338 Comments

No surprise re" Xi. Glad to see Garland and DOJ publically take a stand against those who would try to undermine the USA. At the same time, I have full faith that Biden will try to "negotiate" with Putin re: Ukraine. That "negotiation should be no less than every Russian soldier leaving Ukraine AND Crimea, war crimes charges filed and pursued, and financial reparations paid by Russia to rebuild what Putin has tried to destroy.

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So delighted that Speaker Pelosi was invited to the conference.

“Pelosi said she was proud to meet with Stefanchuk ‘to convey the Congress’ bipartisan and bicameral commitment to the fight being waged by the heroic people of Ukraine…. As Putin escalates his appalling atrocities against civilians, we reaffirm this truth: Crimea is Ukraine, Russia’s unlawful occupation of all Ukrainian territory must end, and Russia must be held accountable for its crimes.’”

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Our Nancy is showing what seasoned congresswomen are capable of. So tired of ageism directed at her. She really could punch Trump out - in heels!

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Love that she threatened to do so!!!

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Hear, hear!!! Indeed

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Nancy Pelosi is such a mensch. And another one, Politics Girl, Leigh McGowan, telling us why Republicans don’t want leaders like Nancy Pelosi.

https://youtu.be/Fe45P1U8yZg

Salud, Rowshan.

Unita. 🗽

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How Politics Girl does that in 3 minutes is no less amazing the the Professor’s distillation of current events in these 1200 word Letters.

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I know. I simply adore her for her ability to effectively synthesize info and message it right from the kitchen. What a refrigerator she has.

Salud, Ally. 🗽

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Wonderful analogy. Salud!

In the FWIW department, my last run punch toast will be sent from the Big Island today as Sister’s Trip ‘22 comes to an end. 🍹

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Ahhhh. Hawaii.

🗽

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Salud, my friend❣️

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Pelosi is one of the wisest and craftiest people in Congress. I salute her, while at the same time wondering what foreign policy credentials the 30 Democrats who wrote the letter actually have. Speaking out of both sides of your mouth is politics, not foreign policy. Our rep, Pramila Jayapal, is a signee and should be ashamed of herself, I humbly submit.

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I’ve often respected Pramila’s battles for justice, but I agree—this was a big blunder, especially the timing. Bottom line - the sooner Putin is 100% convinced the West won’t back down, no matter what—the sooner the war is over. It’s really that simple.

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Agree, the main thing to do in the US Government is to figure out the best way to get Putin to cry Uncle and remove his cannon fodder. We are certainly not respected as a winner of wars these days, with Viet Nam and Afghanistan and Syria testifying to our credibility or lack of it. Perhaps we have, from our reputation, very little leverage. And if Europe cracks, Zelenskyy will lose. It's a tightrope, and we don't want to push ourselves off balance. Times like this I am glad I am not the President!

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Agree, Frank. This was a foreign policy blunder of the first order, in exchange for a wobbly, measly, incomprehensibly naive political message aimed at two poles full of partisans with minds locked tight, who cannot be convinced of any new arguments. I say it's time for a new Democratic Party committed to muscular defense of freedom, pragmatism, a rejection of radicalism on both ends of the political spectrum.

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I also believe we need new parties. One for the non-MAGA R's, and one for the more centrist D's. David Brooks has had persuasive columns regarding that, so maybe a 3 or 4 party system could emerge; but please not a virtually incomprehensible number like Italy has! But who would start them?

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Andrew Yang has already started a 3rd Party--the Forward Party. After all, he has such a sterling track record of success in politics thus far.

If Liz Cheney wanted to start a 3rd or ran as an Independent (like Evan McMullen in Utah) or Libertarian, we could have a conversation about this.

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Liz Cheney would be an excellent example of a tough, honest, principled, thorough, articulate, and passionate person who might well see both sides of an argument and use her skills to examine things closely. Frankly, I would vote for her for almost anything she might run for.

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A "new" Democratic Party would need a new name, like Teddy Roosevelt ran on the Progressive ticket. The Progressive caucus and the Bernie acolytes just do not want to support the coalition that makes up the coalition Democratic Party. This letter, and primarying sitting Dems or fighting "centrist" Dems in primaries are good examples of the "Progressives" wanting to differentiate themselves. So they should do it.

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Now the letters been officially withdrawn. Apparently it wasn't yet approved for release. Something is clearly amiss in the Congressional Progressive Caucus.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/10/25/house-progressives-russia-diplomacy-00063338

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Thank goodness it has been taken back, sorry it escaped in the first place!

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Sadly, it's the initial letter that will be remembered longest. That was the most tone-deaf communication from the Progressive Caucus ever!

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From Putin’s perspective, that would be capitulation, not negotiation

Negotiation means Putin has to get something he wants

Ukraine has nothing it wants (or should have to) give up

The Biden Dilemma. “What offer could be forwarded to the table?” “What offer would not reward Putin’s aggression? “

In my mind, the sooner Putin runs out of money, runs out of options, the sooner he escalates. As long as his alliances with China and Iran are string, he’s strong enough. The pressure required needs to be aimed at his allies

Today, it seems it was, kinda

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You don't think that his people and govt will turn on him when it is clear that they will lose everything? I bet they are watching him closely. Somewhere I read his greatest fear is meeting his end like Gaddafi. That was why he hated Clinton. I think one day we will wake up and it will be the case. It will be over and there will be a new government in Russia. I can't imagine how it can end any other way. We know negotiation will not really stop him, it will just encourage him. Chamberlain was wrong with Hitler. Trump was wrong with the Taliban. The Republicans were wrong with Trump. It is the nature of the beast.

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This just reminds me again of Trump's devotion to Putin, an obvious "Daddy figure" for Little Donny. There is a video out there somewhere of Putin arriving at a meeting of national leaders and Trump's reaction is utterly inappropriate, that of an eighth grade cheerleader receiving a wink from the high school football captain.

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Really well said, and the closing similes are quite apt.

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The best lives many Russians have experienced have been with Putin in control, pretending to be voted into office. Many remember great grandparents who lived as serfs. We can only understand the “average” Russian’s thinking because of our luxurious (by contrast) history. Mass murders and mass starvation are not (yet) in our history.

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You are making a great point. It will totally depend on the calculations of the Russian people. I'm hoping they will choose the life they have been enjoying without the pretender. Their future with him will be bleak.

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Ukraine did not start the fight. Ukraine wants to be free.

If Putin should get away with his life that would be better for him than all the men, women and children who have had their lives destroyed by him and his desire to expand what he imagines as his kingdom. Families have had their homes, their workplaces, their land, their

places of worship, their hospitals, schools, beautiful places that represent their culture destroyed, children and adults have had limbs blown off their bodies, many have been emotionally damaged and you could possibly believe Putin deserves anything!!!! Countries in Europe who well remember the devastation of WW1 and WW11 have offered help to families who have fled their beloved homes.

This" Putin mindset of, I'll take it if I want it....look at all my spinless lackies just doing as they are told...just looking for praise from me.....etc." We once had a strong two party system. Now we have a group of lying thugs all dressed up in Republican party colors who are using other misguided citizens to follow them, in my opinion to hell. Where are the heroes who once were part of a true Republican Party that really offered an honest choice for American citizens......oh yes, there is one...Liz Cheney.

So... returning to the subject, Putin deserves nothing, freedom deserves everything we can give to keep it.

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Emily Pfaff, my very desk is a Pfaff 130 from early last century. An upgraded model with the first electric motor overriding the treadle. So modern. A treasured heirloom from a brilliant woman. Your words are stitched precisely with the conviction that is the America I know. Goodness and light to you.

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Liz Cheney wants Trump out of the way so she can run for president. She is not a hero.

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Nancy, I greatly respect Liz Cheney. I may not vote for her or agree with her politics but she is a true American who stands up for freedom. I do respect her and I believe in an America where we can safely and honestly share our various beliefs and opinions. She loves this country and has put her political career on the line for Democracy. She considers Trump a clear and present danger to America and to Democracy.

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Nancy, Liz Cheney wants Trump held accountable so that the idea of "running for president" retains its meaning in a free society with fair elections.

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I agree, and I approve, but doing the right thing does not make her a hero.

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Nancy, I see your point but, quite often, “doing the right thing” is the very definition of a hero, particularly when the stakes of doing so include ruining your career.

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Why not both? Trump held to accountability and out of the way for Liz to run for President? Sure seems like a win-win to me

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

Dave, Putin is a psychotic killer on steroids with rabies. And he is short! What chance negotiations? Let’s take a lesson from another democratic administration (Obama) and remind him that Biden too is a democratic administration as his offer should include pictures of Bin Laden’s end.

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With the power of a Democratic Party I would tell Putin to withdraw back in to his forskin and my concession would be not to send Lorena Bobbit with seal team 7.

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Perhaps send Stormy Daniels as well, she's experienced at finding small objects.

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

Dave conant, keep in mind that Stormy’ escapade with the most powerful man on earth was admittedly the “ worst 90 seconds of my life.” Besides my concession was to NOT send Lorena Bobbitt.

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Good point Pat, I got carried away with the simile.

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Oh but Pat, Lorena Bobbitt is just about every woman’s heroine! 😃

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Putin is short? That explains it

Third Cousin thrice removed from a Napoleon Love Child?

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My immediate thought. Needed a laugh to start the day. Thanks.

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Lol

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I think what you are saying is that our aim in Ukraine is Putin’s downfall. Not a bad idea, but probably not very soon. He’ll kill a lot of people first.

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I think the goal here is to keep him from killing everyone

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Like all killers the faster we get to him , and make no mistake, we will get to him, the lives of his intended victims will be spared. His demise should be today.

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Like the old song says, easier said than done.

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Every morning Jon I step out the door saying the hard work won’t do itself so I better get to it. To make the world better is hard work, we better get to it!

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What is war but death and destruction? There doesn't seem to ever be a win, win scenario. Tyranny always seems to end only with the death of the tyrant. I'm not predicting Putin's death but I do think the only out for Russia is, at a minimum, a coup. Also, it is US policy to not negotiate with hostage takers but it is up to Ukraine to decide if they will. There is no guarantee Putin will keep on killing after the ink is dry because he still has nukes and we can't do anything about that unless Ukraine gets them to surrender unconditionally.

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The more I thought about your comment “Tyranny always seems to end only with the death of the tyrant.” The more it sank in.

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Our primary aim in Ukraine is to help Ukrainians free their country from Russian aggression and to help Europe remain free of Russian aggression.

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" negotiation should be no less....."

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I was thrilled to read that China was successfully duped by OUR double agent! Put a smile on my face…

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Xi seems to be riding high these days. Seems to me that this is the time that things go off track and it turns out that the powerful leader was riding for a fall. (That time may actually have started with the zero-COVID policy.). Ten years is a long time to be at the top of any organization. Notably, almost all US presidents who’ve served two terms have welcomed retirement after eight years.

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

Agree with your conditions for negotiations, as long as it's the Ukrainians setting the them.

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You cleared a path through a tangled web. Thank you.

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That letter from Congressional members is pure unadulterated pathetic trash! I lost some respect for all who signed it. If it is a political stunt to appeal to voters, a 'on the one hand and on the other' without saying anything', MISSION ACCOMPLISHED. But why not 'grow a pair' and stand for something instead of misleading voters by hinting you are for something that you may or may not be. If it truly is just about the money, it's even more pathetic. Total US aid to Ukraine totals $54B. Total GDP is is $23T! It is 0.234% of our GDP. We spent $2.3T in Afghanistan and over $2T in Iraq without a whimper about cost form these people that I remember. OK not good to waste money. How about we close a little tax loophole for the rich, just a little one, and fund the preservation of democracy in Europe and NATO for a generation?

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PLUS this assumes we are not reimbursed by taking the money out of Russian seized assets. Let the Russians' seized Central Bank assets fund the Ukrainian military. Russia's government been nationalizing foreign companies, works for them. It would take an act of Congress to do so. How about these people stop writing letters and pass a law?

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We are sooo lucky that 1-Trump lost and 2-Ukraine has stopped the Putin advances! If Ukraine had not stopped Putin, he would have consolidated his forces and started rolling into NATO members Estonia(1.2M pop.), Latvia (1.86M pop.), Slovenia (2.2M pop.) and other 5 small near by NATO members with populations of 5M or less. With each NATO member Putin attacked, the question would be 'are we starting WWIII for 1.2M people in Estonia? Answer if Trump won-NO, and no aid to Ukraine so they would also lose! IF you give in to Putin now, any part of Ukraine and allow Putin to consolidate forces again, the answer is he will attack again. Some wars are just unavoidable. Our Civil War could not be negotiated and we are STILL fighting it! WWII was unavoidable. VIet Nam, Afghanistan, Iraq, maybe WWI, avoidable-negotiable.

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Your mention of Slovenia, Melania’s home country, makes me wonder how she feels (if she does) about her husband’s bromance with the man trying to take over other countries.

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She’s a perfect companion to tfg. A sociopath at best.

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Melania brought her family over via "chain migration" and, I'm sure, couldn't care less about Slovenia at this point.

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Today's On Point guest this morning, Yale historian Timothy Snyder (best selling author) on 'how war ends in Ukraine', echos my sentiments exactly! It is well worth listening to, he is an expert not I.

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Amen. The GQP has to be made to feel the pain of the Ukrainian people. Perhaps then these 'lawmakers' will understand that we have no choice in this fight: either we support democracy or we die. There need be no discussion as to whether or not the defense of Ukraine is a worthy cause. It has to be OUR cause.

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Diplomacy and conversation are not at odds with resolve. We all agree that Ukraine should be supported. And all the stolen territory restored to Ukraine.

There was nothing in the Progressive statement that indicated otherwise. By keeping an open dialog while continuing to stand strong we learn about the inner workings of the Russian leadership. I believe that there are oligarchs in Russia that are looking for an "off ramp". As long as we stand strong but keep talking with them, they can see an avenue for a changed approach.

I understand your passion. But there is a long game here. Putin is not going to be able to sustain this war - he is running out of missiles. His would be soldiers are fleeing the country. And don't be surprised if "someone" finds out how those Iranian drones are getting to Russia...

Here's the other thing. "Winter is Coming". Putin may find himself in the cold. Unpopular wars make leaders unpopular.

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It was an unnecessary statement that was poorly worded. Biden has been deeply involved in the diplomacy of this conflict from day one. He needs no reminders about it. This looks like nothing more than self-promotion by the signatories, which is very disappointing. It's the equivalent of me holding a press conference to suggest to Jamie Raskin that Trump's conduct after losing the 2020 election might bear looking into.

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I don’t believe the letter was “really” for Biden. It was to reassure Millennials and gen Z that everything will be done before we start WWIII We need the younger votes this season.

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That is why it was put out before the midterms. The only reason. It looks far more like a circular firing squad than a thought-out appeasement to younger Americans.

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House progressives withdraw Ukraine letter after backlash.

https://www.axios.com/2022/10/25/house-progressives-letter-ukraine-pramila-jayapal

So much for open discussion in the Democratic Party. We can criticize the specifics of this "letter" but we should not condemn a differing point of view for simply being expressed.

I stick with my "keeping the channels open" premise. And I think it might be wise to save our venom for the real enemy. And they are not Democrats.

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Well said Bill.

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100, we must try to get Russia to negotiate peace. If we don’t, we are all dooomed. All of us.

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Putin does not negotiate. He lies, even when he says he has an agreement, there is never an agreement. Remember supposedly there was a truce years ago in Ukraine, the Minsk Accords, which merely meant Putin had time to plan this invasion. Think Hitler and all his 'negotiated peace treaties and alliances', until he ignored them and attacked. There is no way out but defeat or regime change from within for Russia. That was the brilliance of Churchill. He saw it, he said it, he lived it. Putin has basically said he wants to reconstitute the former Soviet Union and absorb NATO countries. His invasion of Ukraine is like Hitler's invasion of Poland. It is the end of the beginning, the end is nowhere in sight.

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Elisabeth said Russia. Putin's hand is getting weaker daily. As more and more Russians learn of the Ukrainian genocide his power is eroded.

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maybe tho he's not Hitler...

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Just a great student of his methods, as are our republicans

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

I believe he's just as bad-he's deliberately targeting civilians and aggressively damaging Ukraine's vital infrastructure- electricity, including nuclear power plants, access to water and food. (that will take decades to repair.)

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You are so right. Sorry for the use of that term.

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It takes two sides to negotiate. Putin doesn’t know how.

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If you read HCR this morning, you would understand that the intention of the letter was protecting the president’s actions and showing Republicans that Democrats want to continue aid to Ukraine after McCarthy’s negative statements.

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McCarthy wants to push the idea that our generosity to Ukraine has limits. We need to push back that it is not generosity. It is an investment in the kind of world we want to live in, where we fight against bullies who would take everything that we let them.

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I read HCR first, I then read the Congressional letter, which is a POS.

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Gently, gently with overwhelmed congresspersons and staffs. Why do you find ill will toward the president here?

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I too think the writing of this letter to Mr Biden seeMs to be an ill-thought strategy. Of course the administration will ⁸use diploMacy to achieve the ends desired by the UkrainIan people. Are these 30 positioning themselves for being non-partisan a Republican controlled Congress?

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I think they were countering the GQP growing narrative that we shouldn't be spending money on Ukraine. Classic "America First" crap. Just like Lindbergh. But I digress.

In a few days, nobody will be talking about it, I suspect.

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They opposed the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. That is not a fair criticism.

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Thank you so much for this valuable information. I learn something from every letter but especially from this one.

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I always appreciate a hard look at current foreign affairs. I love the move against the Chinese. I also read that Americans working in China for the semiconductor industry had to resign or lose their citizenship. I have seen this only one place and haven't verified it. As for Ukraine, I am glad we are resolute and I do worry what Rs might do if they prevail. The egos of a few people ruining life for millions really makes me angry. And yes, as a history person, I know this is nothing new. I could go on a rant, but it's getting late and I want to dip into my book on the British Empire which will cause me to shake my head sadly. Sigh. So grateful for Heather and this group.

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My husband watches a blog by someone who uses data to illustrate the bind China is in. Because of enormous corruption with massive construction, the country is broke, and it will take decades to recover. Hence a privacy curtain for those outside.

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Well... not everything is private. And most things are 'staged.' We saw a video clip today of a very odd and obviously staged incident where Xi had the last leader (Hu) seated next to him for (I believe it was) Xi's 'coronation.' Then, near the end, as the Agence France cameras were turned on, Hu was 'removed' in a rather humiliating way. Hu clearly didn't want to be taken out and Xi barely looked over at the strange removal of the former Chinese leader. The report we saw said that they claimed Hu was removed for 'health' reasons and was later claiming to be 'feeling better.' Xi is letting everyone, inside and outside of China KNOW that HE is now very much in charge.

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It was meant to humiliate this old man who had been used to sitting next to. Xi — in the morning I read in Nytimes’s that he was sending a message that moderates were not welcome anymore. I have a stepson who is fluent in Chinese and living and teaching in China. He’s taught me to respect their complicated and completely different ways.

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Of course they stage ops for the West.

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Clear signal, was it not?

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I wondered whether there was concern that Hu would raise any objection to Xi's power grab, and before the final vote he was removed. It was all a rather bizarre display, but it did show that Hu seems frail, so anything he might say can be dismissed.

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"Last Friday, however, a dense regulatory filing from a little-known federal agency gave the strongest hint yet of U.S. intentions. The Bureau of Industry and Security (BIS) announced new extraterritorial limits on the export to China of advanced semiconductors, chip-making equipment, and supercomputer components. The controls, more so than any earlier U.S. action, reveal a single-minded focus on thwarting Chinese capabilities at a broad and fundamental level."

FP 10-12-22

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I think Biden’s approach is to squeeze China out of this market by passing the CHIPS act. The US has relied on China for way too long for manufacturing furniture, toys, computer chips for our computers and now, for cars. The Chinese people have suffered under their government regime and it is they who I feel sorry for. With the DOJ indicting 13 people who acted as agents infiltrating our government and obtaining our secrets, this sends a clear message that the US isn’t one to be fooled with anymore. Hope this leads to someone in Congress being the stool pigeon for them...

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A privacy curtain for those outside has been China's default mode for thousands of years. As has 1 person rule. Nothing is new; the veneer of shared authority, shared wealth, and "capitalist global trading partner" is being stripped.

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Gailee, thanks to you and your husband foe the comment regarding China.

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That article about losing citizenship seems overblown. But it’s true that the US government is moving against the Chinese chip industry. Further research is needed.

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thank you for a clear, thoughtful discussion of these confusing (to me) events - I am ending my day feeling hopeful, thanks to you.

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The House "progressives" made the mistake when they described their "support for Ukraine" of not defining it specifically as "Ukraine restored to its borders of May 2014, with all Russian forces removed from stolen territory." The fact they had to go out and explain themselves left them looking like Chardonnay-swilling Volvo drivers.

"When you're explaining yourself, you're losing."

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Dems need to be screaming to the old MAGAts about how the republicans plan to kill their Medicare and SS. Otherwise, they can whine to the wind as republicans undo every thing Joe has done. Why are you ignoring the one issue that could sink republican lies. Times a’wasting.

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

Here in NH, Bolduc has said this idea in public. I've seen multiple ads against him about this issue and his support of abortion bans (Including the phrases "Women should just get over it." and "It belongs to the state (decision re abortion). It belongs to these gentlemen right here, who are state legislators representing you. That is the best way, I think, as a man, that women get their best voice."

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It's not being ignored on Boston TV... the ads with clips of Bolduc talking about taking away Social Security and Medicare are running right alongside the ones touting his ten tours in Afghanistan - which somehow makes him macho enough to take on Washington and all those women who should just "get over it" (his quote). I've worn a uniform, too, but I haven't dishonored it the way his political stance has. The Army should disown him: it doesn't need field officers who have MAGAt tendencies: our armed forces are supposed to be under civilian control (and that doesn't include T****). None of us should trust Bolduc.

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Ten tours?? The guy’s gotta be wacko! My husband did one tour in Vietnam. That was enough to give him PTSD for life.

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The problem, Jeri, is the “oh they wouldn’t rally do that” syndrome.

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Thanks Jeri....agreed!

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What is suspicious about being a “Chardonnay -swilling Volvo driver “ ?

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I associate those things out here in California with the Yuppie Moron Left.

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Thank you for bringing us up to date on the machinations of China’s leadership and spy organization. I’m afraid that, with so much attention on Ukraine, the Mar-a-lago classified documents, Senator Lindsay Graham (Clarence Thomas) and anti-semitism, this flew under the radar.

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"Can’t he just wear a red ball cap during oral arguments and be done with the pretense?"

Great article, BK.

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Thomas is an outlaw judge. He’s making a mockery of the Supreme Court.

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He is hardly the only one...unfortunately...

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Time to expand SCOTUS. Too bad there is so much else to do and the Republicans are so dedicated to destroying the country.

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First expand the over-loaded appellate courts, which dictate the number of seats on the SCOTUS. Why Biden hasn't done that boggles my mind.

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OFF WITH THOMAS’ HEAD! He must be removed from the bench, once and for all!

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“A crock of beans” indeed. Beans = 💩.

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Well, the latter article is certainly on target!

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It's the Thomas Court now. And Roberts knows it.

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deletedOct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022
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Clarence can’t hide his compulsion for vengeance!

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Share this everywhere. It is Poltics Girl responding to the deniers of all that Biden has done.

https://twitter.com/IAmPoliticsGirl/status/1582175918411304961?s=20&t=xJkLqiZ5gFhBu6bX2t-1tg

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Best summary of President Biden’s work and accomplishments of his administration. This kitchen rant from Politics Girl Leigh McGowan has gone out to thousands.

Thank you for posting here Gailee. I forgot to get it here over the weekend.

Unita.🗽

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Thank you Gailee and thank you Politics Girl!

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I hope upon hope that everyone here will send it to everyone they know and repost everywhere they can.

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GREAT summary.

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Thank you so much for sharing. I don't tweet so I hadn't really seen/heard Politics Girl up close and personal. Yet I love her already!

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But please help me with the WaPo's story yesterday about many in the large Ukrainian community of Parma, OH, voting for the first time against the GQP, because of the potential threat of losing American support if Congress is further defiled at the midterms.

"We voted for Trump in 2016 and the GOP for decades because we didn't care about the human rights violations of immigrants and asylum seekers to this country, or the rule of law, or debasing women, the poor, or (insert hundreds of other valid reasons), but now we won't vote for the GOP, because, Ukraine."

I hope this is an isolated, worst-case view of Ukrainian immigrants, but these Parma, OH, folks have clearly made the complete transition to becoming Americans -- completely self-absorbed, ignorant tools. And for now we're glad they finally found a reason not to vote Republican, or more likely as with a third of Americans in 2020, not at all.

May everyone have their Niemöller Moment before it's too late.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/10/23/vance-ukraine-war-ohio-senate/

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The political behaviour of the Parma, Ohio Ukrainian community is probably more typical of the greater Parma community than it is typical of the Ukrainian immigrant community. Parma is (or at least used to be) a heavily industrial suburb where a lot of the residents have traditionally been extremely politically conservative. (I've lived in the Cleveland area and am quite familiar with Parma.)

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Ah! I was familiar with the quotation but did not know the author:

https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/martin-niemoeller-first-they-came-for-the-socialists

Thank you!

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They've been listening. Bravo.

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Thank you for more details and your assessment of the letter from 30 progressive member of Congress regarding negotiating to end the war in Ukraine. Throughout the day I saw snippets and, like many others, thought the progressives might be undermining Biden's brilliant handling of this complex crisis. I feel much better.

How can there be any substantive negotiations when the Russians lie as much as they slaughter civilians? When they seek to win by making civilians suffer? When they forcibly relocate thousands of Ukrainians to Russia, including children put up for adoption? And threaten nuclear attack?

I wonder how many Putin-loving MAGA types have any idea how much more secure America is because Biden has used the war to strengthen NATO? Of course as much as they think of themselves as patriots, I doubt they care that Biden has led the charge to keep the flame of democracy from being snuffed out in Ukraine.

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

Added the next day: Liberal lawmakers WITHDREW their letter.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/10/25/democrats-ukraine-letter/

I read the letter as asking President Biden to work with Ukraine and Russia to seek a cease fire and settlement that is also acceptable to Ukraine that would involve offering Putin a way out, including the reduction of sanctions as a reward. Here is a link to the letter so that you can judge for yourself.

https://progressives.house.gov/_cache/files/5/5/5523c5cc-4028-4c46-8ee1-b56c7101c764/B7B3674EFB12D933EA4A2B97C7405DD4.10-24-22-cpc-letter-for-diplomacy-on-russia-ukraine-conflict.pdf

I believe that the subtext of the letter is to imply a softening of Ukraine's position -- without saying so -- to return all of its stolen territory. The timing of the letter, just as mid-term ballots are dropping, appears to send a message to voters who may oppose U.S. continued involvement, including "America First" Republicans and reluctant moderates.

In a way, America and its allies are already "talking" to Russia via contacts between its defense chiefs. For the U.S. to propose involvement in talks with Russia would recognize the facts on the ground that Russia will not entirely back down and is willing to use brutal means to achieve some of its intended goals. The recent assault on Ukraine's electricity grid with winter coming is one such brutal escalation. Russia's threatening a false flag dirty bomb as a pretext to use a tactical nuclear weapon portrayed as a second strike would be another escalation. They are trying to make the unthinkable thinkable.

I think the progressive authors of the letter are asking President Biden to shift to a more nuanced approach. Does anyone think that Putin is going to completely back down and give back all the territory invaded by Russia? That would be political suicide for him. Do you think it's possible he could escalate the war further? He was reckless enough to start it. He may become more reckless in his terrifying game of chicken.

I would like to see this war end and Russia pause before launching more territorial grabs. I don't think that the "win" or "lose" sports metaphor is applicable to the horrors of war. If there is a negotiated settlement, its terms will not feel fair or be fully satisfying to anyone.

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We do not negotiate with terrorists. Putin included.

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You're right. I was trying to think through what the letter says. With a re-read, I like the Washington Post's editorial board take that the letter undermines impressions of our unity, if only we were more united.

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I don’t know if the nuance of semantics makes a difference here, but throughout my 20 years of training as a SWAT negotiator the one unchanging rule is that “You cannot negotiate with terrorists”. No positive outcome can come of it. One trainer likened it to being a baseball team, playing with baseball rules against a football team playing with no rules.

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Better be true, or we’re sunk

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Greatly distracted today, the bits and blips I got to hear today had me somewhat unsettled as well. Thanks to providence for our brilliant and ever vigilant good Doctor ~

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They hate him more for it, clear as can be.

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What remains unspoken is that Russian aggression against Ukraine in 2014 not only met no resistance from the Obama administration, but expected none. Russians understood that, when Obama did nothing to enforce his "red line" comment to Syria's use of chemical weapons, he would not take action against Russia's seizure of Ukrainian territory.

The lessons are that deeds must be prepared to match words and that the right must be defended or else it will be compromised.

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In retrospect, I see your point. But it's not that simple.

Ukraine was a very different country in 2014. Not asking to be a member of NATO. Not even clearly aligned with the West. In February, its president was "removed" - he now lives in Russia. It wasn't really clear where Ukraine was headed in terms of politics and alliances.

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Some lessons are tough.......and that is a simple way to say it.

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

Obama didn't believe that risking nuclear war over Ukraine when it was not in America's best interest was worthwhile.

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As I recall, there were no solid political structures in place in Ukraine at that time. There was an awful lot of Russian political interference, as well as attacks on us the U.S. and allies political structures (England and Brexit instigating, etc.) that had not been ferreted out completely and what was couldn't be confirmed publicly for nat'l security reasons. Ukraine now however is united around a truly supported leader. Context for broad stroke statements must all be taken into account; unless that is that someone is pushing an alternate narrative, and ignoring all facts in evidence.

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Risking nuclear war over Ukraine is not in anyone's best interest. But the madman in Moscow has to be stopped, as would anyone who would risk the destruction of the planet in pursuit of power.

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

Has to be stopped. 100%.

Airborne has deployed to Europe (Romania) for the first time since nice WW2.

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/ukraine-news-russia-us-army-101st-airborne-nato-war-games-romania/

See this? UK patrol plane shot at by Russian jets over the Black Sea.

https://www.businessinsider.com/russian-fighter-jet-fired-missile-near-royal-air-force-plane-2022-10

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I am happy to hear that the 101st Airborne from the US is on its way to the borders where NATO is protecting Ukraine. This was my favorite quote out of that CBS interview “"The real meaning for me, to have the American troops here, is like if you were to have allies in Normandy before any enemy was there," Romanian Major General Lulian Berdila told CBS News.

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think it was deliberately done for show... to us... to get used to the idea

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Chess pieces are moving for sure. Airborne is no joke. I think some Russian warships in the Black Sea will be sunk. Cuts off support to Russians in Crimera from Sea. Something similar happened to the British during the revolutionary war the French Navy cut off General Cornwallis from resupply and escaping the Carolina coast, so the Americans forced his surrender? Something like that from hs history class.

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The RAF crew had luck with them that day.

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Obama had his hands full with “American” traitors running amok. I remember.

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Indeed Jeri, along with racists and assorted 'haters', with voting blocks - house and senate of GOP hatred propagators.

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Bush the Younger didn't believe it was worth US involvement when Russia took over Georgia. Then Obama with Crimea. Putin had tested the waters for US involvement in his desire to remake the Soviet Union before invading Ukraine, which Trump was totally happy to let him do.

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Bravo C 60 ! Complete memory, text 'and' context. Bravo ~

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Wasn't 2014 when Mr Biden was pressuring Ukraine to stop corruption and making our further econflict and military aid contingent upon such?

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Russia with eleven time zones, 6.6 million square miles of land, 1/8 the the earth's land mass, can't manage itself. So it wants to grab more land and swallow Ukraine, even if it has to use dirty nuclear. The government is run by a dictator and criminal thugs, called oligarchs. We live in dangerous times.

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Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022

It is clearly time to hunt up Patton in whatever reincarnation he is currently occupying and task him with an all out attack on Putin and let him finally finish the task he so ardently wanted to pursue as WW II concluded. Also clearly such psychotic killers as are also big shot politicians, like Putin, must be brought to heel by the entire world. We let this human garbage go out of fear and fear alone. At some point in time we must impose our will and do the unavoidable. As with Bin Laden he must be hunted and fed to the sharks.

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Look at Kevin McCarthy. Sean Hannity. Magas. There are fervent Putin wanna bees right in our own country. President Biden is truly right when he speaks of the fight for the soul of America.

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Don’t forget the puppet master, Rupert

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If we can make Putin the final casualty in his own war, Ukraine prevails.

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Perhaps brought down by his own countrymen.

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Great clear information as always.afraid I couldn’t help my self when reading Merrick Garlands comment I found myself rethinking the wording to put a certain ex presidents name in it. I can hope!

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Per the DOJ Office of Public Affairs posting remarks by Merrick Garland & Lisa Monaco, the DOJ has actually filed three (3) Lawsuits against PRC operatives: (1) US vs Quanzhong, et al. See, the unsealed 8 Count indictment against 7 PRC nationals; (2) US vs Guochum He and Jackie He, Case No: 1:22-mj-01137-RER et al which has been sealed by Court Order. & (3) US vs Wang Lin et al. which is an indictment against 4 persons 3 of which are alleged to be intelligence officers of the Ministry of State Security (MSS) of China.

The allegations against Huwaei & a couple of its subsidiaries have been expanded in a 2021 superseding indictment which I have not reviewed yet.The PRC's use of fraudulent fronts is a common tactic: false academic, technical & other facades. In one case the foreign undercover activity was tracked over a ten (10) year period, 2008-2018. Advanced countermeasures were successful.

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