media group.
Sinclair is awful but what can we make of the NYT and WaPo embracing ridiculous memes about Biden's alleged mental decline over fair reporting about Trump's far more obvious lack of both intellect and stability?
These outlets are trying to play bothsidesim. Sadly, they are killing their reputation.
Sinclair owns the area CBS outlet here; spin masters to the max. I can't stand them.
Bill Moyers warned about Sinclair eons ago.
Judd Legum was on Alex Wagner last night talking about Sinclair’s overreaction to his report on corporate’s talking points re Biden’s age.
https://open.substack.com/pub/popularinformation/p/update-sinclair-lashes-out-calls?r=3hlhv&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
Maybe "owns" should be in quotes, I don't know, but the station's DC news segment is always from Slanted Sinclair. For example, in covering President Biden's executive order re the border, with right-wing criticism about "too little too late," the anchor person never mentioned that the reason the bipartisan deal fell through was because Trump ordered his Congressional toadies to kill it.
I didn't realize Sinclair owned some CBS stations. Overheard the "news" broadcast at 6 pm at somewhere other than my house, and was surprised to see a CBS logo at the bottom of the screen. In suburban DC, that was the only identifier. If there'd been an honest one, I would have backed off like I'd come across a rattler or copperhead. Full info please!
Given the idiotic rhetoric coming out of the so-called "paper of record", the New York Times, one has to wonder if they, too, are Russian operatives . . .
When hearing about this poll or that poll, I always say “How many people did they talk to” What is the demographic” “Who are they talking to?”……Well, recently I was at a friends house when his phone rang and it was a pollster. As i sat and listened to my friend answer questions……contrary to what i know to be true about him, he was not truthful with the pollster. He was yanking the guys chain with ridiculous answers and even said he will vote for Rump. Now, I have known this person a very long time and i know that would never happen!! So, It goes to show…..people do yank the chain of the pollsters so you cant even trust those.
That is also a good point. There was some discussion after the 2016 election that some people had misrepresented their positions in polls because they did not want to admit to supporting Trump.
Thank you Cal! Certainly food for thought and you are right.
Excellent points, Will!
I'm going to express the same meaning in different words.
Don't be naively optimistic, but whatever you do, don't be pessimistic because pessimism is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If I act based on the assumption I won't catch a fish, then I won't fish, and then I won't catch a fish.
Very good point about pessimism. I do despair at times. Still trying to figure out what the HELL happened to 'my' America of the Great Society with Big Business support.
Back then, moderate conservatives, like my parents, viewed themselves as part of a larger system that included liberals. Like the pick used by an ice climbers, liberals would throw the pick ahead (prudently with the influence of moderate liberals).
The moderate conservatives would pull the rest of us in by making the progressive policies fiscally sustainable; at times the further right conservatives might intervene when a policy had failed or was repudiated by the populace.
It does show that what made the W.W.II generation was not the Depression; that made the generation good. Not the war; that made the generation great. It is what those men and women did AFTER W.W.II through 1968 that made them the Greatest Generation.
But that is likely my naïve view. After all, I was a deeply informed intellectual at the age of eight back then.
By describing the conservative/progressive interaction pattern, you're accurately describing a specific manifestation of a frequently observed and frequently described phenomenon that I would argue has been recurring for thousands of generations since the origin of our species. So, I would say your view is not naive. Instead, it's in the right direction. Keep going, and you'll get there.
Alternatively, click on my profile link. I think I can save you a lot of time, energy, and attention.
Well said, Will.
Ned, I definitely agree.
He always accuses others of the crimes and misdeeds he himself has done, is doing, or plans to do.
His accusations are the ‘tell’ for his own approach.