No surprise re" Xi. Glad to see Garland and DOJ publically take a stand against those who would try to undermine the USA. At the same time, I have full faith that Biden will try to "negotiate" with Putin re: Ukraine. That "negotiation should be no less than every Russian soldier leaving Ukraine AND Crimea, war crimes charges filed and pu…
No surprise re" Xi. Glad to see Garland and DOJ publically take a stand against those who would try to undermine the USA. At the same time, I have full faith that Biden will try to "negotiate" with Putin re: Ukraine. That "negotiation should be no less than every Russian soldier leaving Ukraine AND Crimea, war crimes charges filed and pursued, and financial reparations paid by Russia to rebuild what Putin has tried to destroy.
So delighted that Speaker Pelosi was invited to the conference.
“Pelosi said she was proud to meet with Stefanchuk ‘to convey the Congress’ bipartisan and bicameral commitment to the fight being waged by the heroic people of Ukraine…. As Putin escalates his appalling atrocities against civilians, we reaffirm this truth: Crimea is Ukraine, Russia’s unlawful occupation of all Ukrainian territory must end, and Russia must be held accountable for its crimes.’”
Pelosi is one of the wisest and craftiest people in Congress. I salute her, while at the same time wondering what foreign policy credentials the 30 Democrats who wrote the letter actually have. Speaking out of both sides of your mouth is politics, not foreign policy. Our rep, Pramila Jayapal, is a signee and should be ashamed of herself, I humbly submit.
I’ve often respected Pramila’s battles for justice, but I agree—this was a big blunder, especially the timing. Bottom line - the sooner Putin is 100% convinced the West won’t back down, no matter what—the sooner the war is over. It’s really that simple.
Agree, the main thing to do in the US Government is to figure out the best way to get Putin to cry Uncle and remove his cannon fodder. We are certainly not respected as a winner of wars these days, with Viet Nam and Afghanistan and Syria testifying to our credibility or lack of it. Perhaps we have, from our reputation, very little leverage. And if Europe cracks, Zelenskyy will lose. It's a tightrope, and we don't want to push ourselves off balance. Times like this I am glad I am not the President!
Agree, Frank. This was a foreign policy blunder of the first order, in exchange for a wobbly, measly, incomprehensibly naive political message aimed at two poles full of partisans with minds locked tight, who cannot be convinced of any new arguments. I say it's time for a new Democratic Party committed to muscular defense of freedom, pragmatism, a rejection of radicalism on both ends of the political spectrum.
I also believe we need new parties. One for the non-MAGA R's, and one for the more centrist D's. David Brooks has had persuasive columns regarding that, so maybe a 3 or 4 party system could emerge; but please not a virtually incomprehensible number like Italy has! But who would start them?
Liz Cheney would be an excellent example of a tough, honest, principled, thorough, articulate, and passionate person who might well see both sides of an argument and use her skills to examine things closely. Frankly, I would vote for her for almost anything she might run for.
A "new" Democratic Party would need a new name, like Teddy Roosevelt ran on the Progressive ticket. The Progressive caucus and the Bernie acolytes just do not want to support the coalition that makes up the coalition Democratic Party. This letter, and primarying sitting Dems or fighting "centrist" Dems in primaries are good examples of the "Progressives" wanting to differentiate themselves. So they should do it.
Now the letters been officially withdrawn. Apparently it wasn't yet approved for release. Something is clearly amiss in the Congressional Progressive Caucus.
From Putin’s perspective, that would be capitulation, not negotiation
Negotiation means Putin has to get something he wants
Ukraine has nothing it wants (or should have to) give up
The Biden Dilemma. “What offer could be forwarded to the table?” “What offer would not reward Putin’s aggression? “
In my mind, the sooner Putin runs out of money, runs out of options, the sooner he escalates. As long as his alliances with China and Iran are string, he’s strong enough. The pressure required needs to be aimed at his allies
You don't think that his people and govt will turn on him when it is clear that they will lose everything? I bet they are watching him closely. Somewhere I read his greatest fear is meeting his end like Gaddafi. That was why he hated Clinton. I think one day we will wake up and it will be the case. It will be over and there will be a new government in Russia. I can't imagine how it can end any other way. We know negotiation will not really stop him, it will just encourage him. Chamberlain was wrong with Hitler. Trump was wrong with the Taliban. The Republicans were wrong with Trump. It is the nature of the beast.
This just reminds me again of Trump's devotion to Putin, an obvious "Daddy figure" for Little Donny. There is a video out there somewhere of Putin arriving at a meeting of national leaders and Trump's reaction is utterly inappropriate, that of an eighth grade cheerleader receiving a wink from the high school football captain.
The best lives many Russians have experienced have been with Putin in control, pretending to be voted into office. Many remember great grandparents who lived as serfs. We can only understand the “average” Russian’s thinking because of our luxurious (by contrast) history. Mass murders and mass starvation are not (yet) in our history.
You are making a great point. It will totally depend on the calculations of the Russian people. I'm hoping they will choose the life they have been enjoying without the pretender. Their future with him will be bleak.
Ukraine did not start the fight. Ukraine wants to be free.
If Putin should get away with his life that would be better for him than all the men, women and children who have had their lives destroyed by him and his desire to expand what he imagines as his kingdom. Families have had their homes, their workplaces, their land, their
places of worship, their hospitals, schools, beautiful places that represent their culture destroyed, children and adults have had limbs blown off their bodies, many have been emotionally damaged and you could possibly believe Putin deserves anything!!!! Countries in Europe who well remember the devastation of WW1 and WW11 have offered help to families who have fled their beloved homes.
This" Putin mindset of, I'll take it if I want it....look at all my spinless lackies just doing as they are told...just looking for praise from me.....etc." We once had a strong two party system. Now we have a group of lying thugs all dressed up in Republican party colors who are using other misguided citizens to follow them, in my opinion to hell. Where are the heroes who once were part of a true Republican Party that really offered an honest choice for American citizens......oh yes, there is one...Liz Cheney.
So... returning to the subject, Putin deserves nothing, freedom deserves everything we can give to keep it.
Emily Pfaff, my very desk is a Pfaff 130 from early last century. An upgraded model with the first electric motor overriding the treadle. So modern. A treasured heirloom from a brilliant woman. Your words are stitched precisely with the conviction that is the America I know. Goodness and light to you.
Nancy, I greatly respect Liz Cheney. I may not vote for her or agree with her politics but she is a true American who stands up for freedom. I do respect her and I believe in an America where we can safely and honestly share our various beliefs and opinions. She loves this country and has put her political career on the line for Democracy. She considers Trump a clear and present danger to America and to Democracy.
Nancy, I see your point but, quite often, “doing the right thing” is the very definition of a hero, particularly when the stakes of doing so include ruining your career.
Dave, Putin is a psychotic killer on steroids with rabies. And he is short! What chance negotiations? Let’s take a lesson from another democratic administration (Obama) and remind him that Biden too is a democratic administration as his offer should include pictures of Bin Laden’s end.
With the power of a Democratic Party I would tell Putin to withdraw back in to his forskin and my concession would be not to send Lorena Bobbit with seal team 7.
Dave conant, keep in mind that Stormy’ escapade with the most powerful man on earth was admittedly the “ worst 90 seconds of my life.” Besides my concession was to NOT send Lorena Bobbitt.
I think what you are saying is that our aim in Ukraine is Putin’s downfall. Not a bad idea, but probably not very soon. He’ll kill a lot of people first.
Like all killers the faster we get to him , and make no mistake, we will get to him, the lives of his intended victims will be spared. His demise should be today.
Every morning Jon I step out the door saying the hard work won’t do itself so I better get to it. To make the world better is hard work, we better get to it!
What is war but death and destruction? There doesn't seem to ever be a win, win scenario. Tyranny always seems to end only with the death of the tyrant. I'm not predicting Putin's death but I do think the only out for Russia is, at a minimum, a coup. Also, it is US policy to not negotiate with hostage takers but it is up to Ukraine to decide if they will. There is no guarantee Putin will keep on killing after the ink is dry because he still has nukes and we can't do anything about that unless Ukraine gets them to surrender unconditionally.
Xi seems to be riding high these days. Seems to me that this is the time that things go off track and it turns out that the powerful leader was riding for a fall. (That time may actually have started with the zero-COVID policy.). Ten years is a long time to be at the top of any organization. Notably, almost all US presidents who’ve served two terms have welcomed retirement after eight years.
No surprise re" Xi. Glad to see Garland and DOJ publically take a stand against those who would try to undermine the USA. At the same time, I have full faith that Biden will try to "negotiate" with Putin re: Ukraine. That "negotiation should be no less than every Russian soldier leaving Ukraine AND Crimea, war crimes charges filed and pursued, and financial reparations paid by Russia to rebuild what Putin has tried to destroy.
So delighted that Speaker Pelosi was invited to the conference.
“Pelosi said she was proud to meet with Stefanchuk ‘to convey the Congress’ bipartisan and bicameral commitment to the fight being waged by the heroic people of Ukraine…. As Putin escalates his appalling atrocities against civilians, we reaffirm this truth: Crimea is Ukraine, Russia’s unlawful occupation of all Ukrainian territory must end, and Russia must be held accountable for its crimes.’”
Our Nancy is showing what seasoned congresswomen are capable of. So tired of ageism directed at her. She really could punch Trump out - in heels!
Love that she threatened to do so!!!
Hear, hear!!! Indeed
Nancy Pelosi is such a mensch. And another one, Politics Girl, Leigh McGowan, telling us why Republicans don’t want leaders like Nancy Pelosi.
https://youtu.be/Fe45P1U8yZg
Salud, Rowshan.
Unita. 🗽
How Politics Girl does that in 3 minutes is no less amazing the the Professor’s distillation of current events in these 1200 word Letters.
I know. I simply adore her for her ability to effectively synthesize info and message it right from the kitchen. What a refrigerator she has.
Salud, Ally. 🗽
Wonderful analogy. Salud!
In the FWIW department, my last run punch toast will be sent from the Big Island today as Sister’s Trip ‘22 comes to an end. 🍹
Ahhhh. Hawaii.
🗽
Salud, my friend❣️
Thanks Christine.
Pelosi is one of the wisest and craftiest people in Congress. I salute her, while at the same time wondering what foreign policy credentials the 30 Democrats who wrote the letter actually have. Speaking out of both sides of your mouth is politics, not foreign policy. Our rep, Pramila Jayapal, is a signee and should be ashamed of herself, I humbly submit.
I’ve often respected Pramila’s battles for justice, but I agree—this was a big blunder, especially the timing. Bottom line - the sooner Putin is 100% convinced the West won’t back down, no matter what—the sooner the war is over. It’s really that simple.
Agree, the main thing to do in the US Government is to figure out the best way to get Putin to cry Uncle and remove his cannon fodder. We are certainly not respected as a winner of wars these days, with Viet Nam and Afghanistan and Syria testifying to our credibility or lack of it. Perhaps we have, from our reputation, very little leverage. And if Europe cracks, Zelenskyy will lose. It's a tightrope, and we don't want to push ourselves off balance. Times like this I am glad I am not the President!
Agree, Frank. This was a foreign policy blunder of the first order, in exchange for a wobbly, measly, incomprehensibly naive political message aimed at two poles full of partisans with minds locked tight, who cannot be convinced of any new arguments. I say it's time for a new Democratic Party committed to muscular defense of freedom, pragmatism, a rejection of radicalism on both ends of the political spectrum.
I also believe we need new parties. One for the non-MAGA R's, and one for the more centrist D's. David Brooks has had persuasive columns regarding that, so maybe a 3 or 4 party system could emerge; but please not a virtually incomprehensible number like Italy has! But who would start them?
Andrew Yang has already started a 3rd Party--the Forward Party. After all, he has such a sterling track record of success in politics thus far.
If Liz Cheney wanted to start a 3rd or ran as an Independent (like Evan McMullen in Utah) or Libertarian, we could have a conversation about this.
Liz Cheney would be an excellent example of a tough, honest, principled, thorough, articulate, and passionate person who might well see both sides of an argument and use her skills to examine things closely. Frankly, I would vote for her for almost anything she might run for.
A "new" Democratic Party would need a new name, like Teddy Roosevelt ran on the Progressive ticket. The Progressive caucus and the Bernie acolytes just do not want to support the coalition that makes up the coalition Democratic Party. This letter, and primarying sitting Dems or fighting "centrist" Dems in primaries are good examples of the "Progressives" wanting to differentiate themselves. So they should do it.
Now the letters been officially withdrawn. Apparently it wasn't yet approved for release. Something is clearly amiss in the Congressional Progressive Caucus.
https://www.politico.com/news/2022/10/25/house-progressives-russia-diplomacy-00063338
Thank goodness it has been taken back, sorry it escaped in the first place!
Sadly, it's the initial letter that will be remembered longest. That was the most tone-deaf communication from the Progressive Caucus ever!
From Putin’s perspective, that would be capitulation, not negotiation
Negotiation means Putin has to get something he wants
Ukraine has nothing it wants (or should have to) give up
The Biden Dilemma. “What offer could be forwarded to the table?” “What offer would not reward Putin’s aggression? “
In my mind, the sooner Putin runs out of money, runs out of options, the sooner he escalates. As long as his alliances with China and Iran are string, he’s strong enough. The pressure required needs to be aimed at his allies
Today, it seems it was, kinda
You don't think that his people and govt will turn on him when it is clear that they will lose everything? I bet they are watching him closely. Somewhere I read his greatest fear is meeting his end like Gaddafi. That was why he hated Clinton. I think one day we will wake up and it will be the case. It will be over and there will be a new government in Russia. I can't imagine how it can end any other way. We know negotiation will not really stop him, it will just encourage him. Chamberlain was wrong with Hitler. Trump was wrong with the Taliban. The Republicans were wrong with Trump. It is the nature of the beast.
This just reminds me again of Trump's devotion to Putin, an obvious "Daddy figure" for Little Donny. There is a video out there somewhere of Putin arriving at a meeting of national leaders and Trump's reaction is utterly inappropriate, that of an eighth grade cheerleader receiving a wink from the high school football captain.
attempted like
Really well said, and the closing similes are quite apt.
The best lives many Russians have experienced have been with Putin in control, pretending to be voted into office. Many remember great grandparents who lived as serfs. We can only understand the “average” Russian’s thinking because of our luxurious (by contrast) history. Mass murders and mass starvation are not (yet) in our history.
You are making a great point. It will totally depend on the calculations of the Russian people. I'm hoping they will choose the life they have been enjoying without the pretender. Their future with him will be bleak.
Ukraine did not start the fight. Ukraine wants to be free.
If Putin should get away with his life that would be better for him than all the men, women and children who have had their lives destroyed by him and his desire to expand what he imagines as his kingdom. Families have had their homes, their workplaces, their land, their
places of worship, their hospitals, schools, beautiful places that represent their culture destroyed, children and adults have had limbs blown off their bodies, many have been emotionally damaged and you could possibly believe Putin deserves anything!!!! Countries in Europe who well remember the devastation of WW1 and WW11 have offered help to families who have fled their beloved homes.
This" Putin mindset of, I'll take it if I want it....look at all my spinless lackies just doing as they are told...just looking for praise from me.....etc." We once had a strong two party system. Now we have a group of lying thugs all dressed up in Republican party colors who are using other misguided citizens to follow them, in my opinion to hell. Where are the heroes who once were part of a true Republican Party that really offered an honest choice for American citizens......oh yes, there is one...Liz Cheney.
So... returning to the subject, Putin deserves nothing, freedom deserves everything we can give to keep it.
Emily Pfaff, my very desk is a Pfaff 130 from early last century. An upgraded model with the first electric motor overriding the treadle. So modern. A treasured heirloom from a brilliant woman. Your words are stitched precisely with the conviction that is the America I know. Goodness and light to you.
Liz Cheney wants Trump out of the way so she can run for president. She is not a hero.
Nancy, I greatly respect Liz Cheney. I may not vote for her or agree with her politics but she is a true American who stands up for freedom. I do respect her and I believe in an America where we can safely and honestly share our various beliefs and opinions. She loves this country and has put her political career on the line for Democracy. She considers Trump a clear and present danger to America and to Democracy.
Nancy, Liz Cheney wants Trump held accountable so that the idea of "running for president" retains its meaning in a free society with fair elections.
I agree, and I approve, but doing the right thing does not make her a hero.
Nancy, I see your point but, quite often, “doing the right thing” is the very definition of a hero, particularly when the stakes of doing so include ruining your career.
Why not both? Trump held to accountability and out of the way for Liz to run for President? Sure seems like a win-win to me
Dave, Putin is a psychotic killer on steroids with rabies. And he is short! What chance negotiations? Let’s take a lesson from another democratic administration (Obama) and remind him that Biden too is a democratic administration as his offer should include pictures of Bin Laden’s end.
With the power of a Democratic Party I would tell Putin to withdraw back in to his forskin and my concession would be not to send Lorena Bobbit with seal team 7.
Perhaps send Stormy Daniels as well, she's experienced at finding small objects.
Dave conant, keep in mind that Stormy’ escapade with the most powerful man on earth was admittedly the “ worst 90 seconds of my life.” Besides my concession was to NOT send Lorena Bobbitt.
Good point Pat, I got carried away with the simile.
Oh but Pat, Lorena Bobbitt is just about every woman’s heroine! 😃
Putin is short? That explains it
Third Cousin thrice removed from a Napoleon Love Child?
My immediate thought. Needed a laugh to start the day. Thanks.
Lol
I think what you are saying is that our aim in Ukraine is Putin’s downfall. Not a bad idea, but probably not very soon. He’ll kill a lot of people first.
I think the goal here is to keep him from killing everyone
Like all killers the faster we get to him , and make no mistake, we will get to him, the lives of his intended victims will be spared. His demise should be today.
Like the old song says, easier said than done.
Every morning Jon I step out the door saying the hard work won’t do itself so I better get to it. To make the world better is hard work, we better get to it!
What is war but death and destruction? There doesn't seem to ever be a win, win scenario. Tyranny always seems to end only with the death of the tyrant. I'm not predicting Putin's death but I do think the only out for Russia is, at a minimum, a coup. Also, it is US policy to not negotiate with hostage takers but it is up to Ukraine to decide if they will. There is no guarantee Putin will keep on killing after the ink is dry because he still has nukes and we can't do anything about that unless Ukraine gets them to surrender unconditionally.
The more I thought about your comment “Tyranny always seems to end only with the death of the tyrant.” The more it sank in.
Our primary aim in Ukraine is to help Ukrainians free their country from Russian aggression and to help Europe remain free of Russian aggression.
" negotiation should be no less....."
I was thrilled to read that China was successfully duped by OUR double agent! Put a smile on my face…
Xi seems to be riding high these days. Seems to me that this is the time that things go off track and it turns out that the powerful leader was riding for a fall. (That time may actually have started with the zero-COVID policy.). Ten years is a long time to be at the top of any organization. Notably, almost all US presidents who’ve served two terms have welcomed retirement after eight years.
Agree with your conditions for negotiations, as long as it's the Ukrainians setting the them.