Since right-wing insurrectionists stormed the Capitol on January 6 with the vague but violent idea of taking over the government, observers are paying renewed attention to the threat of right-wing violence in our midst.
On January 21, 2017, tens of millions of peaceful protesters gathered (not one single incidence of violence) and showed tremendous unity. Unfortunately, the pride of that day never stood a chance of raising the level of consciousness of a madman (or his enablers and followers) who had stolen his first election. Our government completely unraveled for the next 4 years. My non profound observation over the decades is that too often violence is the catalyst for change.
Our history of peaceful elections and transfer of power (without military assistance) have been a safe haven. Now, 10’s of thousands of troops (very necessary) occupy D.C. so the 46th president (fairly, legally elected) can take the oath of office without getting killed and to prevent any attempts at another coup. It is heartbreaking but is the reality few actually thought would be seen in modern times.
Maintaining a democracy and rule of law takes work by an educated, informed, and involved electorate. We must not ever forget; never again.
I participated in the Women’s March and several other marches in 2017. Absolute calm, peace and unity. The insurrectionists on January 6 never planned to march peacefully. They went to start a war and over-through the government. What upside down thinking to violently seek to overthrow a democratic election, because you want... a democracy.
Yes, those marches generated a universal sense of calm, peace, and unity. What happened on January 6th is beyond the pale. They were not protesters, they were anarchists and terrorists.
Yes, thank you! I want this point to continue to be raised and I am so concerned that those involved will just get a slap on the wrist... and we will have failed again to hold accountability. Rule of law must be reinstated.
Yes, Biden's impulse to bring the country together must not override the imperative to punish the insurrectionists, wherever they are: back home or in the halls of Congress.
I and my spouse, along with a close friend and her spouse, have attended several marches together since January 2017 - Women's Marches, Marches for Our Lives, advocacy marches with and for immigrants, and Earth Day marches - in our state's capitol. All were peaceful and well-attended. Those who ended up entering the Capitol Bldg here in Olympia did so with pre-arranged appointments with senators and representatives. No weapons, no injuries, no deaths.
Since the 2020 election armed pro-T**** marchers have clashed with counter-protestors multiple times, with at least one shooting by a T****ster. They stormed the Governor's Residence on January 6. There is a bill up for consideration in this legislative session to outlaw open carrying of firearms to protests, but as of today, it's still legal for these guys to parade the streets of our state capitol fully armed. On top of this unrest, the pandemic, the ongoing BLM protests, the increasing number of unhoused people living in tents close to downtown, it is going to take a long time for our little business district to revive. Every time I drive through downtown, I see another closed and boarded up storefront. As the outgoing POTUS used to be so fond of tweeting, SAD (although I mean it in such a different way).
I don't think there is anything more disheartening and frightening than a bunch of guys roaming the streets carrying what look like assault weapons openingly and brazenly. The only reason to do that is to intimidate and/or actually kill people. Yes, it is very sad.
How about everybody who doesn't have the slightest idea what an "anarchist" is just STOP calling everybody they don't like (or agree with) "anarchists." I've numbered myself an anarchist for about fifty years and I a pretty much on what every subscriber to this blog would consider that of "the angels." It is sloppy, lazy and intellectually vacuous to call everybody you don't like an "anarchist." I thought doing so was more or less from the playbook of the last president. But I guess not.
Am I missing something? Hasn’t anarchy historically always been associated with the left wing? My understanding is that anarchy is about hierarchy and a vision (Murray Bookchin comes to mind) that is very much anti-capitalist. I suppose libertarianism blurs the lines and anarchy might be thought of as a natural endpoint of libertarianism, but without social protections just becomes a power hierarchy where the rich may do as they wish and therefore constrain the freedom of the poor.
I just read back my comment and the one above that prompted it, and I realized that the reason things seem upside down is that I am still thinking in terms of people wanting to do what is right, as responsible people do. But those who attacked the Capitol on January 6 and their leader, Donald Trump, use conventional language to mean something entirely different. For instance, when I say democracy, I mean government by and for all the people; when Trump and his followers use that term, they mean government by and for select groups of people. I have learned recently that this deliberate misuse of terms is part of the psychological technique called gaslighting, which attempts to cause people to doubt their convictions. This is why I've been leaning on the dictionary and various other references a lot lately, including our Constitution. I feel an almost constant need to refer to standards. And when speaking, it seems terribly important to chose words carefully, to speak (or write) with precision, and to call out imprecision when encountered and make those speaking (or writing) define the terms they use.
Becky - I’ve been experiencing the same thing. I have until recently never enjoyed learning any kind of history. After a friend told me about Letters from an American, I became hooked! I have been devouring books about American history, particularly regarding the Civil War, but also books and articles about caste systems, political figures, behavioral psychology, neuroscience, and other topics, learning all I can to understand how we got here and how peoples’ beliefs came to be. The more I learn, the more I feel I am understanding people with opposing beliefs. Are there extremists? Yes. Are there non-extremists who are simply people who believe that their values and beliefs are being challenged? Yes. Bottom line is we are all people and like it or not we are all in this together. And we need to be able to speak and communicate using a common language. Words matter. How communication is framed matters. Civility matters.
I am reminded of how powerfully words can communicate in an instant (read George Lakoff, now I see examples everywhere!). Passed a billboard yesterday for an attorney. Headline: Injury Justice. With just two words this communication is framed to make you feel that if you were injured, you were wronged. And this lawyer is already on your side and will help you get what you deserve because you were clearly wronged by someone else. Truly powerful. Politicians have been using this kind of framing too. Think about that. Words matter. It is as you say (Becky) “it seems terribly important to chose (sic) words carefully.”
Yes words are powerful— interestingly though one of the first things I noticed about DT was his limited vocabulary. It’s like a backward sixth grader. Coming after Obama’s formidable language skills in terms of speaking and writing, what a thud.
Liz, I used to think Trump spoke in simplistic language to appeal to his base and deliberately avoided sophisticated language that was unfamiliar to them. When we discovered he reads almost nothing that doesn’t contain his own name embedded in it and stumbles over somewhat sophisticated words written for him on the TelePrompTer, his true illiteracy was revealed. “Think before you speak. Read before you think.” -Fran Lebowitz
That shocked me too, and it took me a while to realize that he doesn't give a rat's ass for me or people like me who try hard to paint clear ideas with words. But he does care for the kind of people who resent the kind of people who try hard to paint clear ideas with words, so he does just the opposite.
I often thought Obama was too good. I LOVE him, but if a newspaper should be written at a 5th grade level, then, when speaking to the public, our leaders should - without condescension - also communicate at that level.
Lena - I too have become fascinated with history thanks to Letters From An American. I also see that we ignore history to our peril. I wish I could agree that we are all in this together. Yes, civility matters, understanding the power of language matters. But it also matters to face the fact, as Richardson writes, that racism is deeply embedded in what may appear to be our most innocent beliefs - as in the white American brand of anti-socialist "liberty". Recent neuroscience research confirms that we all have the same physical brain but we can develop vastly different mind sets. I no longer know how to use language, civility, logic to bridge that gap. It's beyond me. Perhaps this almost coup will begin our long, slow awakening so that we, as a nation, may finally face our dark history.
Becky and Lena - Your comments reveal how important the teacher is in inspiring the student. If the teacher is fascinated by the topic, her students are likely to be also.
Though many of us are older than our professor, HCR, we are definitely her students. These discussions remind me of the better seminars in grad school. I would have stayed at university forever if it had been possible, but this forum keeps my mind from getting dull and fuzzed over with moss.
Yes, excellent advice. Read George Lakoff -- if you don't want to be framed...
If you really get down to the implications of his writing, that could be a liberating experience. Amost alll westerners, especially Americans, are self-incarcerated prisoners locked into their mental habits, concepts, blind beliefs, prejudices. Even the very word Liberty gets hammered into the bars of a mental prison -- for those whose cells still have windows.
"Liberty and justice for all” can be a frame to unite progressives. Our language and writing and speech would augment this frame with specifics, such as economic and racial justice, and justice for the earth, as we speak of universal health care, education and sustainability.
Thanks for your response, Lena. I'm with you on Heather's instigation to the study of history. Watching her FB chat on Jan 14, my husband (who takes time from work to watch) and I laughed with delight at her obvious delight at telling us real stories from the past. I've never seen anything like it. Just think if teachers in other disciplines could do the same!
You made me think of advertising and wonder how it fits in. You know, I often think of politics/current events as a huge, colorful graphic with bubbles and arrows, animated to show the bits that grow and shrink in relation to it all and to emphasize that one bit forces another this way or that. Something like Hans Rosling's animated statistics, or a Wait But Why cartoon set in motion. I can SEE that one thing influences another. Yesterday somebody recommended the book, Elmer Gantry, and I started to read it. Immediately there are Trump (Elmer) and Roger Stone (Elmer's pal, Jim).
I do wonder why we like to deceive each other. I don't. So why do some others?
Advertising used to “advertise” features and then later it was figured out that “benefits” are why people choose to purchase. And then psychology came into the advertising arena and ad execs learned that appealing to peoples’ sense of belonging (using Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs) could change a single purchase into a lifelong relationship which of course guaranteed corporate profits. Today people will intentionally spend more money on an identical product in terms of function and form simply because it has a particular name or logo on it. They want to “belong” to a certain group.
I’ve often recommended Lakoff, not so much because his ideas influence my own as because there's a correspondence. His central thesis about framing and the metaphor is one to which I'd given much thought decades earlier, when I was an eighteen-year old writing a treatise on painting. .
I was thinking at the time about various ways of relating to Nature, how we are in the world, how we see it, our place in it; and comparing painting in the Western tradition since the Renaissance with Chinese painting.
That may sound very esoteric, but it isn't really. Lakoff and many others speak of the influence of the 18th century Enlightenment, but there's much in our world view that goes back to the Renaissance, hundreds of years earlier.
Anyway, for Lakoff, I guess the starting point should be Metaphors We Live By, written with Mark Johnson. Reissued 2008.
Coming to the political implications of framing issues:
Moral Politics, How Liberals and Conservatives Think (3rd edition 2016)
And Don’t Think of an Elephant (revised edition, 2014
Well, I see you've been into these, but here's another useful short cut:
Good point Becky. I have frequently felt the effects of being gaslighted in conversation during the last four years. I too have demanded definitions during debate. Unfortunately without agreed upon definitions we aren’t really conversing. It is maddening if one really wants a conversation to end up just circling the point.
Logical argument doesn't work. We have to think of another way. In a past job in customer service, a teacher used the example of a runaway horse and carriage. Said rather than holding up your arm before it and shouting, "Stop!" you need to mount the horse (not sure how this was accomplished) and gradually slow it down. I understood this to mean that if you want to fix a customer's problem, you must listen to their argument carefully enough to understand how to "slow the horse down." You must be genuinely empathetic. This is very hard to do. I think something like this might work with Trump supporters, but it means facing my own biases and resentments, and so far I haven't been able to let them go well enough to get anywhere near that horse.
It is indeed hard to do. I have friends who are Republicans who are willing to engage in political conversations over lunch (pre-Covid). It is amazing to me that people I have so much in common with could have such opposing political views. But sitting across from them, one on one, allows for discussions that help to understand why this or that policy upsets them. In the end, it always comes back to them advocating for what they believe is best for themselves and their loved ones. Just like me. Perhaps it would be helpful to view others as “us” instead of “others”. Like when as a child in grade school teachers had us write letters to pen pals in foreign countries - in my case countries considered communist - so that we could see the humanity of those who lived there.
Also trying to read articles from sources supporting other views can expand your horizons as well as reading books with opposing viewpoints. For instance, I’m reading Blackout by Candace Owens to get a perspective on why some believe black people should abandon the Democrat Party. I’ll admit it isn’t easy to read because I disagree with her point of view, but I feel it is important to read so that I understand what the issues are - not her solutions. I believe I can think for myself. But I know I don’t know what someone else’s problems are. I’m a big reader, so this method helps me understand.
I haven’t re-read the Constitution recently, but I’ve sure done a lot of thinking about it. As Fiona Hill says in a January 11 op-ed on Politico (link on Jan. 17 HCR, easy to find), “Yes It Was A Coup,” American democracy has been stress tested. In a big way. I felt confident for four years, but still, who needs this level of anxiety. We are all about to breathe a very big sigh of relief. We passed the test, but boy, I have a lot of weaknesses been exposed.
Hi Roland! Someone made a comment on something I wrote which has taken me all the way back to HCR in January! Many of us have missed you on HCR's forum...hope your book writing is coming along!
Yes. The only thing he is good at is labeling in his upside-down world. Examples: trying to steal the election away from Biden while calling it “stop the steal”... degrading our country while calling it “make America great again”... professing to love the US military while trashing Gold Star families, allowing Russia to put bounties on our troops’ heads, and bending our military for his political optics.
It must be especially painful for you wonderful women who peacefully marched with your children and grandchildren, to now see such violent desecration of our Capitol, with the intent of killing elected officials and overturning our government. There couldn’t be a starker contrast.
My daughters are in their 30’s now. They have a clear perspective of when we were in DC marching several years back. We are a society now of where our mental health needs a lot of help.
I have marched too, and took 2 of my grandchildren to one. They participated by making signs beforehand and enjoyed the gathering of peaceful, like-minded people.
You have gotten to the root of the problem in (counting...) 13 words. This is a wound so deep and so wide that it cannot possibly heal itself. It's beyond time to stop going all Scarlett O'Hara, i.e., "I'll think about that tomorrow. Tomorrow is another day!" How now, right now?!
Though I have heard right-wing adherents claim that the US is not a democracy, but a republic. Again, a matter of definition; I think they’re making an argument for the US as an agglomeration of fifty states, with states’ rights superseding federal law. The claim against democracy (governance by the people through elected representatives) in favor of republicanism leads too easily to the idea of autocracy; it’s a bit of an apples and oranges comparison, and the fuzzy logic of the comparison makes it useful for dividing the electorate.
In reading this history of Right Wing illogic of ignoring laws against their taking of public lands for private use, I got a big picture of Medieval History (Also known as The Dark Ages), with little fiefdoms all over Europe run by local kings & barons with serfs being exploited.
I, too, marched in DC in 2017. A gathering of prescient patriots. I remember standing outside the fence that surrounded the inauguration grounds. Littered with the detritus of trumpists from the day before. Foreshadowing?
They absolutely did! I took pictures. Alas, this story did not make the news, but it SURE would have if I woulda tipped the first one over...I am quite sure the rest of them would have quickly fallen! A million women looking at padlock potties = definition of frustration. Dumped shot on Pennsylvania ave, yeah, that would have been news.
You can easily get good bolt cutters at Lowes or home depot. ( I like Home Depot because they require masks). Depending on the gauge of steel in the lock would determine how big of bolt cutters one would need. I think at least a foot of handle. Make sure you get the kind that has a mechanical advantage mechanism for really fast cutting/ease of use. And Practice on some locks so you know how to use them. ( I only say this, because, like with any tool, I've learned the hard way with the wrong tool or using it the wrong way.....many times.)
I’m with Pamsy. My first thought was bolt cutters. Fuck the assholes who put padlocks on those doors, it’s an easy fix. Porta potties do not come with padlocks. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a padlock on a porta-potty. Not ever. Some jerk had to buy padlocks and walk down that line and install them.
The story that was circulating was they were installed for the inauguration, not for us, so they were padlocked. There were rows and rows of hundreds if not 1000s.
I was there too. The locks had been busted off some of them. Do you remember how he made them put tape over the company's name on them? Don's Johns! Rotten person, terrible president, no sense of humor.
My daughters and 12 year old granddaughters accompanied me to the 2017 Women's March in Chicago, and to a March for our Lives demonstration ; I did not consider that we might be in danger, and we were not.
Agreed . . . we never felt unsafe! It was initially a passing thought when my friends and I headed into Boston (large crowds can be intimidating), but that immediately evaporated when we got closer and felt the positive energy (even though we all were revolted by trump) and goodwill in the crowds on the subways and streets. The police had a great time too!
I marched with a friend in a Women's March in Tucson AZ. It was wonderful, with women, men, children and dogs. And brilliant signs! But I have to admit I was on the alert, and checking the tops of buildings for men with guns. I thanked two of the policemen who were there to keep us safe. Their big smiles told me that they were unused to being thanked during an event like that.
I participated in the march in Boston in 2017. It was surreal in such a great way! trump and his followers have now tried to take from us the joy of the Biden/Harris Inauguration. However, even with no physical crowds, the barbed wire, and military protective presence, there is going to be a huge collective shout of joy once that oath of office is taken on January 20th!! It will be Zoomed around the world to an audience that far exceeds any other inauguration (with the possible exception of Obama's first)!
Using social media, New Yorkers began the nightly ritual of applauding and cheering health care workers at 7 pm every evening as a way to celebrate the efforts of those on the frontline of the Coronovirus pandemic. #ClapBecauseWeCare
Are there any physical distance/mask wearing, outside gatherings planned in each state to cheer Biden/Harris on and to be filmed as part of the inauguration?
I haven't heard of any in the greater Boston area. I think the potential for nutcases to appear throughout various cities is a deterrent for law abiding citizens to congregate. And, not least of all, given the surge in COVID cases (along with the more contagious strains now out there) I would think most (wise) people are not going to gather in crowds even outside and distanced.
I don’t know who the organIzers are, but I saw a Facebook post tonight for one in Denver. I commented, urging them to call it off.... as if anyone cares what I think. All the chatter on Twitter and Facebook is that there is violence planned in every Capitol this week. City and State governments want us to stay home. It’s a shame, but there will be other opportunities.
I was also at the crowd at the Boston 2017 "march" which was so huge it was actually a peaceful standing together. I was also among 6,000 at Faneuil Hall peacefully demonstrating to uphold the ACA. The latter was a particularly diverse crowd. In both local and national lawmakers addressed us. I had no fear of expressing my concerns or being in the crowd. My heart breaks that this is no longer possible, between the pandemic and fear of violence.
My experience as well! I travelled from California to Washington DC, where the marching route was ‘grid-locked’ by protesters, all peaceful! It was an amazing day especially knowing virtually every country on the planet in multiple cities was also protesting ... absolutely NO violence!!!
Yep: I was there too in KC with my brother and my then-partner. It was a wonderful day, but the thing that disturbed me a bit about these marches is how white they were. Many of the speakers in KC were BIPOC but the marchers themselves were not. This apparently was a national trend and discussions of how the Women's March has played out over the last four years exemplifies the struggle of the Women's Movement in general: it has always had trouble embracing diversity and inclusion; the leadership is mostly white, well-educated, and middle-class. Sigh. As a feminist this makes me a little nuts.
Well, as feminists we can look around for causes we believe in that are led by Black women, and support them. For now, for me, that means a monthly donation to Fair Fight. With Kamala Harris as VP (hooray!!!!), an administration committed to working for ALL the people, and room to push them in whatever we see as the best direction - I look forward to having to pick and choose between progressive causes to support.
The second time that I marched in Tucson, there was a large group from the Tonono O'odham nation with us, or we were with them... They were so proud to be there in their traditional clothing and musical instruments. The Vermont marches, where I live, were pretty much all-white due to our population.
My friends and I also noticed there weren’t a lot of women of color. I would not begin to know all the reasons why that happened but I think the marches that January helped ignite a wave of underserved communities and women being empowered to get elected and appointed to local, state, and federal positions where real change begins. Hillary Clinton, Michelle Obama and others have worked behind the scenes the past 4 years, to mentor women in the rough and tumble ways of politics and we need to keep that going.
My daughters and I were at the 2019 Women’s March in DC. I have participated in marches against injustices for 50 years. I loved being there. The energy fed off of everyone, man or woman, LGBTQ, all races, made me feel like I was being enveloped in understanding and love. It was awesome!
Too many Karens are out there for POC to trust white women. Their zealotry is often much worse than white men who are supremely comfortable and convinced they will do just fine no matter what changes--whereas the women are less secure.
Yeah I’m never going to use that expression. “Ivankas” works for me! My sister’s name is Karin, she is a sweetheart and a honey bunny and would never dream of taking advantage of anybody else with a power-play because she’s white. She would fit in really well right here on HCR.
After that day in 2017, American women spent the next 4 years saying ENOUGH! All the secrets we held to keep a toxic marriage, a toxic job, or a toxic government came bursting out as a testimony of our oppression. And as we had our day, we learned to listen to others who are systematically oppressed and ORGANIZED to change our fate.
That fate will not happen without pushback from those who feel they now have lost. These folks have used one method to maintain the upper hand - violence and terror.
The four of us (two MN friends, my young adult granddaughter, and I) invited Phyllis, an African American woman who didn't have a "posse" of her own, to join us. We five hung out together all day. Well, most of the day. Got separated 2:3 for a while, but reconnected eventually. Phyllis and I are still in touch periodically. Perhaps the makeup of our posse clouded my overall vision of diversity that day. What I do remember is having been kind of gobsmacked (in a good way) by the turnout of so many men for that march.
My only negative memory of the Women's March in 2017 was standing in line for around 40 minutes for a chance at a lone Porta potty and then discovering a long line of them on the Mall. Oh well, I got to talk to my friend Beth for a long time while we crossed our legs and danced!!
Dear Professor Cox Richardson (showing my respect for your work),
or dear Heather (showing my sentiments),
I am a new paying subscriber after having read the free version for some time, because "content must be paid by those who consume it" if we are to have a balanced information society.
I am an Austrian citizen, live on the edge of Vienna, with many ties to the United States of America, having lived there as an exchange student and having visited the country more than 80 times since then.
I engage in US politics and society because I see all around me in Europe and elsewhere that the US has a leading role in shaping global politics, global political and social values, global economic and environmental behavior and global culture.
Sometimes Twitter participants have told me "you are not from here, so stay out". That would be wrong, because just like US right-winger behavior (left, too, but less at this time) influences anti-democratic currents here in Europe, moderate and progressive US initiatives encourage similar initiatives in European society.
So, after having put my money where my mouth has been :-): Please continue your good work, Heather!
Yes, thanks for the reminder, Peter. I’m another European and, while you wrote, I’d not yet found the time to send in the remark that follows. Today’s letter gives much needed historical perspective to the current crisis, but…
All eyes in America are turned inward. All eyes throughout the world are turned on America. But this creates a dangerous diversion at a time when the effects of the imploding Trump presidency affect the entire world. And we should all know by now that, for dictators and gangster politicians, diversions are the very stuff of politics, distracting attention while they carry out whatever crimes they’ve been planning for the moment when opportunity knocks.
So Americans should not forget to keep an eye open for what’s happening elsewhere and to draw the necessary lessons, even where there’s no recourse to immediate remedial action.
Keep an eye on Moscow today. Endangered sclerotic regimes become more and more dangerous and more and more oppressive…
Yes, Peter Burnett. I would recommend the interview with Samantha Power, the incoming USAID Administrator, on Pod Save America last week. It's available on YouTube, I believe.
Yes, I've just looked. Thank heavens! What more can I say?
Except that reports of the activities of the We Wuz Robbed Party still sound more like the kind of news we might expect from the most world's newest and most unstable countries. And they're still talking of their bargain-basement Elmer Gantry and the Almighty in the same breath...
Only recently did I find that my contention about collective madness had been expressed better than I could ever put it by no less than Friedrich Nietzsche:
“In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule.”
This is worse than Covid 19, but it's the combination between virus and delirium that's far more troubling. As Samantha Power put it:
“You can be shocked but not be surprised at the same time”.
I believe this is one of the big sources of the divide in American politics. Those of us who believe we are citizens of Planet Earth first, and Americans second, have the ability to look at the larger picture. We believe in nations working together for solutions that plague the world. We believe that nations need to support one another in saving the planet, setting fair trade regulations, preventing wars and responding to pandemics. Those who believe in America First don't care about the rest of the world, aren't capable of connecting their actions to a big picture, view those outside their immediate circles as Other. They respond to flashpoint terms such as Globalism, Radical Left, Socialism, Freedom without reflection. They say they want strong leaders but worship strongmen. Their ideas about individual liberties leave no room for the behavioral norms of the larger community.
While my place of birth and my government issued passport declare that I am an American, I have always put my citizenship of Earth in first position. National and state borders are artificial. Our shared humanity is indisputable fact.
Brilliant! This is the Golden Rule. This is love. Thank you for such a concise post describing our spiritual pandemic. tRump has amplified discontent, not respect for anything but the big ME. I do hope everyone reading content like this also find time to offset their worldview by reading books and articles from leaders who support Lanita's view, a positive view of how it can be if we all get on with it! I'm currently reading a book by John Lewis. His always forward, peacefully towards the goal with buckets of common sense is awesome. Onward!
May I ask what Lewis book you are reading? I've been reading a lot of political memoirs/autobiographies/thought lately. Waiting for a couple by Stacey Abrams.
It would be really nice if the people all over the world show they care on Jan 20. The bigger the celebration, the better. We could use a little moral support over here and a little less looking on in horror and fear or glee at our failures and ignorance.
Thank you Mr. Prischl, it is good hearing perspectives from outside the US. Heather is truly a gift during these extraordinarily hard times, I too have recently subscribed because I want her to have help keeping the white supremacist tirades away from her work, along with administrative help with the posting process. Nancy, Richmond VA
Welcome, Peter. Some of the best perspectives of Americans strengths and weaknesses have traditionally come from those who straddle it with ties to other countries (e.g. Alexis de Tocqueville). IMO, America's richness is greatly enhanced by its visitors, new arrivals, and diversity.
Moedling and Schoenberg - wonderful! Our house is just one block from his, owned by the Arnold Schönberg Center and used for research, small performances and some museum rooms. Come back
Welcome, Peter. The fact that we are all citizens of the world is often overlooked. Lucky you, living in beautiful Vienna! So nice that lovely Heather brings us together.
Welcome! Yes, we are all in this together. Our words and actions have meaning - oftentimes in ways and places far beyond what we originally intended. Looking forward to the international perspective you can bring to this forum.
Welcome, Peter. Glad you have joined us and found what Heather is doing worth contributing to. We have more than a few in the community from countries outside the US and i enjoy reading their thoughts.
Yes - European and American hate groups nourish each other. We share the challenge of balancing individual rights with group rights, strengthening a democracy that supports freedom of all while prohibiting actions that take away the safety and rights of others. Even freedom of speech draws the line at shouting a false cry of "Fire!" that might cause lethal panic.
There are additional sides of this. Listen to Jenna Ryan after her arrest in connection with the insurrection in the capitol on January 6:
“I don’t feel a sense of shame or guilty from my heart. I feel like I was basically following my president. I was following what we were called to do. He asked us to fly there. He asked us to be there. So I was doing what he asked us to do,” Ryan said. “I do feel a little wronged in this situation because I’m a real estate agent and this has taken my company. This has taken my business. I am being slandered all over the internet, all over the world and all over the news and I’m just like a normal person.”
Somebody else, speaking in 1960 after their arrest in connection with World War 2:
“To sum it all up, I must say that I regret nothing. My heart was light and joyful in my work, because the decisions were not mine. Obeying an order was the most important thing to me. It could be that is in the nature of the German. I had to watch the madness of destruction, because I was one of the many horses pulling the wagon and couldn't escape left or right because of the will of the driver, I now feel called upon and have the desire to tell what happened. I was never an anti-Semite. … My sensitive nature revolted at the sight of corpses and blood... I personally had nothing to do with this. My job was to observe and report on it. I am certain, however, that those responsible for the murder of millions of Germans will never be brought to justice.”
(Of course the somebody else is Adolf Eichmann. This is an assemblage of quotes from comments he made over several years. I'm not saying the crimes of the insurrectionists in general, or Ryan in particular, are similar to Eichmann. But the mindset is frighteningly similar.)
I am not sure Trump will pardon Ryan or others from January 6 who are all saying in essence “I was invited to the Capital by the President”, given his own defense is that he didn’t say anything that incited the insurrection. Like so many others, these folks may be about to discover that Trump’s self-interest outweighs any sense of responsibility to people who have followed.
I guess tRump could be stupid enough to grant pardons to some of these thugs, but it seems to me that if he does he admits he incited them in some way. Wouldn't look good at his impeachment trial as the pardons could be used against him.
Pardons are coming. Knowing Trump, he’ll announce a large list of pardons on Wednesday morning right before the inauguration, just to draw attention away from Biden. I hope the media doesn’t take the bait.
It seems to me any pardon(s) by Trump will open a constitutional can of worms.
Legal/Constitutional questions; (My own)
-Is a person eligable for a presidential pardon prior to being convicted or even indicted? Can that pardon be "post-dated" beyond the president's term in office? -Does an impeached but not yet tried in the Senate president retain the power to pardon anybody?
-Can an an impeached but not yet tried in the Senate president pardon a person prior to (or even after) that person's conviction, if that person's aledged criminal behavior was directly involved in the actions that got the president impeached?
-Can an impeached etc. president, prior to any trial, pardon himself, and is that not, per se, a confession of guilt?
The pardon power reads "except in cases of Impeachment." That has been taken to mean it cannot be used to undo an impeachment. I would argue - for what it's worth, as I'm not a lawyer - that it also means that a president impeached for an offense cannot pardon others involved in the same offense.
And, let’s hope that sharp lawyers will argue that everyone he is planning to pardon is involved in the same charges as what is in the articles of impeachment. The presidential pardon was never intended to be used by a corrupt president (who incited a violent overthrow of the government!) to a “get out of jail free” for himself and those who were complicit. Not that we would ever expect anything different, but trump has not even gone through the appropriate pardon process We need some pit bull lawyers to step up to the plate and not let this go!
An impeachment is analogous to an indictment, and we still believe someone is innocent until proven guilty. The answer to all your questions, I think, is yes, except maybe the post-dated one. The pardon power is pretty broad. Self-pardon is another question. And that one would have to be tried by the courts, and I think we all think it will be, unless Trump resigns and Pence pardons him.
It's more analogous to a negative job evaluation. It's not a criminal justice proceeding. No one goes to jail or pays a fine. (Hopefully, with Trump, that comes after he's been axed.) When you come right down to the constitutional legalities as I understand them, all you really need to fire the President are the votes in the House and Senate.
But I think your argument is the correct one; an impeached president retains all powers and responsibilities until a conviction in the Senate makes him no longer the President.
To me, these 2 people who feel no guilt are examples of shirking the responsibility of thinking about your own actions and doing the right thing regardless of what the “herd” does or they are told to do by another. To me, these people exhibit a “lemming” mentality.
Following orders is no excuse. Ryan still made a choice to act on her perception of what she heard. OtherS heard those same words, and chose not to "storm the Capitol".
Very similar indeed! I remember Eichmann’s trial vividly, watching it on my parents tv, in black and white. I was young but it always stuck in my head. I agree with your summary.
They have been radicalized and still don’t understand. They will live the rest of their lives this way. Broken humans unable to contribute anything positive or rational to their national debate.
What I find most upsetting is the collective American weak mindedness that allowed a sociopathic grifter to not only win the presidency, but to turn the entire country upside down with little if any real resistance from the citizenry and more importantly, the people we elect and trust to protect the country.
It seems that many individuals experiencing economic woes and listening to evasive politicians became desperate for some good news. Then a messenger appeared, one they saw as caring about their needs. They were hoping for rescue and ready to believe. Trump has a talent for lying, and his lies worked on these very stressed individuals.
That's my take on this sad situation in our country.
Ralph makes and important point: "many individuals experienced economic woes..." I don't believe either party was addressing the economic issues that affected ordinary Americans. I think the Dems (and the traditional Repubs as well) failed miserably to respond to the issues of struggling Americans, or even explain why government is of value. But the non-traditional, circus show, appealed crudely to those concerns and won the election of 2016. If the country can ever be returned to its "norms" it seems essential that the needs of working people must be vigorously addressed. Corporate money-lords and wealthy donors have controlled which political issues are addressed and they do not care about workers. They care about profits. To imagine that it took 20 years to even have a $15 an hour federal wage PROPOSED by a President is a good indicator of how one-sided our politics have been and why so many don't trust the government to do the very thing that allows ordinary people to thrive.
And even if the Biden/Harris administration is able to shepherd the $15/hr federal minimum through both houses, $15/hr is no longer a living wage in many parts of the country. Let's say take-home at that wage is about $1900/mo. In my small city, it's hard to find even a studio apartment for under $1,000. That leaves $900 for food, transportation, clothing, health care, utilities. A single person might be able to do it, but anyone with children can't. Certainly, it isn't possible to save at that rate.
Do you think that people with economic woes really have the kind of money to pay for gas to travel, to buy little hats and flags that say trump on them? I don’t think so. I don’t think these people are desperate economically I think they’ve been deceived. Honestly I think these people are greedy for attention, uneducated. People looking for an exciting party! Something that gives them an identity. Yes, this is a gross generalization not all of these people are this way. There are educated people. People that believe they are Christians. It is this group I don’t understand.
How could CT not see the light? Reading about Jackie Robinson 1964 is really something courageous. Robinson had the voice of Rockefeller & Nixon, but learned to despise Goldwater's divisive game plan.
People in my state are taking screen shots on those who posted on SM travelling to DC, Staying at the DT Hotel, and sending to the FBI. Reminds me of the Oligarchs and European princes at the Battel of Bull Run.
His showmanship continues to delude his followers. It is an essential power of a cult leader to continually mesmerize his followers with the beauty of "the future" he will provide. It is just ahead! For Trump, if it hadn't been for "those losers," he could have accomplished so much more, "and if re-elected, I will."
Like followers in an end-of-the-world cult. No matter how many times the Great Leader's forecast fails, they are still ready to jump on the next end-is-nigh prediction.
Interesting...My college-age son says that one reason people like the Republigcan message is because it is more positive (We're great, we're the best, we're gonna be greater) while the Democrat message is negative (We have a lot of problems we need to fix, fix, fix).
Good point. One side with its head in the ground as the stampede approaches denying the oncoming charge; the other shouting "look out!" but is perceived as "negative." I wonder how the deniers run their homes, families, businesses?
Just loaded the dryer and wondered if BOTH sides want to "fix" things but they want to fix very different things. And each side considers the other side "negative." Laundry thoughts. 😊
Right, they are more positive about our own country and more negative about everyone else. On the other hand they always seem to be in critique mode, never in a "that's good" kind of mood.
The Republicans I know who are financially stable (and white Christians) are strongly military and executives. They don't know any life other than "I give orders. I follow nobody. I've been trained to do this." I fear there is now way to reach these types. And they personify the happiest people on earth.
You can wrap your head around it when you understand that it’s all about race and has been from the beginning. Only 0.1% of the electorate is concerned about “redistribution of wealth” (as the obscenely wealthy call it). That doesn’t affect elections. What most white people are concerned about, now, in FDR’s time, in Eisenhower’s time, and in all periods of American history, is fair treatment of black people. They are against it. Sixty percent of white people oppose fair treatment of black people. At all levels and in all domains. Economic, judicial, and social. When you understand that, you can wrap your head around American politics.
You are absolutely right, Rex, about the foundational effects of pervasive racism on people's political and social views. But don't overlook the abilities of the 0.1% to use allegations about economic "unfairness"--makers v. takers, welfare cheats, etc.--to draw support for what ends up being redistribution of wealth upwards.
Yes, you’re right, Tom. The wealthy don’t have the votes themselves but have outsized influence, the tax system is regressive, and the entire economy overwhelmingly favors the already wealthy. About the only optimism I can offer is that the 60% of white people who favor oppression of Americans with non-European ancestors was 80% in the 1950s and 90% before that, but it doesn’t matter which direction it goes from here because by 2040 (if we get that far), the rest if us will be able to easily outvote them.
I don't know how you do it, Heather. Almost every day, a balanced, thoroughly informed, beautifully written, incisive analysis of the working out of history in some sphere of the US. This time it is the evolution of "thought" up to the point of claims that "the federal government must turn over all public lands to the states to open them to private development" by a series of unhinged, bigoted, desperately selfish men (they were all men) from Rush Limbaugh and before, to Bundy, and now the loons who rushed the Capitol. And now want to be pardoned.
Your lesson for today is so important, and the world may be in a state to listen to it, put so luminously. I guess there is space to think about the Fairness Doctrine again, this time in the guise of a Federal Communications Commission (or whoever) for regulation of communication platforms and the enforcement of editorial accountability.
Reading your words from afar (the UK) there is one aspect of the history that you unfold that seems to be understated. In Europe - in our crowded countries - we have always given weight to the contribution of community to problems and to their solutions. In the wide-open spaces of America, you have always elevated the status of the single man fighting alone for his family, and downplayed, even disparaged, the role of collective solutions.
To me, the lot of them - Weaver, Koresh, McVeigh, Bundy (Cliven and Ammon) - all stand in the tradition of John Wayne and High Noon. They would say "proud tradition". I would say - dangerous. They would say "patriotic". I would say - undermining the nation by elevating private greed.
Of that lot, Koresh is, maybe, a different case. The role of cult psychology in a nation that fed on camp meetings and exclusive group self-identification is another story you should tell one day, and I recommend one of my compatriots to you: Fanny Trollope, Anthony's mother, The Domestic Manners of the Americans, 1832.
In both of her books I have read—The History of the Republican Party and How the South Won the Civil War—Heather spends much time framing America’s cowboy image, one Reagan used to great advantage during his campaigns. She does this especially in the latter, which is her most recent. If you haven’t read them, I can’t recommend them highly enough. I also have her book Wounded Knee; it’s in my queue. (Incidentally, the great James Baldwin also wrote about the myth of America, which included—among many things—these cowboy western films and images.)
Really enjoying how the south won...I didn’t know it was Buckley who birthed the advice, Republicans should give up on reasoned debate and should have a strategy appealing to passions and emotions.
Ultra-individualism – the notion that each human being is a discrete, totally autonomous entity -- is a poisonous absurdity, one which when used as it has been in America and too many other countries, transforms citizens into free radicals infesting the body social and politic. It is commonly accompanied by the equally spurious idea (one also held by otherwise intelligent Inquisitors, frightened of their helpless prisoners) that by destroying the bodies of “bad” individuals, you destroy what they stand for. This doesn’t wipe out evil, it perpetuates it.
Think back to 1945. Those of us who grew up in postwar Europe did not expect any form of Nazism to arise from the ashes; but the evil that men did lived on, not always underground, in an endless chain reaction. It still lives, befouling all it touches: the innocent, the unborn, the miraculous planet we live on.
History is not dead people, dead ideas, in a dead past. The past is all too present. In us. Among us.
"the evil that men did lives on" . . . unless active, intelligent steps are taken to break the cycle. And even then, it is one step forward and likely another step back later. Look at the legacy of Mandela's magic of reconciliation in South Africa. But, I am still convinced that the overall direction can be forward. Have you come across a book by the Dutch Historian Rutger Bregman, "Humankind"? Well worth reading, and optimistic. Also this interview with Bregman will amuse you:
On January 21, 2017, tens of millions of peaceful protesters gathered (not one single incidence of violence) and showed tremendous unity. Unfortunately, the pride of that day never stood a chance of raising the level of consciousness of a madman (or his enablers and followers) who had stolen his first election. Our government completely unraveled for the next 4 years. My non profound observation over the decades is that too often violence is the catalyst for change.
Our history of peaceful elections and transfer of power (without military assistance) have been a safe haven. Now, 10’s of thousands of troops (very necessary) occupy D.C. so the 46th president (fairly, legally elected) can take the oath of office without getting killed and to prevent any attempts at another coup. It is heartbreaking but is the reality few actually thought would be seen in modern times.
Maintaining a democracy and rule of law takes work by an educated, informed, and involved electorate. We must not ever forget; never again.
I participated in the Women’s March and several other marches in 2017. Absolute calm, peace and unity. The insurrectionists on January 6 never planned to march peacefully. They went to start a war and over-through the government. What upside down thinking to violently seek to overthrow a democratic election, because you want... a democracy.
Yes, those marches generated a universal sense of calm, peace, and unity. What happened on January 6th is beyond the pale. They were not protesters, they were anarchists and terrorists.
Seditionists. It is a felony. Twenty years.
Yes, thank you! I want this point to continue to be raised and I am so concerned that those involved will just get a slap on the wrist... and we will have failed again to hold accountability. Rule of law must be reinstated.
Yes, Biden's impulse to bring the country together must not override the imperative to punish the insurrectionists, wherever they are: back home or in the halls of Congress.
Absolutely, Pamsy! .....Missed you yesterday!
I and my spouse, along with a close friend and her spouse, have attended several marches together since January 2017 - Women's Marches, Marches for Our Lives, advocacy marches with and for immigrants, and Earth Day marches - in our state's capitol. All were peaceful and well-attended. Those who ended up entering the Capitol Bldg here in Olympia did so with pre-arranged appointments with senators and representatives. No weapons, no injuries, no deaths.
Since the 2020 election armed pro-T**** marchers have clashed with counter-protestors multiple times, with at least one shooting by a T****ster. They stormed the Governor's Residence on January 6. There is a bill up for consideration in this legislative session to outlaw open carrying of firearms to protests, but as of today, it's still legal for these guys to parade the streets of our state capitol fully armed. On top of this unrest, the pandemic, the ongoing BLM protests, the increasing number of unhoused people living in tents close to downtown, it is going to take a long time for our little business district to revive. Every time I drive through downtown, I see another closed and boarded up storefront. As the outgoing POTUS used to be so fond of tweeting, SAD (although I mean it in such a different way).
I don't think there is anything more disheartening and frightening than a bunch of guys roaming the streets carrying what look like assault weapons openingly and brazenly. The only reason to do that is to intimidate and/or actually kill people. Yes, it is very sad.
How about everybody who doesn't have the slightest idea what an "anarchist" is just STOP calling everybody they don't like (or agree with) "anarchists." I've numbered myself an anarchist for about fifty years and I a pretty much on what every subscriber to this blog would consider that of "the angels." It is sloppy, lazy and intellectually vacuous to call everybody you don't like an "anarchist." I thought doing so was more or less from the playbook of the last president. But I guess not.
Am I missing something? Hasn’t anarchy historically always been associated with the left wing? My understanding is that anarchy is about hierarchy and a vision (Murray Bookchin comes to mind) that is very much anti-capitalist. I suppose libertarianism blurs the lines and anarchy might be thought of as a natural endpoint of libertarianism, but without social protections just becomes a power hierarchy where the rich may do as they wish and therefore constrain the freedom of the poor.
Yes, upside down thinking. Like Trump wanting to be reelected when he has no interest in running the country.
I just read back my comment and the one above that prompted it, and I realized that the reason things seem upside down is that I am still thinking in terms of people wanting to do what is right, as responsible people do. But those who attacked the Capitol on January 6 and their leader, Donald Trump, use conventional language to mean something entirely different. For instance, when I say democracy, I mean government by and for all the people; when Trump and his followers use that term, they mean government by and for select groups of people. I have learned recently that this deliberate misuse of terms is part of the psychological technique called gaslighting, which attempts to cause people to doubt their convictions. This is why I've been leaning on the dictionary and various other references a lot lately, including our Constitution. I feel an almost constant need to refer to standards. And when speaking, it seems terribly important to chose words carefully, to speak (or write) with precision, and to call out imprecision when encountered and make those speaking (or writing) define the terms they use.
Becky - I’ve been experiencing the same thing. I have until recently never enjoyed learning any kind of history. After a friend told me about Letters from an American, I became hooked! I have been devouring books about American history, particularly regarding the Civil War, but also books and articles about caste systems, political figures, behavioral psychology, neuroscience, and other topics, learning all I can to understand how we got here and how peoples’ beliefs came to be. The more I learn, the more I feel I am understanding people with opposing beliefs. Are there extremists? Yes. Are there non-extremists who are simply people who believe that their values and beliefs are being challenged? Yes. Bottom line is we are all people and like it or not we are all in this together. And we need to be able to speak and communicate using a common language. Words matter. How communication is framed matters. Civility matters.
I am reminded of how powerfully words can communicate in an instant (read George Lakoff, now I see examples everywhere!). Passed a billboard yesterday for an attorney. Headline: Injury Justice. With just two words this communication is framed to make you feel that if you were injured, you were wronged. And this lawyer is already on your side and will help you get what you deserve because you were clearly wronged by someone else. Truly powerful. Politicians have been using this kind of framing too. Think about that. Words matter. It is as you say (Becky) “it seems terribly important to chose (sic) words carefully.”
Yes words are powerful— interestingly though one of the first things I noticed about DT was his limited vocabulary. It’s like a backward sixth grader. Coming after Obama’s formidable language skills in terms of speaking and writing, what a thud.
Liz, I used to think Trump spoke in simplistic language to appeal to his base and deliberately avoided sophisticated language that was unfamiliar to them. When we discovered he reads almost nothing that doesn’t contain his own name embedded in it and stumbles over somewhat sophisticated words written for him on the TelePrompTer, his true illiteracy was revealed. “Think before you speak. Read before you think.” -Fran Lebowitz
That shocked me too, and it took me a while to realize that he doesn't give a rat's ass for me or people like me who try hard to paint clear ideas with words. But he does care for the kind of people who resent the kind of people who try hard to paint clear ideas with words, so he does just the opposite.
I often thought Obama was too good. I LOVE him, but if a newspaper should be written at a 5th grade level, then, when speaking to the public, our leaders should - without condescension - also communicate at that level.
Lena - I too have become fascinated with history thanks to Letters From An American. I also see that we ignore history to our peril. I wish I could agree that we are all in this together. Yes, civility matters, understanding the power of language matters. But it also matters to face the fact, as Richardson writes, that racism is deeply embedded in what may appear to be our most innocent beliefs - as in the white American brand of anti-socialist "liberty". Recent neuroscience research confirms that we all have the same physical brain but we can develop vastly different mind sets. I no longer know how to use language, civility, logic to bridge that gap. It's beyond me. Perhaps this almost coup will begin our long, slow awakening so that we, as a nation, may finally face our dark history.
Becky and Lena - Your comments reveal how important the teacher is in inspiring the student. If the teacher is fascinated by the topic, her students are likely to be also.
Though many of us are older than our professor, HCR, we are definitely her students. These discussions remind me of the better seminars in grad school. I would have stayed at university forever if it had been possible, but this forum keeps my mind from getting dull and fuzzed over with moss.
Yes, excellent advice. Read George Lakoff -- if you don't want to be framed...
If you really get down to the implications of his writing, that could be a liberating experience. Amost alll westerners, especially Americans, are self-incarcerated prisoners locked into their mental habits, concepts, blind beliefs, prejudices. Even the very word Liberty gets hammered into the bars of a mental prison -- for those whose cells still have windows.
"Liberty and justice for all” can be a frame to unite progressives. Our language and writing and speech would augment this frame with specifics, such as economic and racial justice, and justice for the earth, as we speak of universal health care, education and sustainability.
Thanks for your response, Lena. I'm with you on Heather's instigation to the study of history. Watching her FB chat on Jan 14, my husband (who takes time from work to watch) and I laughed with delight at her obvious delight at telling us real stories from the past. I've never seen anything like it. Just think if teachers in other disciplines could do the same!
You made me think of advertising and wonder how it fits in. You know, I often think of politics/current events as a huge, colorful graphic with bubbles and arrows, animated to show the bits that grow and shrink in relation to it all and to emphasize that one bit forces another this way or that. Something like Hans Rosling's animated statistics, or a Wait But Why cartoon set in motion. I can SEE that one thing influences another. Yesterday somebody recommended the book, Elmer Gantry, and I started to read it. Immediately there are Trump (Elmer) and Roger Stone (Elmer's pal, Jim).
I do wonder why we like to deceive each other. I don't. So why do some others?
Advertising used to “advertise” features and then later it was figured out that “benefits” are why people choose to purchase. And then psychology came into the advertising arena and ad execs learned that appealing to peoples’ sense of belonging (using Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs) could change a single purchase into a lifelong relationship which of course guaranteed corporate profits. Today people will intentionally spend more money on an identical product in terms of function and form simply because it has a particular name or logo on it. They want to “belong” to a certain group.
Thank you for the George Lakoff reference. I checked him out. Which of his books are you referring to?
Sorry I took so long to respond to you.
I’ve often recommended Lakoff, not so much because his ideas influence my own as because there's a correspondence. His central thesis about framing and the metaphor is one to which I'd given much thought decades earlier, when I was an eighteen-year old writing a treatise on painting. .
I was thinking at the time about various ways of relating to Nature, how we are in the world, how we see it, our place in it; and comparing painting in the Western tradition since the Renaissance with Chinese painting.
That may sound very esoteric, but it isn't really. Lakoff and many others speak of the influence of the 18th century Enlightenment, but there's much in our world view that goes back to the Renaissance, hundreds of years earlier.
Anyway, for Lakoff, I guess the starting point should be Metaphors We Live By, written with Mark Johnson. Reissued 2008.
Coming to the political implications of framing issues:
Moral Politics, How Liberals and Conservatives Think (3rd edition 2016)
And Don’t Think of an Elephant (revised edition, 2014
Well, I see you've been into these, but here's another useful short cut:
Why it Matters How We Frame the Environment: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/17524030903529749
I just downloaded a sample of "Don't Think of an Elephant."
Good point Becky. I have frequently felt the effects of being gaslighted in conversation during the last four years. I too have demanded definitions during debate. Unfortunately without agreed upon definitions we aren’t really conversing. It is maddening if one really wants a conversation to end up just circling the point.
Logical argument doesn't work. We have to think of another way. In a past job in customer service, a teacher used the example of a runaway horse and carriage. Said rather than holding up your arm before it and shouting, "Stop!" you need to mount the horse (not sure how this was accomplished) and gradually slow it down. I understood this to mean that if you want to fix a customer's problem, you must listen to their argument carefully enough to understand how to "slow the horse down." You must be genuinely empathetic. This is very hard to do. I think something like this might work with Trump supporters, but it means facing my own biases and resentments, and so far I haven't been able to let them go well enough to get anywhere near that horse.
What if your "bias" is truth?
It is indeed hard to do. I have friends who are Republicans who are willing to engage in political conversations over lunch (pre-Covid). It is amazing to me that people I have so much in common with could have such opposing political views. But sitting across from them, one on one, allows for discussions that help to understand why this or that policy upsets them. In the end, it always comes back to them advocating for what they believe is best for themselves and their loved ones. Just like me. Perhaps it would be helpful to view others as “us” instead of “others”. Like when as a child in grade school teachers had us write letters to pen pals in foreign countries - in my case countries considered communist - so that we could see the humanity of those who lived there.
Also trying to read articles from sources supporting other views can expand your horizons as well as reading books with opposing viewpoints. For instance, I’m reading Blackout by Candace Owens to get a perspective on why some believe black people should abandon the Democrat Party. I’ll admit it isn’t easy to read because I disagree with her point of view, but I feel it is important to read so that I understand what the issues are - not her solutions. I believe I can think for myself. But I know I don’t know what someone else’s problems are. I’m a big reader, so this method helps me understand.
It would be interesting to have stats on how many have re-read, or read for the first time, our Constitution since T**** came into office.
I haven’t re-read the Constitution recently, but I’ve sure done a lot of thinking about it. As Fiona Hill says in a January 11 op-ed on Politico (link on Jan. 17 HCR, easy to find), “Yes It Was A Coup,” American democracy has been stress tested. In a big way. I felt confident for four years, but still, who needs this level of anxiety. We are all about to breathe a very big sigh of relief. We passed the test, but boy, I have a lot of weaknesses been exposed.
Hi Roland! Someone made a comment on something I wrote which has taken me all the way back to HCR in January! Many of us have missed you on HCR's forum...hope your book writing is coming along!
warmly,
Penelope
Yes. The only thing he is good at is labeling in his upside-down world. Examples: trying to steal the election away from Biden while calling it “stop the steal”... degrading our country while calling it “make America great again”... professing to love the US military while trashing Gold Star families, allowing Russia to put bounties on our troops’ heads, and bending our military for his political optics.
That’s not true. He and his cohorts are running the country......right into the ground, just to make Biden’s job harder.
I too marched proudly, flanked by my two daughters.
It must be especially painful for you wonderful women who peacefully marched with your children and grandchildren, to now see such violent desecration of our Capitol, with the intent of killing elected officials and overturning our government. There couldn’t be a starker contrast.
My daughters are in their 30’s now. They have a clear perspective of when we were in DC marching several years back. We are a society now of where our mental health needs a lot of help.
I have marched too, and took 2 of my grandchildren to one. They participated by making signs beforehand and enjoyed the gathering of peaceful, like-minded people.
I too marched, along with my wife. Our Democratic Congressman enthusiastically addressed the large crowd, in Napa, CA., at that time
I love that men marched with the women. Thank you.
He is my rep too.
One of my sons participated too - but we couldn't find each other in the crowds and cell phone service was cut off.
I was at the Women's March too - I was overwhelmed with good feeling there. Not a single instance of violence that I know of. Such a contrast!!
*overthrow* We need an edit option.;-)
But do they truly want a democracy? Aren't democracy and white supremacy antithetical?
You have gotten to the root of the problem in (counting...) 13 words. This is a wound so deep and so wide that it cannot possibly heal itself. It's beyond time to stop going all Scarlett O'Hara, i.e., "I'll think about that tomorrow. Tomorrow is another day!" How now, right now?!
Exactly.
Though I have heard right-wing adherents claim that the US is not a democracy, but a republic. Again, a matter of definition; I think they’re making an argument for the US as an agglomeration of fifty states, with states’ rights superseding federal law. The claim against democracy (governance by the people through elected representatives) in favor of republicanism leads too easily to the idea of autocracy; it’s a bit of an apples and oranges comparison, and the fuzzy logic of the comparison makes it useful for dividing the electorate.
In reading this history of Right Wing illogic of ignoring laws against their taking of public lands for private use, I got a big picture of Medieval History (Also known as The Dark Ages), with little fiefdoms all over Europe run by local kings & barons with serfs being exploited.
I, too, marched in DC in 2017. A gathering of prescient patriots. I remember standing outside the fence that surrounded the inauguration grounds. Littered with the detritus of trumpists from the day before. Foreshadowing?
I was outraged when we came upon the rows and rows of 1000s of portapotties that day of the March. Every one of them was locked shut with a padlock!
I thought, how hateful! Let's tip these suckers over! My grown daughter's cooler head prevailed and she talked me down...
Her words, "Mom, this is supposed to be PEACEFUL!"
They did that with the portapotties? Jeez, they would make a hyena blush with embarrassment to think they were both mammals...
They absolutely did! I took pictures. Alas, this story did not make the news, but it SURE would have if I woulda tipped the first one over...I am quite sure the rest of them would have quickly fallen! A million women looking at padlock potties = definition of frustration. Dumped shot on Pennsylvania ave, yeah, that would have been news.
Shit, shit!
You can easily get good bolt cutters at Lowes or home depot. ( I like Home Depot because they require masks). Depending on the gauge of steel in the lock would determine how big of bolt cutters one would need. I think at least a foot of handle. Make sure you get the kind that has a mechanical advantage mechanism for really fast cutting/ease of use. And Practice on some locks so you know how to use them. ( I only say this, because, like with any tool, I've learned the hard way with the wrong tool or using it the wrong way.....many times.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bolt_cutter#:~:text=A%20bolt%20cutter%2C%20sometimes%20called,maximize%20leverage%20and%20cutting%20force.&text=Center%20cut%20has%20the%20blades,two%20faces%20of%20the%20blade.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwaukee-14-in-Bolt-Cutter-With-5-16-in-Max-Cut-Capacity-48-22-4014/303182026
I’m with Pamsy. My first thought was bolt cutters. Fuck the assholes who put padlocks on those doors, it’s an easy fix. Porta potties do not come with padlocks. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a padlock on a porta-potty. Not ever. Some jerk had to buy padlocks and walk down that line and install them.
Yup, it was really a strange and insulting sight. We all decided next peaceful march we would put a nice pair of boltcutters into our day pack!
And unfortunately they would arrest you for carrying a potentially deadly weapon!
Dirty tricks are not nice. Roger Stone is not nice.
Bolt cutters? I’m not an anarchistic but when you gotta go, you gotta go!
So lame to do that
I was also at the march but never encountered locked portapotties unless they were occupied. Maybe there was a benign reason for padlocking some?
The story that was circulating was they were installed for the inauguration, not for us, so they were padlocked. There were rows and rows of hundreds if not 1000s.
I ran across a line of them on the Mall as we were heading for the Metro to go home. They weren't locked then but maybe someone had found a key?
I was there too. The locks had been busted off some of them. Do you remember how he made them put tape over the company's name on them? Don's Johns! Rotten person, terrible president, no sense of humor.
Glad to hear some were busted open!
My daughters and 12 year old granddaughters accompanied me to the 2017 Women's March in Chicago, and to a March for our Lives demonstration ; I did not consider that we might be in danger, and we were not.
Agreed . . . we never felt unsafe! It was initially a passing thought when my friends and I headed into Boston (large crowds can be intimidating), but that immediately evaporated when we got closer and felt the positive energy (even though we all were revolted by trump) and goodwill in the crowds on the subways and streets. The police had a great time too!
I marched with a friend in a Women's March in Tucson AZ. It was wonderful, with women, men, children and dogs. And brilliant signs! But I have to admit I was on the alert, and checking the tops of buildings for men with guns. I thanked two of the policemen who were there to keep us safe. Their big smiles told me that they were unused to being thanked during an event like that.
You are correct: "Maintaining a democracy and rule of law takes work by an educated, informed, and involved electorate."
I add to this list of requirements for democracy a vibrant middle class that allows the majority to earn a "good" living.
Income inequality is the greatest threat to democracy today.
And that income equality includes race. They are intertwined, in my view.
Well said. I was in one of those marches. NOTHING like what I witnessed on January 6.
I participated in the march in Boston in 2017. It was surreal in such a great way! trump and his followers have now tried to take from us the joy of the Biden/Harris Inauguration. However, even with no physical crowds, the barbed wire, and military protective presence, there is going to be a huge collective shout of joy once that oath of office is taken on January 20th!! It will be Zoomed around the world to an audience that far exceeds any other inauguration (with the possible exception of Obama's first)!
We should all step outside and beat on pots and pans and blow horns at the moment, no matter where we are.
Using social media, New Yorkers began the nightly ritual of applauding and cheering health care workers at 7 pm every evening as a way to celebrate the efforts of those on the frontline of the Coronovirus pandemic. #ClapBecauseWeCare
https://www.npr.org/2020/04/10/832131816/every-night-new-york-city-salutes-its-health-care-workers
I have some noisemakers from NY Eve.
Yes I’m bracing for joy— please.
Are there any physical distance/mask wearing, outside gatherings planned in each state to cheer Biden/Harris on and to be filmed as part of the inauguration?
I haven't heard of any in the greater Boston area. I think the potential for nutcases to appear throughout various cities is a deterrent for law abiding citizens to congregate. And, not least of all, given the surge in COVID cases (along with the more contagious strains now out there) I would think most (wise) people are not going to gather in crowds even outside and distanced.
Thank you for your assessment and words of wisdom, Janet!
I don’t know who the organIzers are, but I saw a Facebook post tonight for one in Denver. I commented, urging them to call it off.... as if anyone cares what I think. All the chatter on Twitter and Facebook is that there is violence planned in every Capitol this week. City and State governments want us to stay home. It’s a shame, but there will be other opportunities.
My neighborhood is quiet as a tomb.
I was also at the crowd at the Boston 2017 "march" which was so huge it was actually a peaceful standing together. I was also among 6,000 at Faneuil Hall peacefully demonstrating to uphold the ACA. The latter was a particularly diverse crowd. In both local and national lawmakers addressed us. I had no fear of expressing my concerns or being in the crowd. My heart breaks that this is no longer possible, between the pandemic and fear of violence.
My experience as well! I travelled from California to Washington DC, where the marching route was ‘grid-locked’ by protesters, all peaceful! It was an amazing day especially knowing virtually every country on the planet in multiple cities was also protesting ... absolutely NO violence!!!
Yep: I was there too in KC with my brother and my then-partner. It was a wonderful day, but the thing that disturbed me a bit about these marches is how white they were. Many of the speakers in KC were BIPOC but the marchers themselves were not. This apparently was a national trend and discussions of how the Women's March has played out over the last four years exemplifies the struggle of the Women's Movement in general: it has always had trouble embracing diversity and inclusion; the leadership is mostly white, well-educated, and middle-class. Sigh. As a feminist this makes me a little nuts.
Well, as feminists we can look around for causes we believe in that are led by Black women, and support them. For now, for me, that means a monthly donation to Fair Fight. With Kamala Harris as VP (hooray!!!!), an administration committed to working for ALL the people, and room to push them in whatever we see as the best direction - I look forward to having to pick and choose between progressive causes to support.
Maybe the next Women's March should call on Stacey Abrams to do some recruiting...
The second time that I marched in Tucson, there was a large group from the Tonono O'odham nation with us, or we were with them... They were so proud to be there in their traditional clothing and musical instruments. The Vermont marches, where I live, were pretty much all-white due to our population.
Wow, that’s a beautiful image.
My friends and I also noticed there weren’t a lot of women of color. I would not begin to know all the reasons why that happened but I think the marches that January helped ignite a wave of underserved communities and women being empowered to get elected and appointed to local, state, and federal positions where real change begins. Hillary Clinton, Michelle Obama and others have worked behind the scenes the past 4 years, to mentor women in the rough and tumble ways of politics and we need to keep that going.
My daughters and I were at the 2019 Women’s March in DC. I have participated in marches against injustices for 50 years. I loved being there. The energy fed off of everyone, man or woman, LGBTQ, all races, made me feel like I was being enveloped in understanding and love. It was awesome!
Too many Karens are out there for POC to trust white women. Their zealotry is often much worse than white men who are supremely comfortable and convinced they will do just fine no matter what changes--whereas the women are less secure.
Someone recently suggested that we shift the label from "Karens" to "Ivankas!" <3
The label “Karen” is so unfair to all the caring women with that name. I second this motion!
I am all for that!!!
Yeah I’m never going to use that expression. “Ivankas” works for me! My sister’s name is Karin, she is a sweetheart and a honey bunny and would never dream of taking advantage of anybody else with a power-play because she’s white. She would fit in really well right here on HCR.
words well spoken.
After that day in 2017, American women spent the next 4 years saying ENOUGH! All the secrets we held to keep a toxic marriage, a toxic job, or a toxic government came bursting out as a testimony of our oppression. And as we had our day, we learned to listen to others who are systematically oppressed and ORGANIZED to change our fate.
That fate will not happen without pushback from those who feel they now have lost. These folks have used one method to maintain the upper hand - violence and terror.
The four of us (two MN friends, my young adult granddaughter, and I) invited Phyllis, an African American woman who didn't have a "posse" of her own, to join us. We five hung out together all day. Well, most of the day. Got separated 2:3 for a while, but reconnected eventually. Phyllis and I are still in touch periodically. Perhaps the makeup of our posse clouded my overall vision of diversity that day. What I do remember is having been kind of gobsmacked (in a good way) by the turnout of so many men for that march.
Yes, what a beautiful day that was. Celebrated in cities around the world, it was a joyous celebration of what’s possible.
My only negative memory of the Women's March in 2017 was standing in line for around 40 minutes for a chance at a lone Porta potty and then discovering a long line of them on the Mall. Oh well, I got to talk to my friend Beth for a long time while we crossed our legs and danced!!
Dear Professor Cox Richardson (showing my respect for your work),
or dear Heather (showing my sentiments),
I am a new paying subscriber after having read the free version for some time, because "content must be paid by those who consume it" if we are to have a balanced information society.
I am an Austrian citizen, live on the edge of Vienna, with many ties to the United States of America, having lived there as an exchange student and having visited the country more than 80 times since then.
I engage in US politics and society because I see all around me in Europe and elsewhere that the US has a leading role in shaping global politics, global political and social values, global economic and environmental behavior and global culture.
Sometimes Twitter participants have told me "you are not from here, so stay out". That would be wrong, because just like US right-winger behavior (left, too, but less at this time) influences anti-democratic currents here in Europe, moderate and progressive US initiatives encourage similar initiatives in European society.
So, after having put my money where my mouth has been :-): Please continue your good work, Heather!
-Peter Prischl-
Moedling (Vienna), Austria
Yes, thanks for the reminder, Peter. I’m another European and, while you wrote, I’d not yet found the time to send in the remark that follows. Today’s letter gives much needed historical perspective to the current crisis, but…
All eyes in America are turned inward. All eyes throughout the world are turned on America. But this creates a dangerous diversion at a time when the effects of the imploding Trump presidency affect the entire world. And we should all know by now that, for dictators and gangster politicians, diversions are the very stuff of politics, distracting attention while they carry out whatever crimes they’ve been planning for the moment when opportunity knocks.
So Americans should not forget to keep an eye open for what’s happening elsewhere and to draw the necessary lessons, even where there’s no recourse to immediate remedial action.
Keep an eye on Moscow today. Endangered sclerotic regimes become more and more dangerous and more and more oppressive…
Yes, Peter Burnett. I would recommend the interview with Samantha Power, the incoming USAID Administrator, on Pod Save America last week. It's available on YouTube, I believe.
Oops - that's Pod Save the World.
Yes, I've just looked. Thank heavens! What more can I say?
Except that reports of the activities of the We Wuz Robbed Party still sound more like the kind of news we might expect from the most world's newest and most unstable countries. And they're still talking of their bargain-basement Elmer Gantry and the Almighty in the same breath...
Only recently did I find that my contention about collective madness had been expressed better than I could ever put it by no less than Friedrich Nietzsche:
“In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule.”
This is worse than Covid 19, but it's the combination between virus and delirium that's far more troubling. As Samantha Power put it:
“You can be shocked but not be surprised at the same time”.
Thank you for your viewpoint. It’s important, today, to be a citizen of the world-no matter our physical location. ❤️🤍💙
I believe this is one of the big sources of the divide in American politics. Those of us who believe we are citizens of Planet Earth first, and Americans second, have the ability to look at the larger picture. We believe in nations working together for solutions that plague the world. We believe that nations need to support one another in saving the planet, setting fair trade regulations, preventing wars and responding to pandemics. Those who believe in America First don't care about the rest of the world, aren't capable of connecting their actions to a big picture, view those outside their immediate circles as Other. They respond to flashpoint terms such as Globalism, Radical Left, Socialism, Freedom without reflection. They say they want strong leaders but worship strongmen. Their ideas about individual liberties leave no room for the behavioral norms of the larger community.
While my place of birth and my government issued passport declare that I am an American, I have always put my citizenship of Earth in first position. National and state borders are artificial. Our shared humanity is indisputable fact.
Brilliant! This is the Golden Rule. This is love. Thank you for such a concise post describing our spiritual pandemic. tRump has amplified discontent, not respect for anything but the big ME. I do hope everyone reading content like this also find time to offset their worldview by reading books and articles from leaders who support Lanita's view, a positive view of how it can be if we all get on with it! I'm currently reading a book by John Lewis. His always forward, peacefully towards the goal with buckets of common sense is awesome. Onward!
May I ask what Lewis book you are reading? I've been reading a lot of political memoirs/autobiographies/thought lately. Waiting for a couple by Stacey Abrams.
I also rented for $2.00 this video about Mr. Lewis - also very good. https://www.amazon.com/gp/video/detail/B087QQQVKC/ref=atv_dp_share_cu_r
Across That Bridge - A Vision for change and the future of America. I have the audio book version. I'm about 90 minutes in. Very inspiring.
Thank you for the recommendations.
Hear Hear 👏 applause applause 👏
It would be really nice if the people all over the world show they care on Jan 20. The bigger the celebration, the better. We could use a little moral support over here and a little less looking on in horror and fear or glee at our failures and ignorance.
I WILL show my support on January 20, Martha!
Thank you, from the bottom of my heart.
Thank you Mr. Prischl, it is good hearing perspectives from outside the US. Heather is truly a gift during these extraordinarily hard times, I too have recently subscribed because I want her to have help keeping the white supremacist tirades away from her work, along with administrative help with the posting process. Nancy, Richmond VA
Thank you, Nancy, for helping Heather with this!
Welcome, Peter. Some of the best perspectives of Americans strengths and weaknesses have traditionally come from those who straddle it with ties to other countries (e.g. Alexis de Tocqueville). IMO, America's richness is greatly enhanced by its visitors, new arrivals, and diversity.
Welcome to this community and this exchange of ideas!
I believe an international perspective is necessary today.
I recall be at a research library in Berlin summer 2008 when another patron, recognizing I am American, said to me "Obama! Obama! Obama!"
I visited Moedling in 2006 -- a lovely town and the home of musician Arnold Schoenberg!
Moedling and Schoenberg - wonderful! Our house is just one block from his, owned by the Arnold Schönberg Center and used for research, small performances and some museum rooms. Come back
Yes! I visited both Schoenberg's Moedling House and the Center at Schwartzenbergplatz. Hope to return someday!
Willkommen von einer Kölner.
No wonder I like you and your commentary.
Welcome, Peter. The fact that we are all citizens of the world is often overlooked. Lucky you, living in beautiful Vienna! So nice that lovely Heather brings us together.
Welcome! Yes, we are all in this together. Our words and actions have meaning - oftentimes in ways and places far beyond what we originally intended. Looking forward to the international perspective you can bring to this forum.
Welcome, Peter. Glad you have joined us and found what Heather is doing worth contributing to. We have more than a few in the community from countries outside the US and i enjoy reading their thoughts.
Yes - European and American hate groups nourish each other. We share the challenge of balancing individual rights with group rights, strengthening a democracy that supports freedom of all while prohibiting actions that take away the safety and rights of others. Even freedom of speech draws the line at shouting a false cry of "Fire!" that might cause lethal panic.
Welcome Peter— the more the merrier
Welcome Peter, it is wonderful to read your opinion.
Welcome! Please continue to share a global perspective, as that is what is needed now.
Welcome Peter. We In America need to hear that what takes place here can have both a negative or positive influence on the global stage.
Welcome from the geographical heart of America in Kansas City.
ahhh, the home of Sharice Davids (KS) or Emanuel Cleaver (MO) - congratulations on both accounts!
Been there, liked it!
There are additional sides of this. Listen to Jenna Ryan after her arrest in connection with the insurrection in the capitol on January 6:
“I don’t feel a sense of shame or guilty from my heart. I feel like I was basically following my president. I was following what we were called to do. He asked us to fly there. He asked us to be there. So I was doing what he asked us to do,” Ryan said. “I do feel a little wronged in this situation because I’m a real estate agent and this has taken my company. This has taken my business. I am being slandered all over the internet, all over the world and all over the news and I’m just like a normal person.”
Somebody else, speaking in 1960 after their arrest in connection with World War 2:
“To sum it all up, I must say that I regret nothing. My heart was light and joyful in my work, because the decisions were not mine. Obeying an order was the most important thing to me. It could be that is in the nature of the German. I had to watch the madness of destruction, because I was one of the many horses pulling the wagon and couldn't escape left or right because of the will of the driver, I now feel called upon and have the desire to tell what happened. I was never an anti-Semite. … My sensitive nature revolted at the sight of corpses and blood... I personally had nothing to do with this. My job was to observe and report on it. I am certain, however, that those responsible for the murder of millions of Germans will never be brought to justice.”
(Of course the somebody else is Adolf Eichmann. This is an assemblage of quotes from comments he made over several years. I'm not saying the crimes of the insurrectionists in general, or Ryan in particular, are similar to Eichmann. But the mindset is frighteningly similar.)
I am not sure Trump will pardon Ryan or others from January 6 who are all saying in essence “I was invited to the Capital by the President”, given his own defense is that he didn’t say anything that incited the insurrection. Like so many others, these folks may be about to discover that Trump’s self-interest outweighs any sense of responsibility to people who have followed.
I guess tRump could be stupid enough to grant pardons to some of these thugs, but it seems to me that if he does he admits he incited them in some way. Wouldn't look good at his impeachment trial as the pardons could be used against him.
Someone is suggesting tRump is considering blanket pardons for all of the patriots involved.
In a truly corrupt development,
Prospect of Pardons in Final Days Fuels Market to Buy Access to Trump
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/17/us/politics/trump-pardons.html?referringSource=articleShare
Yes Trump has always been all about himself and his brand. It’s sad so many people bought into his pathetic jargon.
And Jenna Ryan is so deeply convinced of her "calling" she's already calling for a pardon.
Pardons are coming. Knowing Trump, he’ll announce a large list of pardons on Wednesday morning right before the inauguration, just to draw attention away from Biden. I hope the media doesn’t take the bait.
It seems to me any pardon(s) by Trump will open a constitutional can of worms.
Legal/Constitutional questions; (My own)
-Is a person eligable for a presidential pardon prior to being convicted or even indicted? Can that pardon be "post-dated" beyond the president's term in office? -Does an impeached but not yet tried in the Senate president retain the power to pardon anybody?
-Can an an impeached but not yet tried in the Senate president pardon a person prior to (or even after) that person's conviction, if that person's aledged criminal behavior was directly involved in the actions that got the president impeached?
-Can an impeached etc. president, prior to any trial, pardon himself, and is that not, per se, a confession of guilt?
The pardon power reads "except in cases of Impeachment." That has been taken to mean it cannot be used to undo an impeachment. I would argue - for what it's worth, as I'm not a lawyer - that it also means that a president impeached for an offense cannot pardon others involved in the same offense.
I forgot about that! (Not a lawyer either.) I can’t tell you how much I hope you are right.
I hope ur right
And, let’s hope that sharp lawyers will argue that everyone he is planning to pardon is involved in the same charges as what is in the articles of impeachment. The presidential pardon was never intended to be used by a corrupt president (who incited a violent overthrow of the government!) to a “get out of jail free” for himself and those who were complicit. Not that we would ever expect anything different, but trump has not even gone through the appropriate pardon process We need some pit bull lawyers to step up to the plate and not let this go!
All great questions; I fear the answers.
An impeachment is analogous to an indictment, and we still believe someone is innocent until proven guilty. The answer to all your questions, I think, is yes, except maybe the post-dated one. The pardon power is pretty broad. Self-pardon is another question. And that one would have to be tried by the courts, and I think we all think it will be, unless Trump resigns and Pence pardons him.
The lame duck still has wings. I can’t believe he’s not out already. Too risky
"An impeachment is analogous to an indictment..."
It's more analogous to a negative job evaluation. It's not a criminal justice proceeding. No one goes to jail or pays a fine. (Hopefully, with Trump, that comes after he's been axed.) When you come right down to the constitutional legalities as I understand them, all you really need to fire the President are the votes in the House and Senate.
But I think your argument is the correct one; an impeached president retains all powers and responsibilities until a conviction in the Senate makes him no longer the President.
The scary thing is that Fake 45 may just give it to her! I think we simply cannot be surprised what his evilness will reveal in the next few days.
You got that right
To me, these 2 people who feel no guilt are examples of shirking the responsibility of thinking about your own actions and doing the right thing regardless of what the “herd” does or they are told to do by another. To me, these people exhibit a “lemming” mentality.
As well as white privilege, entitlement and arrogance.
Following orders is no excuse. Ryan still made a choice to act on her perception of what she heard. OtherS heard those same words, and chose not to "storm the Capitol".
But, soldiers are tried and convicted, correct? Being brainless is no excuse for breaking the law.
And of course these folks just wind up sounding like followers of Marshall Applewhite waiting for the approach of the Hale-Bopp comet.
Very similar indeed! I remember Eichmann’s trial vividly, watching it on my parents tv, in black and white. I was young but it always stuck in my head. I agree with your summary.
They have been radicalized and still don’t understand. They will live the rest of their lives this way. Broken humans unable to contribute anything positive or rational to their national debate.
Wow thanks
What I find most upsetting is the collective American weak mindedness that allowed a sociopathic grifter to not only win the presidency, but to turn the entire country upside down with little if any real resistance from the citizenry and more importantly, the people we elect and trust to protect the country.
It's embarrasing.
It seems that many individuals experiencing economic woes and listening to evasive politicians became desperate for some good news. Then a messenger appeared, one they saw as caring about their needs. They were hoping for rescue and ready to believe. Trump has a talent for lying, and his lies worked on these very stressed individuals.
That's my take on this sad situation in our country.
Ralph makes and important point: "many individuals experienced economic woes..." I don't believe either party was addressing the economic issues that affected ordinary Americans. I think the Dems (and the traditional Repubs as well) failed miserably to respond to the issues of struggling Americans, or even explain why government is of value. But the non-traditional, circus show, appealed crudely to those concerns and won the election of 2016. If the country can ever be returned to its "norms" it seems essential that the needs of working people must be vigorously addressed. Corporate money-lords and wealthy donors have controlled which political issues are addressed and they do not care about workers. They care about profits. To imagine that it took 20 years to even have a $15 an hour federal wage PROPOSED by a President is a good indicator of how one-sided our politics have been and why so many don't trust the government to do the very thing that allows ordinary people to thrive.
And even if the Biden/Harris administration is able to shepherd the $15/hr federal minimum through both houses, $15/hr is no longer a living wage in many parts of the country. Let's say take-home at that wage is about $1900/mo. In my small city, it's hard to find even a studio apartment for under $1,000. That leaves $900 for food, transportation, clothing, health care, utilities. A single person might be able to do it, but anyone with children can't. Certainly, it isn't possible to save at that rate.
...and still it took 20 and it's only "proposal"! And if enacted it won't be a living wage! Exactly.
Do you think that people with economic woes really have the kind of money to pay for gas to travel, to buy little hats and flags that say trump on them? I don’t think so. I don’t think these people are desperate economically I think they’ve been deceived. Honestly I think these people are greedy for attention, uneducated. People looking for an exciting party! Something that gives them an identity. Yes, this is a gross generalization not all of these people are this way. There are educated people. People that believe they are Christians. It is this group I don’t understand.
That's true, but I was only referring to the election. These seditionists are drawn from a different distribution.
Buses were arranged for them to get there and back.
Supposedly, Clarence Thomas’ wife helped arrange that. And yet, he caused yet another black man to be executed this week. SCOTUS is tainted, badly.
How could CT not see the light? Reading about Jackie Robinson 1964 is really something courageous. Robinson had the voice of Rockefeller & Nixon, but learned to despise Goldwater's divisive game plan.
Such a good question. I just can’t understand how a person of color gets enamored with a party that despises them.
This fact about Thomas’ wife, which I believe is well substantiated, is absolutely outrageous.
https://www.aol.com/news/clarence-thomas-wife-supported-rioters-231103492.html
The Racialization is pervasive. "ah, Houston, we have a problem."
Horrid.
And private jets from all over the country. The Well off bring their friends to the insurrection
Grrrrr
People in my state are taking screen shots on those who posted on SM travelling to DC, Staying at the DT Hotel, and sending to the FBI. Reminds me of the Oligarchs and European princes at the Battel of Bull Run.
Watch this develop. NBC news reports several stories of DT supporters getting invited on wealthier supporters private jets to participate.
Reporting today and yesterday points to fund raisers on Go Gund Me and an enormous transfer of bitcoin from an address in France.
But ... he did not deliver on those expectations and yet MORE of them voted for him last November! It is that that confounds me.
His showmanship continues to delude his followers. It is an essential power of a cult leader to continually mesmerize his followers with the beauty of "the future" he will provide. It is just ahead! For Trump, if it hadn't been for "those losers," he could have accomplished so much more, "and if re-elected, I will."
Like followers in an end-of-the-world cult. No matter how many times the Great Leader's forecast fails, they are still ready to jump on the next end-is-nigh prediction.
Scientists are still baffled!
Interesting...My college-age son says that one reason people like the Republigcan message is because it is more positive (We're great, we're the best, we're gonna be greater) while the Democrat message is negative (We have a lot of problems we need to fix, fix, fix).
Good point. One side with its head in the ground as the stampede approaches denying the oncoming charge; the other shouting "look out!" but is perceived as "negative." I wonder how the deniers run their homes, families, businesses?
Just loaded the dryer and wondered if BOTH sides want to "fix" things but they want to fix very different things. And each side considers the other side "negative." Laundry thoughts. 😊
Right, they are more positive about our own country and more negative about everyone else. On the other hand they always seem to be in critique mode, never in a "that's good" kind of mood.
Hmmm this makes sense
The Republicans I know who are financially stable (and white Christians) are strongly military and executives. They don't know any life other than "I give orders. I follow nobody. I've been trained to do this." I fear there is now way to reach these types. And they personify the happiest people on earth.
If you haven’t already read it, check out Heather’s letter from March 28th .... very interesting.
Thanks for pointing me to that letter. That is from before I was a subscriber... um, substacker.
Most upsetting yes, repugnatins enabling.
I agree completely and I can’t wrap my head around it.
You can wrap your head around it when you understand that it’s all about race and has been from the beginning. Only 0.1% of the electorate is concerned about “redistribution of wealth” (as the obscenely wealthy call it). That doesn’t affect elections. What most white people are concerned about, now, in FDR’s time, in Eisenhower’s time, and in all periods of American history, is fair treatment of black people. They are against it. Sixty percent of white people oppose fair treatment of black people. At all levels and in all domains. Economic, judicial, and social. When you understand that, you can wrap your head around American politics.
You are absolutely right, Rex, about the foundational effects of pervasive racism on people's political and social views. But don't overlook the abilities of the 0.1% to use allegations about economic "unfairness"--makers v. takers, welfare cheats, etc.--to draw support for what ends up being redistribution of wealth upwards.
Yes, you’re right, Tom. The wealthy don’t have the votes themselves but have outsized influence, the tax system is regressive, and the entire economy overwhelmingly favors the already wealthy. About the only optimism I can offer is that the 60% of white people who favor oppression of Americans with non-European ancestors was 80% in the 1950s and 90% before that, but it doesn’t matter which direction it goes from here because by 2040 (if we get that far), the rest if us will be able to easily outvote them.
I don't know how you do it, Heather. Almost every day, a balanced, thoroughly informed, beautifully written, incisive analysis of the working out of history in some sphere of the US. This time it is the evolution of "thought" up to the point of claims that "the federal government must turn over all public lands to the states to open them to private development" by a series of unhinged, bigoted, desperately selfish men (they were all men) from Rush Limbaugh and before, to Bundy, and now the loons who rushed the Capitol. And now want to be pardoned.
Your lesson for today is so important, and the world may be in a state to listen to it, put so luminously. I guess there is space to think about the Fairness Doctrine again, this time in the guise of a Federal Communications Commission (or whoever) for regulation of communication platforms and the enforcement of editorial accountability.
Reading your words from afar (the UK) there is one aspect of the history that you unfold that seems to be understated. In Europe - in our crowded countries - we have always given weight to the contribution of community to problems and to their solutions. In the wide-open spaces of America, you have always elevated the status of the single man fighting alone for his family, and downplayed, even disparaged, the role of collective solutions.
To me, the lot of them - Weaver, Koresh, McVeigh, Bundy (Cliven and Ammon) - all stand in the tradition of John Wayne and High Noon. They would say "proud tradition". I would say - dangerous. They would say "patriotic". I would say - undermining the nation by elevating private greed.
Of that lot, Koresh is, maybe, a different case. The role of cult psychology in a nation that fed on camp meetings and exclusive group self-identification is another story you should tell one day, and I recommend one of my compatriots to you: Fanny Trollope, Anthony's mother, The Domestic Manners of the Americans, 1832.
Thank you, again, Heather.
In both of her books I have read—The History of the Republican Party and How the South Won the Civil War—Heather spends much time framing America’s cowboy image, one Reagan used to great advantage during his campaigns. She does this especially in the latter, which is her most recent. If you haven’t read them, I can’t recommend them highly enough. I also have her book Wounded Knee; it’s in my queue. (Incidentally, the great James Baldwin also wrote about the myth of America, which included—among many things—these cowboy western films and images.)
Really enjoying how the south won...I didn’t know it was Buckley who birthed the advice, Republicans should give up on reasoned debate and should have a strategy appealing to passions and emotions.
Thank you. I have it, by the magic of Kindle.
We need to keep the good stuff, like HCR and Wikipedia and junk the bad stuff. How do you legislate for good intention?
Thank you too, Bob.
Ultra-individualism – the notion that each human being is a discrete, totally autonomous entity -- is a poisonous absurdity, one which when used as it has been in America and too many other countries, transforms citizens into free radicals infesting the body social and politic. It is commonly accompanied by the equally spurious idea (one also held by otherwise intelligent Inquisitors, frightened of their helpless prisoners) that by destroying the bodies of “bad” individuals, you destroy what they stand for. This doesn’t wipe out evil, it perpetuates it.
Think back to 1945. Those of us who grew up in postwar Europe did not expect any form of Nazism to arise from the ashes; but the evil that men did lived on, not always underground, in an endless chain reaction. It still lives, befouling all it touches: the innocent, the unborn, the miraculous planet we live on.
History is not dead people, dead ideas, in a dead past. The past is all too present. In us. Among us.
"the evil that men did lives on" . . . unless active, intelligent steps are taken to break the cycle. And even then, it is one step forward and likely another step back later. Look at the legacy of Mandela's magic of reconciliation in South Africa. But, I am still convinced that the overall direction can be forward. Have you come across a book by the Dutch Historian Rutger Bregman, "Humankind"? Well worth reading, and optimistic. Also this interview with Bregman will amuse you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_nFI2Zb7qE&t=6s