I am sorry you are so bitter. Many Americans share you bitterness. We Americans need to face up to our part in this situation. We want government to provide social services, but we don’t want to pay taxes to support those services. We spend millions of dollars on Halloween decorations, yet are outraged if asked to pay more in taxes. We w…
I am sorry you are so bitter. Many Americans share you bitterness. We Americans need to face up to our part in this situation. We want government to provide social services, but we don’t want to pay taxes to support those services. We spend millions of dollars on Halloween decorations, yet are outraged if asked to pay more in taxes. We want a single payer health care system, but we don’t want any of the changes that come with it. We want a responsive government but a huge percentage of us can’t be bothered to vote. We want higher wages, but we don’t want to pay more for our goods and services. We want a healthy environment, but we pack the highways with oversized cars and trucks, consume ever more stuff and send it to the landfill. We want responsible journalism, but we can’t look away from the click bait. I could go on, but you get the idea.
I resent that you lump us all in this post. I pay plenty as a recent widow while Elon and Jeff skate by with a million loopholes. I have been “woke,” engaged and done my best to reject the path of least resistance. I will slog on as will many who care and give what they are able to.
In some ways this sounds like the GOP line- Blame the victims. It’s not wealth disparity that keeps us struggling as the mega wealthy get mega wealthier, it’s our fault for wanting a level playing field that benefits all, couched as “don’t buy an iPhone if you can’t afford it”. The working and middle classes are paying a disproportionate amount, carrying the burden of government.
Gail, are the lower classes paying more for government? The answer depends on how one frames it. As a proportion of all taxes paid to the Treasury, the richest pay far more. As a proportion of individual income needed to thrive, they pay fast less. Republicans use the first frame (collectively the rich pay more dollars) while Democrats use the 2nd frame (the rich pay a lower proportion of their NEEDED income in taxes [even though their marginal tax rates are much higher]). The above excludes wealth, which is treated separately from income. Why do I state all this in response to your post, because your argument, which widely repeated and true, is ignored by the rich because they have the other argument, which is also true.
In other words, we need to refrained the discussion, somehow.
That's when I generally respond with the Propublica article, outline how the wealthy avoid income tax. Usually shuts down that "the rich pay more" line.
If so, I understand. Those tax avoidance schemes are legal, for sure, but tax laws created decades ago need to be amended to reflect current economic realities.
You cover a lot of territory there, Terry. Services are not free, and in health care Americans pay nearly double than eg Canadians with their public health service, and that's higher than most similar OECD countries.
Who the heck are "we", Terry? Certainly not "me". Did it include all of is here? Does it include you? Or are you expressing a media-amplified mantra of the right? (Sorry for the tone. I'm not accusing you of anything, but I'm really curious who is so resistant. Even when I tended to vote Republican, I hesitated about the Right's knee-jerk resistance to a more effective government and the work and sacrifices needed to get it. Most of my acquaintances who were more conservative than me would not have minded paying more for programs and services they could understand.)
I am sorry you are so bitter. Many Americans share you bitterness. We Americans need to face up to our part in this situation. We want government to provide social services, but we don’t want to pay taxes to support those services. We spend millions of dollars on Halloween decorations, yet are outraged if asked to pay more in taxes. We want a single payer health care system, but we don’t want any of the changes that come with it. We want a responsive government but a huge percentage of us can’t be bothered to vote. We want higher wages, but we don’t want to pay more for our goods and services. We want a healthy environment, but we pack the highways with oversized cars and trucks, consume ever more stuff and send it to the landfill. We want responsible journalism, but we can’t look away from the click bait. I could go on, but you get the idea.
I resent that you lump us all in this post. I pay plenty as a recent widow while Elon and Jeff skate by with a million loopholes. I have been “woke,” engaged and done my best to reject the path of least resistance. I will slog on as will many who care and give what they are able to.
In some ways this sounds like the GOP line- Blame the victims. It’s not wealth disparity that keeps us struggling as the mega wealthy get mega wealthier, it’s our fault for wanting a level playing field that benefits all, couched as “don’t buy an iPhone if you can’t afford it”. The working and middle classes are paying a disproportionate amount, carrying the burden of government.
Gail, are the lower classes paying more for government? The answer depends on how one frames it. As a proportion of all taxes paid to the Treasury, the richest pay far more. As a proportion of individual income needed to thrive, they pay fast less. Republicans use the first frame (collectively the rich pay more dollars) while Democrats use the 2nd frame (the rich pay a lower proportion of their NEEDED income in taxes [even though their marginal tax rates are much higher]). The above excludes wealth, which is treated separately from income. Why do I state all this in response to your post, because your argument, which widely repeated and true, is ignored by the rich because they have the other argument, which is also true.
In other words, we need to refrained the discussion, somehow.
That's when I generally respond with the Propublica article, outline how the wealthy avoid income tax. Usually shuts down that "the rich pay more" line.
You mean this one?
https://www.propublica.org/article/billionaires-tax-avoidance-techniques-irs-files
If so, I understand. Those tax avoidance schemes are legal, for sure, but tax laws created decades ago need to be amended to reflect current economic realities.
Yup. And yup.
You cover a lot of territory there, Terry. Services are not free, and in health care Americans pay nearly double than eg Canadians with their public health service, and that's higher than most similar OECD countries.
Who the heck are "we", Terry? Certainly not "me". Did it include all of is here? Does it include you? Or are you expressing a media-amplified mantra of the right? (Sorry for the tone. I'm not accusing you of anything, but I'm really curious who is so resistant. Even when I tended to vote Republican, I hesitated about the Right's knee-jerk resistance to a more effective government and the work and sacrifices needed to get it. Most of my acquaintances who were more conservative than me would not have minded paying more for programs and services they could understand.)