Early this morning, Eastern Daylight Time, Hamas militants broke out of the Gaza Strip, where approximately 2 million Palestinians live, largely unable to leave because of the extensive restrictions Israel has imposed.
Thank you Dr. Richardson, as always, for a focus on the events of the day that is not only laser sharp, but also broadly encompassing of the interwoven complexities of the times we find ourselves. And what a mess we are in. While I remain a generally positive and optimistic person, it is hard to ignore a certain sense of foreboding afoot in the world today. So, we stay positive, with clear eyes as to the dangers in the world, and try to read, understand and support intelligent dialogue and actions that we can affect within our sphere of influence. Very grateful for yours...
Ralph, I very much appreciate your thoughtful reply to today’s LFAA and only would add that our ability here in the States responsibly to “affect [events] within our sphere of influence” largely will hinge on who becomes House Speaker. To that end, I submit we have one more shot to counter the likes of a Jim Jordan or Steve Scalise and press for a bipartisan mutually agreeable Republican alternative who owes nothing to the MAGA faction and who has demonstrated respect for governance and a normally functioning, problem-solving legislature.
A fellow Substack subscriber Jerry Weiss who also writes “Feathers of Hope” and who, since December, 2022, has worked tirelessly to galvanize a cross-party House coalition has presented four names he deems to be the strongest Republican candidates to enlist substantial support from colleagues on both sides of the aisle. They are Don Bacon (R-NE), Brian Fitzgerald (R-PA), Mike Gallagher (R-WI), and Dave Joyce (R-OH).
Seeing I can’t emphasize enough how urgent the moment is, I prevail upon all of us to contact these leaders on Monday and urge them to settle on any one of the four, all of whom have demonstrated a willingness to work with likeminded people across the aisle. My apologies for not having time to look up their D.C. and local phone numbers.
I don't think serendipitous as much as opportunistic. We can expect actions like this from bad actors as long as we continue to display our national weakness for the world to see.
Politics used to end at the water's edge. No more, and lots of folks are just waiting to take advantage.
Look for them to either get the worst Speaker—looking at you Jim Jordan—or keep the House in limbo with the acting Speaker. This is a high leverage opportunity for the disruption caucus. We aren’t done with government shutdown yet. The Democrats need to rethink their hands off approach to the House Republicans and find a viable alternative to Jordan, or Scalise.
The US economy was 23.32 Trillion dollars. Total foreign aid totals less than 1%. It's a fair question to ask why is the US spending funds and to we gain a benefit from that. Do we gain a benefit from helping others militarily, like we do Ukraine and Israel? There is no question that Israel needed military aid for its earlier wars just to survive. Do they need it now? As much? Considering the threats they have been facing and are facing now, in terms of relative scale and proximity to their population, the answer may still be yes. What are we getting in return? A strategic partner in the region? A test bed for American military technology? Financial freedom for Israel's high tech sector to develop technologies that the US public and military use daily? Political benefits? I don't really have deep knowledge to answer you. Politically, though, they do have strong support on both sides of the aisle for various reasons. I personally support the aid, so I'm not a neutral observer.
Marycat, your comments in this thread seem to be hinting at something very sinister. Can you explain? And what problem do you see in the US providing more financial aid to Israel than most of the other countries on the list provided by Jerry Helfand?
Interesting list. Are we still giving money to the Taliban? We saw how fst the Afghanistan government could jump ship. Isn't Columbia cartel country? None of these countries seem to be too stable.
The majority need humanitarian aid. I think we are gifting funds to Colombia to help them keep their drugs in Colombia. Or, ship them somewhere else. Or, plant corn.
If you’re addressing me, it would never have occurred to me to suggest that. If you’re addressing Santa Claus Virginia, it’s still puzzling. Nothing points to President Biden as a warmonger.
Hello Virginia. Not addressing you. Sorry for the confusion. I was addressing Republicans blaming Biden for the attack (falsely) by citing the release of Iranian money held in South Korea back to Iran(to be used only for humanitarian aid). None of that money has actually been released yet
Didn’t really think you were, but having written several posts yesterday, knew I might have been misconstrued. Thank you for getting back to me, and reminding me of the cartoon I keep!
You don't think Hamas are aware that our Congress is paralyzed without a speaker? Thus a perfect time to launch an attack on Israel, when additional U.S. funds could definitely not be released to Israel?
Some of Congress (mostly republicans) seem to be war weary (aren't we all?) and want to stop aid to Ukraine. Now Israel is embattled? Not a good chance of getting much aid.
Thank you Ralph and Barbara! I'm posting your suggestion to my FB and Twitter X and INstagram accounts.
We don't have to wait until Monday. There are live House switchboard operators right now at (202) 224-3121. I called, asked for the rep. and left a message acc. to Barbara's suggestion. urging "them to settle on any one of the four, all of whom have demonstrated a willingness to work with likeminded people across the aisle. "
Don Bacon (R-NE), Brian Fitzpatrick (R-PA), Mike Gallagher (R-WI), and Dave Joyce (R-OH)
I had that same thought but I don't know the Republican women well enough to offer a suggestion so I decided to accept the referrals from Barbara Jo Krieger.
Forget Joyce. I’m one of his constituents. He is not who too many try to make him to be. He’s not a moderate. He hides in his office too afraid to speak publicly and voted Trump policies over 90%. And he was on the House floor yucking it up with McCarthy just before the 15th vote in January instead of working with other R-moderates and Democrats to install a reasonable Speaker. That they call him a leader of moderates is a joke.
Thanks Max; I for one needed to know that for certain. I'm an Ohio interested soul. I also had heard mixed reviews on Joyce, but could not speak to it personally from a position of experience. Sounds about like I figured though; nothing more than one of those "go along to get along" sorts, and definitely not a leader - more concerned for his own skin. Thank you... If it does not exist, we have a big need for an Ohio centric forum for comparing notes in a non-partisan type of way. I don't have interest in some separate tribal thing; a greater good sort of thing is my thought.
Definitely the go-along to get-along boy. He’s that proverbial “nice guy” who accomplishes absolutely nothing he’d have to actually fight for IMO. We can no longer afford to send this type to DC and think they’ve got our backs.
I could share another story that would show how I’ll-fitting he is fir a job but would have to divulge a particular friend of mine. Closest I can get is the person is someone noted in the community he admired enough to get them an accolade from the Hill who tried to call him to go to lunch with the thought of talking some politics with him. He didn’t even return this person’s phone call who is also one of his constituents. . He doesn’t want to partake in what he knows will be challenging conversations. I believe he wants to be that better person but just doesn't have the courage to be so. Only my opinion.
Chaplain, In referencing your FB, Twitter X, and Instagram accounts, you have affirmed my faith that a single posting can send ripples of influence in ways one had not anticipated. I am deeply grateful.
You are more than welcome, Barbara. I on the other hand am deeply grateful that here and on Robert Hubbell's and Jessica Craven's newsletters, I am in community with people who are way more knowledgeable than I am in so many of these political arenas. Blessings, PS full disclosure, I completed FB and X, but I haven't gotten over to instagram yet : ) Blessings,
Tried to contact House switchboard to recommend Dan Bacon for the speakership but needed a contact. None of my own reps in blood red SC are appropriate so I tried Hakeem Jeffries but was cut off, I’m sure things are very chaotic.
We must try to cut off any nominations to restore McCarthy or Gym Jordan and similar MAGATS . Do you have another way to contact, ie email, ??? Suspect the situation is so critical a nomination will arise that we do not support due to the urgency of the matter. I am horrified we’ve been caught with our pants down so to speak on so many levels. Also wonder if our dysfunction played a part in the timing of this event?
Karen, Thank you for the correction. Admittedly, this is not the first time I’ve transposed the name. Fortunately, when one googles “Fitzgerald” for phone numbers, Fitzpatrick pops up.
See my response here and below. It might make a difference and at least inform others:
Karen Borst-Rothe
3 mins ago
“Perhaps writing a well condensed version of relevant aspects of this argument about the importance of sensible House governance might help. Then passing that factual perspective to others in your district and to local news ir other receptive outlets. (At least doing this in writing might help counter the simplified, deliberate ignorance of their world view.)”
You’re right. I’m working with a team to launch Blue Tennessee, aimed at getting Democrats to fun for state offices. (Of 99 officeholders, 60 ran unopposed.) while we’re working at the state level, 2 of the 3 of my reps in the US Congress were state level before they ran at the national level. Https://Linktr.ee/BlueTennessee
Did I mention Marsha Blackburn is my senator? <heavy sigh>
While these two are federal, they moved up from elected state reps. That is why I am involved with launching Blue Tennessee: https://Linktr.ee/BlueTennessee. We MUST do something.
Perhaps writing a well condensed version of relevant aspects of this argument about the importance of sensible House governance might help. Then passing that factual perspective to others in your district and to local news ir other receptive outlets. (At least doing this in writing might help counter the simplified, deliberate ignorance of their world view.)
“Perhaps writing a well condensed version of relevant aspects of this argument about the importance of sensible House governance might help. Then passing that factual perspective to others in your district and to local news ir other receptive outlets. (At least doing this in writing might help counter the simplified, deliberate ignorance of their world view.)”
Dave Joyce is my congressman. I watched him on the House floor yucking it up with McCarthy just before the 15th round in January. I’ve watched him vote over 90% with Trump. I’ve watched him hide in his office hoping no one would see him time after time when he should have been speaking out.
As his constituent, I tried to write him on his online government website to share my dissatisfaction with an issue. The site wouldn’t allow me to send the message over and over again no matter what changes I made. Then I tried changing the subject line to “You’re Great” and told him in the content that if he received the message it was because he was screening his messages electronically and only allowed good ones. This message immediately was allowed to be sent. This is the character of the man and no one to trust. Unfortunately, I don’t believe there’s any moderate or good Republicans. Only ones who may play-act that they are. I know who Joyce is and wouldn’t vote him for dog catcher.
And BTW, he never responded to the “You’re Great” message I sent. I take that as an acknowledgment that he really does electronically screen messages you try to send him.
Max, Thank you for sharing first-hand knowledge I imagine folks will consider as they evaluate Jerry Weiss’s list, which I understand resulted from several months of research. For what it’s worth, I would note, some time back, that Robert Reich also advanced Joyce’s name as a consensus candidate.
But the crazies in the Republican party want crazy. They will never support someone who isn’t MAGA. Still, I will make the call as suggested in hopes perhaps a level headed “adult” can be nominated anyway and receive support from both sides.
@LoveMuley, Similar to the cross-party coalition that earlier voted to raise the debt ceiling and recently voted to pass a relatively clean CR, Weiss, I believe rightly, is convinced, after months of research, that the right candidate, one who owes nothing to the MAGA faction and has signaled a willingness to work across the aisle, can enlist the 217 votes (1 seat currently is vacated) from a cross-party cadre of establishment colleagues.
Hooray for Jerry Weiss. Thanks for making us aware of his Substack. I've subscribed. The divisiveness and negativity has become overwhelming. We need more people seeking unity and change.
Linda, Thank you for your reply. For what it’s worth, I never lose sight of the fact that as any movement gathers voices it’s impossible to foretell precisely which one gets us to critical mass, whereupon the movement catches fire.
Penny, Out-of-staters speaking for interests that impact the country-at large can and should call whomever is poised to respond. For what it’s worth, when I’ve advocated by phone for a consensus Speaker candidate, every staffer has noted my remarks and has assured me they would be passed to the congressperson.
Statements from Arab countries were all about the same. Do you think they will come to the aid of Palestinians or shall these people continue to be persecuted, until they are no more?
__ A statement by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that Saudi Arabia was "closely monitoring the unprecedented developments between various Palestinian factions and the Israeli occupation forces, resulting in an escalation of violence on several fronts".
It said Riyadh calls for "an immediate cessation of the escalation" between both sides and "the protection of civilians".
__ Qatar, which has been starkly opposed to normalisation with Israel, expressed "deep concern" over the developments in the Gaza Strip.
A statement issued by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs said Israel was "solely responsible for the ongoing escalation due to its continuous violations of the rights of the Palestinian people, including its recent repeated intrusions into the holy Al-Aqsa Mosque under the protection of the Israeli police".
__The UAE expressed "deep concern" over the escalation in a statement that stressed the need "to stop the escalation and preserve the lives of civilians".
The statement offered "sincere condolences" to all the victims of the recent fighting.
It called for "the immediate reactivating of the international Quartet to revive the path of Arab-Israeli peace", and urged the international community to advance all efforts made to achieve comprehensive and just peace, and prevent the region from being dragged to "new levels of violence, tension and instability".
__Egypt, which normalised with Israel in 1980 under a peace treaty, warned of "grave consequences" from an escalation in tensions between Israel and the Palestinians in a statement from the foreign ministry carried by the state news agency.
'It called for "exercising maximum restraint and avoiding exposing civilians to further danger". (The New Arab) See link below.
What did Biden say about the Palestinians yesterday?
"I made clear to Prime Minister Netanyahu that we stand ready to offer all appropriate means of support to the government and people of Israel," Biden said in a written statement issued after their call.'
'In his televised remarks later, Biden issued a blunt warning.'
"Israel has a right to defend itself and its people - full stop," he said. "Let me say this as clearly as I can. This is not a moment for any party hostile to Israel to exploit these attacks to seek advantage. The world is watching." (Reuters)
‘Israel and the United States are seeking a united front in the region against Iran and its support for terrorist groups such as Hamas and Lebanon-based Hezbollah. While Netanyahu’s extreme right-wing coalition is unlikely to bend on either annexation or settlements, some U.S. officials are hopeful that his desire to achieve a legacy of peace with the larger Arab world could move him to reorganize his government.’
‘The hope has been that Saudi Arabia would follow in the footsteps of Bahrain and the United Arab Emirates, establishing diplomatic and economic relations with Israel as part of the Abraham Accords signed during the Trump administration. Last month, the Biden administration also signed a non-treaty security pact with Bahrain that it anticipated would serve as a template for other agreements in the region.’
‘But the scale of the attack on Israel, Hamas’s holding of hostages, and the prospect of further violence has upset all projections. If the upheaval continues as previous, albeit smaller, incidents have, “the most likely scenario is an Israeli attack on Gaza that lasts for a while, with a significant amount of death and destruction,” said Jonathan Panikoff, a former deputy national intelligence officer for the Near East and now director of the Scowcroft Middle East Security Initiative at the Atlantic Council.'
'But “the longer it goes on, the more the Arab street will get angry and the harder it is to have a situation in which Saudi Arabia says okay, as soon as this ends, we’ll get back on track,” Panikoff said.’
‘In statements Saturday, Hamas invited others to join them in the fight, although it appeared unlikely any Arab states would take up the offer. One concern, however, was the possibility that Hezbollah — like Hamas, armed and backed by Iran — would move into Israel from the north.’ (WAPO)
‘This Gaza war didn’t come out of nowhere’ (excerpt from Vox)
‘Everyone forgot about the Palestinians — conditions have been set for two decades, and Biden’s focus on Israel-Saudi talks may have lit a match.’
‘It took Hamas’s deadly attack today to remind Israel, the United States, and the world that Palestine still matters.’
‘The militant group based in occupied Gaza launched aerial attacks and broke through the heavily secured fence into the State of Israel. Hundreds of Israelis have been killed, a historic scale of violence for the country. The Israeli counterattack will inevitably lead to more death and destruction for Palestinians and a tightened occupation.’
‘It comes after nearly two decades of the US and world leaders overlooking the more than 2 million people living in Gaza who endure a humanitarian nightmare, with its airspace and borders and sea under Israeli control. The attack comes amid an ongoing failure to grapple with the dangerous situation for Palestinians in the West Bank where Israel’s extreme-right government over the past year has escalated the already brutal daily pain of occupation.’
‘Instances of Israeli security forces and Israeli settlers antagonizing Palestinians through violence are on the rise, from the pogrom on the city of Huwara to a new tempo of lethal raids on Jenin. Israeli government ministers have been pursuing annexationist policies and sharing raging rhetoric; both incite further violent response from Palestinians and appear at a time when new militant groups have emerged that claim the mantle of the Palestinian cause. The now-regular presence of Israeli Jews praying at the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem, one of Islam’s holiest sites, have further pressurized the situation. A Hamas commander cited many of these factors in his statement.’
‘But the ongoing reality of the occupation has not featured prominently in US or Arab leaders’ engagement with the region in recent years, even as circumstances for Palestinians worsened.’
‘The question must thus be asked to the Israeli government, the Biden administration, and Arab leaders: How did they forget about Palestinians? How did they so brazenly ignore Gaza?’
‘President Joe Biden has not reversed his predecessor Donald Trump’s policy of putting aside the question of Palestine and instead has exerted immense capital on the normalization of Israel’s relations with Arab states, no matter how extreme the policies of the Israeli government.’
‘In the current US-led diplomatic equation, there is no space for Palestinians, except for talk of minor concessions to ease daily humiliations. Biden said recently, as many of his surrogates often do, that the US remains intent on’ “preserving the path to a negotiated two-state solution.”
‘But negotiations between Israel and the Palestine Liberation Organization have been frozen since 2014 under President Barack Obama, and most Palestinian analysts at this point acknowledge that US administrations since President Bill Clinton have engaged in a failed, asymmetrical process that never would have allowed for the conditions of an independent, sovereign state of Palestine.’
‘And so the symbolism of Hamas breaking through Israeli security barriers and wreaking havoc on Israel — including the kidnapping of at least one Israeli soldier as well as civilians — will resonate across Palestine, the Arab world, and beyond. (VOX)
“I believe that the hand of Iran will be found in elements of this,” ‘said Jonathan Schanzer, senior vice president for research at the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies, a Washington-based think tank’
‘He said the assault by Hamas was a marked change from the Palestinian group. Before it was focused on suicide bombings and crude rocket attacks; this time it is “going deep into Israel and pulling off an operation that marks a significant departure.’ “This strikes at the heart of the Israel Defense Force. It strikes at the heart of Israel. This is unlike anything that we’ve seen from Hamas in the past. And it demonstrates a strategic decision undertaken by the organization that I don’t think would happen without its patrons in Tehran.”
“There are questions about whether other fronts will now turn hot, which is a serious concern that Israel has long held with regard to the Iranian encirclement strategy,” he added.’
“Will the West Bank turn hot? Will Shi’ite militias activate in places like Syria? Will Hezbollah get involved? We will see over the next few hours or days to come whether this was just simply an attempt by Hamas to make a statement and to announce itself anew or whether this is part of a broader strategy where other elements beholden to Iran participate. This is the war I think everyone has feared with an Iranian goal of encirclement and perhaps even an attempt to strangle the Israeli state.” (Politico) See link below
True, Fern, this attack on Israel did not come out of nowhere.
In 1987, I was in Israel for 2 months; I came to love the country and its people. One day, I walked into a Palestinian village where roads were unpaved, stone houses had no running water and no electricity, villagers had a curfew and, as I recall, could not leave the country. I wondered how I would feel if, less than 10 miles away from my home, people had freedoms, water and light when I did not. The experience made me sad. In 1987 a solution seemed obvious to this outsider; but here we are in 2023. I hope that this village still exists, that its people at least have water and electricity.
History can be a great teacher if we are willing to look and learn.
One must differentiate between Gazans and Hamas. Gazans who try to resist Hamas putting bombs under their apartments and children’s schools are publicly hanged and sometimes all the men in their family.
There’s a reason Egypt joined Israel in blockading Gaza by sea, land, and air.
Fern, thank you so much for this thorough synopsis. I have been shocked by the failure of any reporting on the background and on this : "‘It comes after nearly two decades of the US and world leaders overlooking the more than 2 million people living in Gaza who endure a humanitarian nightmare, with its airspace and borders and sea under Israeli control. The attack comes amid an ongoing failure to grapple with the dangerous situation for Palestinians in the West Bank where Israel’s extreme-right government over the past year has escalated the already brutal daily pain of occupation.’
Thank you for learning as much as you can about the causes and effects of such situations. You may, in addition to the analyses of HCR and other thinkers, appreciate the work of historian, Timothy Snyder. He has written On Tyranny, Our Malady, The Road to Unfreedom, Black Earth, and Bloodlands. For more about him, please see the link below.
Laine, thank you for spreading the question: 'What has been and is happening to the Palestinians? Please do NOT include my name. I am simply your friend. Thank you!
“Regarding your comments in response to the current horrific conflict: can you not be more evenhanded? How can you forget about the Palestinian people?
How can you so brazenly ignore Gaza, and the history of brutal oppression suffered by the Palestinians? Please!
Hamas does not represent all of them, although it is acting on their behalf.
Please use your position & power in the world to acknowledge that the Palestinian people deserve compassion & support!
'Matchbooks', as a former smoker, your brought me back. I can smell striking the match! Ah, 'Memories Are Made of This'! Do you remember the song, Ally?
That level of crush doesn't go away easily! There was something about his Italian genes and smokey voice that.....oh excuse me I need a glass of ice water...over my head!!!
My dad smoked cigars and pipes. I hated the smell of the cigars, loved the smell of the pipes.
I guess I should be grateful that I got sick after my first (and only) cigarette, but sometimes I did wish I could make that sophisticated statement....especially after seeing Paul Henreid light two cigarettes at once...and then slowly take one from his mouth and smoothly hand it to Bette Davis (Now, Voyager 11942) as they gazed into one another's eyes....sigh.....It's even posted in youtube as "The Cigarette Scene."
Don’t worry Fern. Some of us still remember and adore all the wonderful smells and sounds and rituals of smoking a cigarette. Twas a Dunhill for me. And a Dunhill lighter too.
" Israel faces significant human rights problems regarding institutional discrimination against Arab citizens of Israel (many of whom self-identify as Palestinian), Ethiopian Israelis and women, and the treatment of refugees and irregular migrants. Other human rights problems include institutional discrimination against non-Orthodox Jews and intermarried families, and labor rights abuses against foreign workers"
Illuminating synopsis of the situation in Israel, Fern. Were you a reporter or State Dept specialist in another life? Thank you for the work gathering these details.
Ah, my earlier life and work did teach and encouraged me to think, to dig, to care and to organize, without eliminating the pain and a glimmer of hope. Salud, JP.
They all win. Saudi Arabia and Putin get to pretend they are working to resolve issues, Netanyahu gets to gather territory and keep those who were protesting indoors while I bet he secretly passes his measures to consolidate power further while telling his people they must be united against "the enemy". I have serious doubt Netanyahu did not know this was coming with their Intelligence and Security.
Putin wins because he gets the US involved in Israel's fight and detracts from Ukraine, which works just fine for MAGA Christofascist Nationalist Republicans.
Oh, and of course Iran wins as well. Iran has been funding Hamas to ensure unrest between Palestinians and Israel, not because Iran cares about either, but because spreading fear and extreme "Islamic" beliefs works for Iran. Extremes in any religion is not about the religion at all, but about power and control using "God" as cover.
I’m not an expert in any of this. But all I’ve seen in my 73 years is:
- numerous peace treaties agreed to between Israel and Palestine followed almost immediately with Israel breaking the treaty and continued Israel building on the Gaza Strip when they just agreed to stop.
- Trump allowed Jared to create a supposed peace treaty WITHOUT Palestine at the table and basically told Palestine FU if you don’t succumb.
- Trump killed the Iran nuclear agreement his predecessor negotiated that WAS WORKING for the world but Donny had to tip his hat to Netanyahu of course.
It is horrible what happened to Israel yesterday, but Nut-and-Yahoo will likely use it to annihilate Iran and close down Palestine forever (dragging us in) as he’s wanted for years. I’m for all people’s freedoms. But I’m not looking forward to to the genocide that will take place just to satisfy Israel. The world needs to see to Palestine’s citizens’ rights also. I foresee many miscalculations in what’s to come just as the miscalculations after 911 never made the responsible parties (Saudi) pay a thing under Bush and Obama, and actually get rewarded under Trump.
I think we have a duty to ask whether the N-hu government really blindsided??? Or was it a choice to look the other way? After all, the Israeli army had experienced a lack of morale and enlistmebt since N-hu started his anti-democracy campaign. And now, suddenly, Israelis have another more pressing enemy and enlistments are off the charts.
I wouldn’t put anything past Netanyahu. Remember Putin bombing his own people and coming to the supposed rescue early in his dictatorship? Net is the same dictator wannabe . His own country should be questioning their “lack of intelligence” just like our country is questioning the “lack of law enforcement” on J6 after Trump replaced so many in the month before the insurrection.
Fern, I don't know if you're aware of the conditions upon the State of Israel's founding (5 Arab nations attacked the nascent State, a country founded as a haven for Jews following the Holocaust as well as centuries of Jews being evicted from their homes in many countries around the world) or the subsequent, constant threats and terrorism of Arab organizations toward the Jewish people. I don’t know if you personally know any Jews who left their homes in Gaza in 2006 in the hope that peace would be at hand, only to build and regularly use bomb shelters when they resettled on the other side of the border. I am not a fan of Netanyahu. He should probably be in prison. The plight of the Palestinian people is real and my prayers are for my immediate family in the Land as well as for my “cousins” (Palestinians). Hamas is a terrorist organization that makes no bones about calling for the destruction of Israel and the Jewish People. Can we agree that the situation is fraught, extremely complicated and most of us (including me) can’t speak intelligently about how to solve the long, protracted problems? Women, children, elderly and disabled folks have been abducted during a Holy Day and are being held hostage, some taken to Gaza. Israeli soldiers, many of whom are aged 18-21 have been killed defending the country in this assault. It’s also worth mentioning.
Do I know why you posted your history lesson about the Jewish people and attacks by Arab nations on Israel to the attention of the person who posted a comment about the persecution of Palestinians by Israel? Do you know that I'm Jewish? You appear to think that you know more about this subject than I do. Do you know how patronizing you are?
Fern, I don’t know you and you don’t know me. I am neither a historian nor a maven on any particular topic (I am curious about many things). What you sensed (and mistook for an obnoxious attempt to school you) was my frustration that as a terrorist organization wages a multi-tier attack on Jewish civilians, you and others choose to spotlight only the suffering of Palestinians. This is typical when Israel is in the news and it irks me. That you identify as Jewish adds to my frustration and bewilderment. My statements beginning with ‘I don’t know if you…’ were meant sincerely and without guile or pretense. They were an invitation to remember the difficult history of this place; that it’s complicated and not only one group suffers - so why take THIS moment to focus on the suffering of only one group? I’m responding to your personal comment because I prefer to give you the benefit of the doubt. Maybe you regret being nasty rather than seeking clarification. Heather’s comments section is a place where folks come together to discuss and disagree respectfully. That’s always her message. Let’s honor her and start over. I’m sorry you misunderstood me. It happens in the written message, but misunderstand you did. I think I ask a fair question and as Jewess, why not acknowledge this current situation with more nuance?
The following except from 'Is Israel at War With Iran?' by By Arash Azizi in the Atlantic provides a thoughtful view of what is at stake for Israel and its neighbors in the Middle East at this time.
'One reason the attacks are surprising to so many is that, for months, the trend in the Middle East has been toward diplomatic reconciliation and the smoothing-over of rifts. Despite its murderous record, the Syrian regime was readmitted to the Arab League; Turkey has had a rapprochement with Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, and Egypt; and Iran has restored diplomatic ties with Saudi Arabia. In his annual “Islamic unity” speech this week, on the occasion of the Prophet Muhammad’s birthday, Khamenei expressed support for this reconciliation trend: “If Iran and countries such as Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Jordan adopt a common position on fundamental questions,” Khamenei said, “oppressive powers won’t be able to interfere in their domestic affairs or foreign policy.” The three countries Khamenei named were all U.S. allies not usually on good terms with Iran; Cairo doesn’t have diplomatic ties with Tehran, and those between Iran and Jordan are very limited. Both have had relations with Israel for decades, as they were the first Arab countries to recognize the Jewish state.'
'But in the same speech, Khamenei left no doubt as to where Tehran stands on Israel. The supreme leader claimed that the “Zionist regime” was full of “hatred” toward all of its neighbors and pursuing a goal of dominating the region “from the Nile to the Euphrates.” He went on to promise that “the Zionist regime is dying” and warned countries seeking to normalize ties with Israel that they were “making a mistake … betting on the losing horse.” Israel, he said, is “a cancer that will be uprooted and destroyed by the people of Palestine and forces of resistance in the region.” Shortly after the October 7 attack, Palestinian leaders, including Hamas’s Ismail Haniya and Palestinian Islamic Jihad’s Ehsan Ataya, issued explicit messages to Arab countries seeking normalization with Israel, warning them in strikingly similar tones.'
'Saudi Arabia might appear to be receptive to this messaging. Its foreign ministry’s statement following the attacks carefully avoided condemning Hamas and instead reminded Israelis of “repeated warnings of the dangers of the explosion of the situation as a result of the continued occupation, and deprivation of the Palestinian people of their legitimate rights, and the repetition of systematic provocations against its sanctities.” But Riyadh has hardly needed Iran to determine this position, which has been Saudi Arabia’s historical stance, and which it has never said it would change: No recognition of Israel so long as Palestinians remain stateless.'
'Therein lies the real dilemma for the Israeli government. The decades-long delusion that Israel could ignore, manage, shrink, or simply forget its conflict with its Palestinian neighbors has been a costly blunder. Netanyahu imagined that he could sustain the occupation of the West Bank without hampering the country’s continued diplomatic and economic success. But as other Israelis have long warned, this was a bubble ultimately due to burst. The Iranian regime is arming Palestinians and driving them toward its own murderous agenda vis-à-vis Israelis. But Israel’s continued subjugation of Palestinians is what allows such a festering wound to exist in the first place, giving Tehran an easy issue to exploit.'
'Allying with Tehran, doing its bidding, and bringing terror upon innocent Israeli civilians will not bring Palestinians any positive outcomes. Seven million Jewish Israelis and the State of Israel are not going anywhere, and so long as Palestinians don’t seek a strategy predicated upon coexistence, they will find no path forward. We have been here before: During the Second Intifada of 2000–05, the murders of Israeli civilians by Hamas and other Palestinian factions served only to weaken Israel’s pro-peace camp and lay the ground for the rise of the far right. A similar outcome today will not be in either society’s interest. Nor will it help the Iranian people, many of whom have long shown their opposition to the regime’s anti-Israel obsession, and some of whom are already protesting the regime’s support for the Palestinian attacks. They have no interest in a conflict with Israel.'
'As he was hurrying to the northern front on Saturday, a reserve senior officer of the Israel Defense Forces told Haaretz: “We were living in an imaginary reality for years.” He was talking about Israeli intelligence failures, but an equally imaginary reality is that Israelis can have normal lives so long as millions of Palestinians don’t. We can only hope that responsible actors in the region and beyond can bring about a cease-fire in the days ahead, before the conflagration gets any bigger. But in the long term, countering Tehran’s murderous agenda will require a durable solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict itself.'
(TheAtlantic) Sorry that a gifted link is not available.
I subscribe to The Atlantic and will read this, thank you for sending. It's not time for this now, however. Instead, in the words of my Rabbi: "Right now it is proper to say Tehillim. Chapters 120 and 121 are appropriate. Right now it is worthy to banish all thoughts of hatred of our people with whom we may disagree, to put our petty differences aside and concentrate on making ourselves and everyone around us better. We hope that Israelis will get this memo as well. We will much more readily be able to confront our bitter enemies if those with political differences can sit at a table and work out their differences. I believe that we will finally see this happen soon. Many people in our inner circle have children or relatives who were called up for the army. 150,000 reservists we’re just called up." Just an offering of the current reality. Shalom.
Thanks, as always, Fern, for providing the rest of the ice-berg so that tip-of-the-ice-berg thinkers have an opportunity to see a broader, deeper reality. In addition to Heather, Joyce Vance, Robert Hubble, and Jessica Craven, Peter Beinart's Friday broadcasts are another valuable source of crucial, in-depth perspective.
Samantha Verrone, I am sorry that we cannot communicate as people open to each other's points of view. My sense is that your idea of Israel is fixed in a way that is impenetrable and absolute. Our reading of the facts is not the same. Salud!
PS Nothing that I wrote was in support of Hamas. One of the main points in my comment concerned the policies and treatment of the Palestinians by Israel and provided the link to a detailed article on that subject in VOX. Another point raised was possible role of Iran in Hamas' attack on Israel.
Again, your assumptions about me are erroneous. I've given no evidence that my ideas are impenetrable or absolute. I spoke of my own ignorance about solutions for the region, but that what's clear enough is that the situation isn't black or white; that Jewish civilians are under siege in a way we haven't seen in many years. I didn't accuse you of supporting Hamas. I asked you questions you have chosen not to answer. So be it.
Fern certainly does a tremendous job of adding to the conversation. This is a human tragedy that has been brewing for decades. How, indeed, do we stay hopeful? But giving up is not an option!
Fran, thanks for reminding us that there is no innocence on either side. Bebe has treated Palestinians as an unwanted burden to be disposed - this is where it lead. There is blame on both sides.
Do know that whatever sense of sanity we can hold onto will be my mantra...I am here sending my energy and love to those who seek truth over manipulation and lies. Please please let us be smart.... maybe for all the other creatures that inhabit our planet and who do so without harming the rest of us! May we consider those who do not harm, but who exist as positive life forces.
What an effing mess our world is in! All caused by men. Reminder: the recent Nobel Peace Prize was given to Narges Mohammadi, an Iranian human rights activist who is jailed in Iran. Jailed for reporting the horrendous tortures and murders happening to its people.
Marlene- that was my reaction too. Honest to God, a sub sector of the male of the species continues to foist violence everywhere now and throughout history and for what gain/benefit?! Yes, there are some rogue women, but it is not in our DNA to imprison large swaths of populations, blow things up, kill people, and set life up for misery and destruction.
Israel treats the Palestinians like slaves withholding the basic necessities. They limit the ability of Palestinians to advance in society and control other parts of their lives.
While I don't condone or praise Hama's actions, this was never going to end well. When you have nothing to lose and are treated badly, this is what happens.
I agree that it was probably men that planned this attack, but like Republican women that vote time and again for Trump and his MAGAs, they are not without blame.
Violence is wrong. The attack by Hamas will not get them what they want. In fact, it will set back the Palestinian cause dramatically. The international reaction (blowback) to a surprise attack leaving so many casualties will hurt for decades. Stupid.
But Gary, you are spot on. Now, at the risk of inviting an onslaught of criticism, let's be clear that the truth as to why this happened is painful and almost impossible for most "Westerners" to accept. We need to hold "Bibi" and his ultra extreme comrades responsible for the oppression and horrific life they have sentenced the people of Gaza to. This was no random attack. This was a retaliation. This was a scream for help.
My hope is that this will bring attention to the brutality that Palestinians have suffered.
And maybe, just maybe, "Bibi" will catch enough flack for letting this happen on his watch that he will be toppled. Israel is known for having one of the finest intelligence services on the planet. This failure should be on Netanyahu - the Trump of the Middle East.
There are many, many moderate peace loving Israelis who have been advocating for Palestinian rights. For a solution. Whether it be Israeli citizenship or whether it be a two state solution. But Netanyahu has assembled around him ultra extreme players who have no interests other than their own. In a geo-political and historical sense Benjamin Netanyahu invited this attack.
No attack or violence is OK. Don't get me wrong. But you can't put a lot of people in a cage and starve them of a reasonable life and expect them to send white doves of peace.
Right On!! Biden and the rest of the US should recognize the Palestinians have rights too. Our unlimited support for Israel while they deny those rights to the Palestinians have been and continues to be a major policy error on our part.
The United States had even supported the South African Defense Force's efforts in Angola. In the 1980s, hard-line anti-communists in Washington continued to promote relations with the Apartheid government despite economic sanctions levied by the U.S. Congress.
The PLO is recognized by the USA as the governing body in Palestine, but the PLO has never been able to govern, so Hammas, which does not negotiate, has taken over. How can lsrael negotiate with such literally unruly people?
It is my understanding that the PLO disintegrated after Arafat died. Hamas is a terrorist organization which doesn’t even govern its people. The Palestinians are caught between a rock and a hard place with both Israel and Hamas taking advantage of them. Hamas abuses them as much as Israel does. I don’t give Bibi a pass, nor the Likud Party.
Not criticism, Bill, but praise. I agree totally with your post. This is a total mess and its beginnings go back to at least WWI. It could have been solved long ago by people who value peace. I do not approve of violence, but I have read enough about the Israeli treatment of Palestinians to understand it. I have long viewed the entire area of the Middle East as a quagmire.
Sometime last century, can't keep track of the event but when Israel did some bulldozing of Palestinian homes in a crackdown, I thot of doing a political drawing as I did at the time.
This would show the carnage in Palestine by Israelies and up in the clouds would be Hitler & Stalin saying "We taught them well."
I totally agree that violence is wrong. Iran backs Hamas with funding and weapons and apparently was an integral part of these attacks.
As we look to Iran and their violence to women, should we expect an armed uprising in Iran as well? It seems from what the media reports that there has been little progress in both Iran and Israel in spite of their non-violent protests.
Yes, having Palestinian friends and knowing that the United States does little to acknowledge the daily existence of people independent of Hamas in Gaza always tempers my support of Israel and the aggression of "settlers."
Gender blame isn't going to solve anything. It's human error. House Minority Leader Jeffries wrote a reasoned op-ed yesterday. The House needs to realize their path forward is through compromise. Israel is all the more reason for a speedy resolution to our speaker issue so the Gang of Eight can get to work.
Ted, with respect for the obvious truth in your statement, please remember that Israel’s Arab neighbors have vowed to wipe Israel off the face of the world. Repeatedly. No Arab country willingly accepts Palestinian refugees. Why not? Though there are obvious ties to Iran in this conflict, will we discover other Arab countries/autocratic countries are also contributing? We already know that Russia is helping. Why? Obvious answer is to attack the US and further destabilize us.
What about the ongoing problems in the region in Syria and Yemen? Why so little focus on solving war and famine there from the Arab world? (The origins of the civil war in Syria are water rights for shepherds and farmers who were just shut off from access in the deepening drought that continues there. The climate crisis on steroids)
Rep. Ilhan Omar of MN has repeatedly raised the problem of the human rights abuses of the Palestinians but each time, she veered off into anti-semitic remarks on the floor of the House. The last time it happened, Pelosi publicly and roundly chastised and then disciplined her. So how and who speaks for Palestinians here? Without demonizing a people whose history is full of attempts to extirpate them?
Sheila, your comments are well founded. Why hasn't Israel's Arab neighbors been questioned about their vow to wipe Israel off the face of the earth? What prompted this vow? Without getting into the weeds, could it be that Israel's Arab neighbors have broken every treaty and agreement between the allied powers, the U.S. and Israel, going back more than 70 years? More recently, Israel gave up the Gaza under Israel's prime minister Ariel Sharone. What did they get in return? Bloodshed and violence from Hamas, a front group for Iran. Why hasn't Jordan absorbed some of the millions of Palestinians living in dire straights? In fact, why hasn't any of Israel's Arab neighbors who complain of the treatment being meted out by Israel willing to help? The answer lies in Iran and Russia's interest in toppling the international order.
No problem there Sheila. Still someone (Israel) has to stop pushing and start to realize they are a large part of the problem. To tell the Palestinians "we will stop building and then keep building" Well......
You’re right, we women do not go that evil route. We are prime negotiators, deal-makers. We multi-task and we’re damn good at it. I honestly believe more girls/women will forego having children after all of these events. They do not want to bring others humans into a very chaotic world.
But some are cheering the arses on, met some this weekend wearing their “God is love” tee shirts and chump caps. Pharisees all…. Kudos to the women resisting such phony power plays.
No 'mean girls' in your universe? Please listen to CSpan. To women in elected office, appointed office, in non-government groups such as the NRA, individuals phoning in.
Men do not have a monopoly on irrationality and violence. Women do not have a monopoly on reason and conciliation.
"Mean girls" has zero equivalency to actual rape, pillage, massacres, killing, bombing. Women rarely kill other people's children - occasionally their own. They will kill defensively to protect but as a group not the aggressors. And, women did not create weapons or continually improve their "effectiveness". The elderly, women, disabled, and children do bear the brunt of violence regardless of the "reason" or "justification" for war and violence because they end up literally caught in the crossfire. None of that is political commentary on the deadly situation in the Middle East.
Read history. Read the newspapers. Look at the Greek and Hindu gods. Women's human potential for violence is only limited to certain spheres by their social and political subjugation - not by innate characteristics.
You know what, Lin . You really should give us a chance to take the lead. Women could not possibly do a worse job tham men throughout history. It has been war, war and more war. Great Record ! Last night we watched “ The Deer Hunter” and I was on the verge of tears throughout. Those heedless, goofy boys in the beginning and the broken, lost men at the end of their tour in Vietnam. How awful to face this again and again. I do think I have better innate characteristics. I wish I had the power.
lin', you are only focusing on innate as causal. By violence, I mean, words, actions, and neglect. Conditioning by families and other instiutions and organization in society is much more to blame than the innate. Look more deeply and you will find that violence and neglect coupled with the absence of sufficient unconditional love in a family often creates violent behavior patterns. Sadly, some families are the place where violence is conditioned and passed through generations. Other institutions and organizations support that conditioning with the violence, not love, they put out into the world. Unconditional love does not create violence.
You are right, IMO, Lin, men have no monopoly on irrationality and violence. We have would-be dictators here in the U.S. among our fremale population. But as to the broader problem in Israel, which was Palestine for 2,000 years, and where Israel hadn't existed for 2700 years, I recommend two books by an israelie history professor who fought in the Six-day War - Shlomo Sand, author of "The Invention of the Jewish People" and also "The Invention of the Land of Israel." They add some insight to a problem that in my viewpoint is irreconcilable.
Sand in fact does not consider the situation irreconcilable. He takes the stance of working from where we are. "He supports Israel's existence "not because of historical right, but because of the fact that it exists today and any effort to destroy it will bring new tragedies." (Wikipedia)
'Working from where we are' is a stance that best facilitates negotiations. It puts the past in its place for the purpose of moving forward. Don't bring your apologetics and grievances. Bring your aspirations and practical strategies for achieving justice as fairness going forward.
A major hindrance is power in the hands of right wing religious extremists. A lesson going forward for Americans. The unprecedented political success of right wing religious extremists and the attending unprecedented failure of intelligence in Israel - the ideological degradation of democratic institutions - should be a warning about the dangers America is bringing on itself by the deadly frivolities of Republicans. From Charles Koch and his bagman Leonard Leo's court capture to Mitch McConnell hedging his bets on Trump by keeping a Trump candidacy running, to the Freedom Caucus House follies.
The friction between and among Islam, Christianity and Judaism is toxic. Religious beliefs are generally not subject to rational discourse. Here in the U.S., while the Religious Right exerts itself politically, I think that the principal motivator is racism. Why would Evangelicals follow the word of Trump instead of Christ (Matthew 25: 34-46?) It's because, in my opinion, that their racism is stronger in them than their commitment to the words of Jesus. (For the record, I don't believe that a person named Jesus as represented in the New Testament ever existed, but the Evangelicals do.)
The Battle for God by Karen Armstrong was published in 2000 but is still the best explanation for the fundamentalist developments in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.
Responding to the stress of change by trying to turn mythos into logos looks to me to be the basis for all the authoritarian movements in the west.
Lin, I agree with most of what you have said. However, looking at only the present conditions in Gaza ignores the historical record. Kevin McCarthy found out that agreements matter. Trust is paramount. I am sure you're aware that the League of nations signed off on a home for Israel. The Balfour Declaration, the Picot agreement, four major wars, and four Presidents have not succeeded in bringing peace to the region. Ariel Sharone removed all of his troops from Gaza. Israeli settlers that lived there for years were evicted from their homes and absorbed elsewhere. Why hasn't one of Gaza's neighbors accepted the Gazan's? Why has Iran taken a vow to wipe Israel off the face of the earth. People that place explosives under their own peoples'homes could care less about the Gazans. Each war brings the same criticism of Israel, not the Palestinians or their enablers. Yes, these supporters give lip service to the way Hamas treats their people ad indoctrinates their children, but there is always a BUT the Israelis are to blame in the final analysis.! The criticism works for those that see the Palestinians as the victims. I submit that there are two sides to this story. The Israeli gov't has made tremendous sacrifices in the hope of achieving a lasting peace and have utterly failed!
lin˙, the words, "women can be just as bad as men" is a false equivalency statement because it implies that men and women are equally responsible for propagating and perpetrating violence.
But all humans are equally capable and responsible for violence. The human potential is there in all settings. And given the political power, in warfare as well - Margaret Thatcher and the Falklands War.
I guess we should not forget, too soon, that it was Hillary Clinton, who, in 2011/2012, pushed hard for Obama to arm the "rebels" in Syria. Thus began the huge mess in Syria that has led to more than a decade of civil war and the largest human diaspora since WW II and the largest human diaspora from the Middle East in history.
Obama, out of office, once said that arming those rebels was the single worst decision of his administration.
Hillary's passion for blood decision did lead, ultimately, to the largest human diaspora from the Middle East (to Europe, the US, South America and Australia) in middle eastern history.
Hillary's bloodlust decision, which resulted in that large human migration to Europe, is the most significant reason that far right parties are gaining power in Europe now due to the massive immigration of "different" people to Europe.
One could say that Hillary's desire for blood, by arming a bunch of bloodthirsty "rebels", in the hopes of deposing Bashar Al Assad has destabilized the entire world and not be wrong.
Let us not forget the women with poor judgement that have massively affected our planet as well as the men.
As for Hamas, IF I was living in the West Bank as an Arab, I would probably be a member.
Since 1948 when the US army forcibly cleared the Arabs out of Jerusalem and forced them into camps without much food or water and without care for their children the Arabs have been beyond poorly treated by Israel and the US.
.....AND, now as Israel breaks all of its agreements about not building in the West Bank and as Israel CONTINUES to bulldoze Arab houses in the West Bank, sometimes with the grandma STILL IN THE HOUSE, I figure I would have a particular burn too.
The mess that the US created in 1948 just goes on and on and on and on.
Thank you for your feedback. What I wrote is exactly the truth of history. It is not me that is speaking, it is our history. We should not forget it because we like Hillary.
If we do, how are we different from a Republican who wants to forget Reagan, Bush, and Trump?
Mike, history is important, as well as the covert decisions made by diplomats engaged in multi- level international chess games to further specific agendas. Thanks for going beyond today’s news to offer “root causes” of mass immigrations of people away from their lands. I was never a Hillary fan; her cold calculating manner was unsettling to me but my point is, someone starting accusing “men” in general for the world’s violence; you offered a rebuttal using Clinton. Don’t shut up about Clinton, she’s earned her critics with her own actions; she is no sacred cow
You know what struck me from your comment? “Her cold calculating manner.” If she were anything other as SoS, she’d have been characterized a hysterical woman. Her display of a style of management highly prized in a man is denigrated in a woman. I don’t mean to say you’re sexist—I only mean either way, as a woman, she’d be criticized. Been there, done that.
I’ve admittedly been weak on my studies about the Middle East. I always felt that I was coming in at the middle of the story and was so confused. It’s only been the last few years that I’ve tried to grasp the history of this entire area.
This attack was horrific, and certainly the ‘surprise’ factor raises a lot of questions as Dr. R suggests!
I guess my ultimate confusion is that Israel was created (this is a gross oversimplification) in an area populated by other people. And that alone seems like a recipe for trouble. And Netanyahu has been telling the residents of Gaza to get out?! This is really confusing for me to understand! They can’t, am I right about this?
I guess I’m having trouble seeing this as a black and white issue.
Both sides have been complicit in prolonging the disharmony it seems?!
I certainly hope that you don’t react negatively to my comments, it just seems so impossible to resolve?
Yes, you understand correctly. Jews who survived the Nazis were homeless and landless. They needed a place to go. Israel was created. Trouble was, there were already people living there. Their farms and homes were taken and now they were displaced. Areas they were shoved into and/or promised to them have shrunk. Israel has not been an accommodating landlord, and Bibi in particular has become more and more right wing. Most of the Israeli people want there to be peace but Bibi has no interest. There is absolutely no future for young Palestinians. It’s the saddest situation on earth. It’s also complex.
MLMinET. Israel wasn't just created without the agreement in 1920 from the allied powers and the U.S. The land that was promised to them in the balfour declaration was reneged on. Churchill, in order to get the cooperation of his friend Abdullah the land promised to the Jews by 80% in order to create Trans Jordan the land that does not presently allow Palestinians to enter. The facts do matter.
My sentiments exactly. I too I only have limited knowledge of this geography and history and remain quiet on these issues due to ignorance.
I will say though as a Jew my heart has gone out to the Palestinians caught in this crossfire. I visited Israel some years ago and my overall feeling of the country was one of terror and sadness.
Cynthia, it's certainly complex and definitely not black and white. It's made more complex over the years as insults, real and perceived, have compounded over the decades. One point: Both Israeli and Palestinian societies are complex and have internal rivalries that create inconsistencies and problems as different factions cycle into power. Another point: Palestinians are not part of any surrounding Arab country. Jordan didn't want the West Bank Palestinians and Egypt restricts movement of Gaza Palestinians. Many of those Palestinians' parents used to live within the present day boundary of Israel, but were displaced just before and during the 1948 conflict. They have been a people at society's margins since before the start of the 20th century, before the creation of Israel. The reality is that originally, there isn't any good reason for an Arab-Israeli conflict.
Palestinians, unfortunately, never had an effective advocate, partially because they are originally migrants from other parts of the Middle Eat and N Africa. Jews did have advocates and also garnered sympathy after the Holocaust. When the UN voted to create 2 countries, one for Palestinians and the second for Jews to join the Jews already there, Arab countries rejected that plan and invaded the fledgling Israel in 1948.
It gets ever more complex from that point. Both sides have made egregious errors since, and both have reason to point blame at the other. But the underlying origin story is important to keep in mind as one hears the hostile accusations. I'm leaving out the 1967 war, the rise of Al Fatah, the Palestinian Authority, and Hamas. I'm leaving out the 1973 war exactly 50 years ago, another surprise invasion by surrounding Arab countries. I'm leaving out the rise of militant Jewish factions that have grown in influence and are now, in different forms, part of the governing coalition leading Israel. I'm leaving out Syrian, Egyptian, Jordanian and Lebanese politics. I'm leaving out the influence exerted over the years by Saudi Arabia, Iran, Turkey, Russia, the U.S. and various groups within it.
It's a hot mess, while millions of Israelis and Palestinians just want to live their lives. Individually, they are hard working, respectful, idealistic, and even funny. I've visited there multiple times a year for decades (personal and business), and I still don't understand it. I do hold the conviction tthat regardless of any legal excuse, Israel should never have allowed Jewish settlements to be built in the West Bank.
Jerry, Iran has vowed to wipe Israel off the face of the earth? Why hasn't any of Israel's Arab neighbors rejected that vow? They have reneged on every treaty and agreement brokered between the allied powers, the U.S and Israel going back more than 70 years.
You summarized Israel's history, but left out the fact that Jordan did not exist before Churchill reduced Palestine, the land originally promised to Israel by the allied powers and the U.S. by 80%. Churchill was seeking the cooperation from his friend Abdullah II and created Trans Jordan. That is the land Gaza's Palestinians inhabited and should inhabit today. Palestinians were not ejected from Israel. Many Palestinians stayed and are represented in the Israeli gov't today.
Yes, yes. but I was trying to keep the history simple and focused so I can respond to another comment. Of course Palestinians were not completely ejected from what is today's Israel, but many did leave their homes in anticipation of an anticipation of an Arab victory in 1948, which never happened and which meant they were then unable to return to their homes.
Cynthia, in describing your own understanding of the history, you've also described mine, to some extent. I've been watching for some time and have some Jello opinions I don't express because I'm sure I don't fully understand the complexities of the system. I'm keeping my ears open and hope someone offers us a little more insight.
Cite your source for the US Arny pushing Arabs out of Jerusalem. It was part of a region controlled by England at that time. That's just one turd you aim to spread. In general, you mix pearls of truth with propaganda, making you unbelievable. Stick to the facts that show U.S., Arab, and Israeli missteps that is the tragedy of errors that is the Arab/Israeli conflict, and you might get some intelligent replies. Until then, you keep sounding like a Russian troll.
Mike, this whole post seems rather unlike you. In particular, the part about US troops in Jerusalem in 1948? The British Army in Transjordan generally sided with Jordanian forces, but the British Army forces holding Jerusalem at the time seems to have supported, or at least tried to protect the Jewish population. I can’t find any documentation of US troops on the ground there. What are you talking about? We’re you thinking of some other date?
What you claim, that a sub-sector of men, not all men, are responsible for violence is a fair statement. But similarly, not all women are peace makers, and are perfectly capable of cruelty in their quest for, and retention of political power. There are so many examples in history of extremely cruel women, though clearly fewer than examples of men, because for much of history, men have wielded political and social power through patriarchy. The belief that women are less violent is rooted in socialization across cultures that teaches "feminine" virtues. In the nature vs. nurture debate, such feminine virtues and behaviors seem less natural than is supposed.
Ummm, please be careful with commentary that might be interpreted as tar and feathering half the population. Do the names Sidney Powell, Lauren Boebert, MTG ring any bells? Hardly nurturing and caring individuals. Have you noted the sex of half the supporters of the Beast in his rallies? I don't disagree that testosterone is a dangerous thing. Just keep in mind its Boris AND Natasha that were causing chaos and women can be just as venal, greedy and pitiless as men when it come to the pursuit of power and control.
For a moment, there, I was trying to see parallels between Rocky and Bullwinkle and today's American political parties, but the world has changed too much, and I've yet to get a sip of coffee.
Marlene, Janet, Jeri, Daniel, can we please leave the gender issues out of the discussion? Joe and Jill Biden are encouraging examples of two extraordinary individuals of opposite sex who have striven and continue to strive to make this world a more just and equitable place for all people.
I do apologize, Peter G. I had no intention of making my comment s as nothing about ‘gender’, or ‘sexist’ in any way. I was merely stating that all my years in law enforcement I had dealt with quite a collection of women who were quite vicious in their ways. I’ll gone step even further, for your sake, and say that I also dealt with men who were the same.
Also, a lot if the viciousness brought on by a lot of women were the cause of their men, spouses, relationships, etc. When a woman is abused by any man, and they retaliate, she should be given a medal, not prosecuted, or persecuted.
Thanks, Daniel. We suffer as a society from over reaction to the attitudes of a few misfits, like Matt Gaetz or Lauren Boebert or, in your case, a small minority of bad apple police officers, when we extrapolate their extremism to their more professional colleagues. That is our bad and the credible media hardly helps when it succumbs to amplifying such attitudes.
You are correct. The media has a really bad habit of amplifying the bad apples in the bushel. No matter if it’s in law enforcement, firefighters, first responders, or any business, but they never amplify the good that we did. Ever. But, personally, I never did what I did in my career for any praise or amplification. If the news cameras showed up, I went the other way, or found someplace to hide. I was undercover to much to be on camera in a popo uniform!
As suggested yesterday, please contact your Republican Congresscritters and urge them to get back to DC and sort out the mess they have made by giving in to the far-right members of their party.
I will again contact Don Bacon as he has shown at times that he can be reasonable unlike the majority of the Republicans caucus.
All caused by men? Please. There is a long list of female big mess contributors and perpetuators. Maggie Thatcher was evil incarnate. I’ll give you a solid majority assertion that men are the issue, but ‘all’ is fallacious. Here’s one of our own contributors to the ‘effing mess’:
Marlene, I agree. The men who have oversized, rampant, dastardly egos cause violence and destruction everywhere they go. Thankful, for the men who are not like this.
Marlene Lerner-Bigley (CA), I felt compelled to respond to your post because I shared in your justified anger at the men who start conflicts and wars that always destroy the innocents more than them. I was also touched by your example of the brave Iranian woman. I didn't know if you were generalizing all men or not, so I just responded in a way that would make my anger clear, that I was not generalizing. But when I reread my comment, I can see how you may have thought I was assuming you were generalizing. I apologize for that. It was not my intent. I think my choice of the word, though, was not the best choice. I will think on it to see how I can change it to better reflect my intent and thoughts.
I was blaming men, then I realized it's not the male of the species, it's the species. The human race is the only mammal where the males play at games that destroy the homes of the women and children that they should be, like the other mammals, protecting. From what I can see, the females are complicit.
And, what a joke that humans think they are godlike.
What if Native Americans or Black people rised up and took revenge for the hundreds of years of abuse, neglect, and cruelty? Many of us would not blame them, or even ask, what took them so long. I had that thought about Jan. 6th. If it was Black people or NA's, it would be understandable, but it was white men who could afford to take the day off and travel to the Capitol, and who have the LEAST excuse to attack this country.
AMEN! And it’s funny that you bring this up because I was having exactly the same conversation with a friend of mine 2 days ago. What the R’s are afraid of is that the white race is shrinking and so is organized religion. That’s why the fundamentalists and white supremacists acted out. They too, want to eliminate Jews and Blacks from society.
Marlene, (I like that name -- it was also my mother's, after Marlene Dietrich) as a man rounding 3rd n the game of life, I heartily concur. The world would be a different --and better-- place if ruled by women. I've long believed that. However, I also believe tranquility wouldn't last, as men would no doubt seek to depose their female leaders and revert to their (our) ways which I believe are as embedded in our DNA as much as maternal instincts are in yours. Perhaps in 10,000 or so years, should we last as a species, we will have a single gender, blending the characteristics of male and female most likely to lead to our long term survival.
Netanyahu just may be cold blooded enough (unsurprising for being the intensifier big time of apartheid in Israel and included the naked unpunished military murder of the clearly marked woman as a (Palestinian) journalist to have known about the attack beforehand but purposely remained silent figuring the Israeli human sacrifice "for the homeland" was worth the opportunity to smash the Palestinians into bits (with Israel's far superior military force/money) which has been his playbook for a long time. Anyone believing the propaganda about the Palestinians were "unprovoked" has been living on Mars. Israel's treatment of the Palestinians has been utterly repugnant and unacceptable and relentless for years.
And the Settler crazies (most of them Americans) who have been assaulting Palestinian farms and villages for the past year with the connivance of the Kach terrorist Itzhak Ben Gvir, who Nitwityahoo gave the Interior Ministry to (putting the coyote in charge of the chicken coop) who has allowed the assaults to go uninvestigated and unpunished are the ones directly responsible for creating the "sea" for the Hamas "fish" to swim in.
Nitwityahoo is now finding out what his fucking around for the past 20 years has created. And Israel is paying for letting him and the far right fascists take control. And all so Bibi doesn't have to go to jail for his personal corruption.
I agree, TC! The Likud Party is made up of mostly ultra-Orthodox men who have only one thing in mind and that is to occupy the entire West Bank. Netanyahu is not the architect but he is a strong supporter of more settlements there. I can’t stomach him! He is Israel’s Trump. The liberal Israelis will blame him and rightfully so. I feel badly for the progressive Israelis and for the Palestinians. The Palestinian people have never been properly taken care of by Hamas.
Right with you again, Marlene! and TC! I need to shut down and try to get to sleep as it is 2:30am on the East Coast and unlike Heather, I'm useless on 4 hours of shut eye!!
Marlene, I agree, but would like to caution you about smearing all of the Likud party with being all ultra-orthodox and supportive of total takeover of the West Bank. That's like calling all American Republicans haters of democracy. Both have allowed ugly factions to take over their political agendas.
Jerry, as the daughter of Holocaust survivors, I will call out every single person who tries to take away democracies from people using violence, lies, rape, and thievery!
“the settler crazies.” I just commented on them In reply to Selena’s comment. They’ve been assaulting the Palestinians the past year??? They’ve been categorically assaulting them since 1948….
Well there you go...couple that with all of a sudden allowing Jews to pray at the Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem and what do you think is going to happen? These actions and the demeaning treatment toward the Palestinians is pure provocation....
Good point, TC. Mossad is considered the best intelligence service in the world. The fact that Israel was “surprised” by this attack would either indicate that Mossad isn’t in bed with Netanyahu, or that he ignored the info on purpose. When Biden says, “we stand ready to offer all appropriate means of support to the Government and people of Israel,” he probably means to separate the two so he can address them individually when he needs to.
I get this TC, I read your letter right before Dr.R’s. Perfect companion pieces. I’m a late bloomer on the Middle East, but I’m trying to dig in and get caught up. Would appreciate any suggestions for any good books that can help me understand.
I’m about halfway through the ‘Rise and Fall of the Third Reich’, and I would love to transition to this subject after....
“The Great War for Civilization: The Conquest of the Middle East” by Robert Fisk is probably the best overview book I have ever read on the Middle East and the reasons why we have the problems there today, brace yourself it’s sobering. There’s no way we can look at what’s happening in Israel 🇮🇱 today with understanding without seeing the “why”, there are many good books about the Middle East, this would be a primer for all of the others.
Susan, I am no expert on any of this, just another human who wonders how humans are always trying to oppress other humans and have been since our existence it seems.
My view has seen the Israelis as super aggressive oppressors of the Palestinians, constantly pushing them from their homeland and violently so quite often.
What makes you hold such a different view and how do you come by it? Seriously. I'm not looking for a fight, just understanding of different perspective.
Thank you. You said it much better than I ever could have. I have wondered how the vaunted Israeli intelligence missed the build up. That just doesn't seem possible. So innocent lives on both sides become the pawns in a game of power, and in this case, how to stay in power.
You said it better than I could. I have always felt that it is Israel fault for building more and more on the West Bank taking away the Palestinian s land. Feel they think they can do whatever they want because we will support them.
Yep, we have enabled Bibi and he has run amok. I used to have unquestioned support for Israel, but Lordy, that was back when Vanessa Redgrave supported Arafat.
In the elapsed time between 9/11/2001 and the second Iraq war, I thought that perhaps the Bush administration knew about 9/11, based on their actions afterward to exploit the situation to lie and start a disinformation campaign and get us back into Iraq. But they probably didn't know. They were just being evil in their willingness to exploit the situation. And deep down they were probably glad 9/11 happened, certainly Cheney and Rumsfeld.
Given the numerous warnings they apparently received from foreign intelligence, I would assume the Bush administration was well aware a major incident was about to unfold.
I do think that they believed that the targets would be military institutions. I remember that the Defense Language Institute stopped public access in August 2001. Two of my thoughts on 9/11 were "the gatez will never open again" and "Bush is going to find a way to blame this on Iraq, so se can attack them." (I had just read Shrub, in which Molly Ivins described how obsessed Bush was in "finishing" daddy Bush's job in Iraq)
I remember the first thought I had when I looked at the TV and saw the second plane hit the twin towers. "Now we get to find out what 'fuck around and find out' means."
Well said, Ms Sweet. And anyone that doesn't realize by now that Israel has been the US's proxy in that region forever is wearing blinders. We are fully complicit in the horrific conditions the Palestinians have been subjected to under Netanyahu in particular. This violence should have come as a surprise to no one.
And he also gotten the suppport that was waning dramatically. Suddenly he has people enlisting in the army where they were losing personnel. A shared enemy can bring people together. Win-win for Bibi.
Selena, my sentiments exactly. This Hamas comparison to 9/11 is the surprise element only. We didn’t subjugate Saudis into submission cruelly turning them into second class citizens to extract their revenge. Although Hamas igniting such loss of life shatters my heart, I understand human nature. Israelis stripping Palestinians of their property and freedom hurts. I saw it first hand. When in Israel, after asking our Palestinian driver what it was like living there, he pointed to these huge dazzling white villas that settlers had built on seized Palestinian land and wouldn’t allow the Palestinians in their neighborhood. Not to mention the hundreds of thousands Palestinians displaced and thrown out of their homes since 1948. After a while, the brutality of your neighbor takes its toll and reaches a breaking point…,
Senator Bernie Sanders has said , that it is time for the state of Israel to begin treating the Palestinians like human beings. If Israel had heeded his advice this might have been avoided. But their inhumane policies continued; for example they have a practice of randomly demolishing a Palestinian home to exact retribution for various attacks. Since they are often unable to pinpoint who is responsible for aggression they punish anyone they choose. This is contrary to the Geneva Conventions and is a war crime. Although the U.S. might condemn such action, words alone will not stop such atrocities. True , Hamas is just as lawless and both sides keep the hostile actions going and going. There was combat in 1948 when Israel officially came into existence and todays news is no different than what has been going on for 75 years. I would suggest that the UN send in peace keeping troops after a ceasefire can be established. Until then , the killing and hostage taking will go on.
No kidding. I have never understood why they all can't just share the land. I realize the naiveté of my over simplistic view and just detest this innocent loss of life.
My fear is that generations having grown up with the "fight" on both sides, will not know how to live in peace. Then again, I have heard stories about the people living in peace. So maybe it's the politicians who benefit from a lack of peace.
Marj, I am with you. I have a somewhat pedestrian view of that part of the world (solidly founded on my absolute non-belief in any of the religions originating in that area) and my beliefs and opinions are not based on any actual knowledge.
My understanding is that Israel has given Palestinians all the same rights as Israeli citizens, minus actual citizenship, as long as they obey Israeli law.
Israel gives the Palestinians all the rights of a wild animal. Sparta used to declare an annual war on its captive populations, and allow any Spartan to kill any one of them without repercussion. That's the model for Israeli rule.
Thank you for telling both sides of the story. If the Hamas attack was a terrorist attack, so have all the attacks by the Israeli Defense Forces and Israeli settlers in Palestine been terrorist attacks. As an 81 year old cultural American Jew, I have long been against Israel’s horrible treatment of Palestinians. Most of the world’s riches go toward war and “defense” largely because there’s money in conflict, most of which is artificial. Politicians who profit from this state of affairs should be voted out of office and, perhaps, tried and convicted of war crimes.
As long as Israel continues along the policy of subjugating and containing the Palestinians and aggressively establishing Jewish settlements in the West Bank, they can expect endless conflict in the form of uprisings from one faction or another of the political organizations that represent the Palestinian cause for independence. We can call them terrorist organizations for their tactics and their manifestos, but given that they don't have access to the industrial capacity to build a real war machine, they will continue to use what they have at their disposal. I visited Jerusalem almost 30 years ago and the status of the Palestinians has only deteriorated in the interim. Israel, of all nations, whose history across millennia is filled with periods of subjugation and cultural violence, should recognize that there is no "solution" in their treatment of another culture with similar claims to the same ground across more than a thousand years, whose 3rd holiest site is on the same temple mount as was once the Jewish nation's Temple. There's a fundamental difference between supporting Israel's security from external threats and taking sides in it's internal affairs, especially in a state of conflict which dates far further back than the establishment of the modern Jewish state. I'm sorely disappointed that our response to this inherently unstable state of affairs is to pledge unwavering support for Israel, not unlike the unthinkable concept of supporting South Africa under apartheid. The Jewish nation's history of oppression and our solidarity with their right to exist does not provide them an indefinite pass in how they treat inhabitants within their borders who demand recognition at a similar status.
When I was in grad school 50 years ago, I knew an Israeli Sabra classmate who had been a platoon commander in the IDF company that liberated the Wailing Wall in 1967. He told me that as they worshiped there for the first time in 20 years, he heard his company commander say "God, help us - we won." Israel squandered all of that when they let the Kach Krazies (all Americans) in to the West Bank.
The Israel of today, an apartheid State, armed to the teeth, funded with American taxpayers' money, and run by the narcissistic Netanyahu and the religious fanatics, would be unrecognizable to the leaders of Israel in years past. Thinking of Meir, Dayan, Eban, etc.
Absolutely! Apartheid nation is the first thing that came to mind as I saw what Israel has become. Without US support, Israel would have been forced into either a two-state solution or coexistence with the Palestinians.
Have you read O Jerusalem? It’s a masterpiece about the struggle for control of Jerusalem in 1948 as the British left. I read it decades ago. It has helped me understand the fierceness of both sides. However, that struggle has become infested by extremists in Israel, and that daily subjugation of Palestinians now existing in a ‘jail like’ strip has become intolerable especially under Nithoho’s thumbs.
Just Sayin, Thank you and others in this thread for pointing to Israel's role in its own pain: their failure to see Palestinian people as deserving life. I was appalled to hear Biden's "unwavering" support for Israel. I had foolishly expected him to say that the US would be suspending all financial aid to Israel until a solution is found that is life-giving for the Palestinians. Then I reasoned that there is no way our government can function unless Biden is re-elected and he can't expect support unless the "terrorists" are opposed and the beleaguered are supported. This position, while "disappointing" (to use a common euphemism in the public sphere for something closer to "maddening") is just one more example of how tough it is to navigate in this world. We are always having to weigh means and ends, realities, the impossibility of effecting the actual change we want to see. It's part of the tragedy of human life.
Yes. It is a terrible conundrum. I already got an email from the New York State Democratic Party asserting its unequivocal support of Israel. It's one of the few issues on which Democrats and Republicans seem to agree at the highest level.
Well outlined Just Sayin', however, what keeps appearing from both, all three, ALL sides of conflicts over Israel's existence or any state in the Middle East seems to be the ethic, almost the requirement for vengeance, "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" kind of thinking, codified in the Christian Old Testament as well as in the Koran. Israel has appeared over time to have escalated that to the Roman tactic of "decimation," retaliating tenfold. This has left them with bordering populations which themselves cannot eliminate their core dedication to the erasure of Israel, a stance rendering any diplomatic or even practical solutions virtually impossible. Adding to that state of affairs the ever more authoritarian stance of Netanyahu and it is difficult to imagine any real solution emerging from these wars and attacks no matter who gets involved.
I saw it too. well worth a read. Among other things I appreciated the closing paragraph:
“So it’s partly a search for history but it’s also partly a search to feel like you understand the world again, which is hard to do when you’re being bombarded with hearings and lies and all that kind of crap. I actually think that the meaning of it is less about history than it is about returning to a reality based community.”
I like the "ring" of "a reality based community". It seems to me that this will remain aspirational, since Nature never fully shows her hand, but we "clever" primates have been able to dope out enough of the code to get some good things done; and of course, a lot of mischief. I want to better know reality because, it seems to me, that Reality Rules. We can play all the games we want; reality always holds (expletive deleted). Reality isn't always fun, or even fair, but it seems we have potential, by learning her ways, to more often stay on her good side. That seems self-evidently a wise and existential choice.
JL Graham, Marvelously put down. “…been able to dope out enough of the code” “…since nature never fully shows her hand” “…isn’t always fun or even fair”. “…to more often stay on her good side.” All so finely wrought. I’m a lover of allowing truth to reveal herself, and being prepared to notice.
I am reminded of a memorable passage from a 2004, the New York Times story about the impact of the still-under-construction Large Hadron Collider on the credibility of String Theory:
"Dr. Shenker said it would be great to find out that string theory was right.
From the audience Dr. Greene piped up, "Wouldn't it be great either way?"
'Are you kidding me, Brian?' Dr. Shenker responded. 'How many years have you sweated on this?'
But if string theory is wrong, Dr. Greene argued, wouldn't it be good to know so physics could move on? 'Don't you want to know?' he asked."
It's not just for technical subjects. The Guardian also recently ran a story titled " ‘We have to come to grips with history’: Robert P Jones on The Hidden Roots of White Supremacy" https://www.theguardian.com/books/2023/sep/09/robert-p-jones-book-roots-white-supremacy-trump-biden-race which is an excellent read. I suspect there may be even deeper roots to racism than the "doctrine of discovery" but it proved to be very popular rationale for societal sociopathy. Tyranny always seems to indulge in faux-lofty bogus justifications. The article cites Biden, who is not my ideal president, but a refreshingly thoughtful one most of the time and for whom I am thankful:
The 46th president urged America to face its history with all its peaks and troughs, blessings and blemishes. He told an audience in the White House grounds: 'We can’t just choose to learn what we want to know. We have to learn what we should know. We should know about our country. We should know everything: the good, the bad, the truth of who we are as a nation. That’s what great nations do, and we are a great nation.'
Biden added, a little bleakly: 'We got a hell of a long way to go' .”
Figuring stuff out, or attempting to, can not only be satisfying, its a survival skill.
I read the Guardian article but did not buy the book. It’s not on Kindle yet. The article had an impact on me greatly widening my perspective on the origins of white Christian’s inhumanity to man. How did it become so ingrained and so accepted and how did it last so long without being stopped? Sounds like the edict issued by Nicholas V in 1452 was the first written rationale for condoning barbarism among white Christians. They took it from there. Genocide of the indigenous inhabitants of “America”, kidnapping and enslavement of Africans, human trafficking, our prison system, the suffocation of the middle class, and the ostracism of the poor.
It was certainly an organized effort to excuse sociopathy. Extreme predatory sociopathy, Hitler's Nazis being one such example, seem indistinguishable, at least in effect, to what is often called "evil". Do some people lack a gene for compassion? It's possible. I have heard it professionally claimed; but our own capacities for compassion seem selective, my own included, and whole societies seem vulnerable to "Doublethink" injustices. Biden said it: 'We got a hell of a long way to go' to meet our own celebrated standards. "Normalized" injustice is hard to pry loose because so many have adapted and are to that degree invested in it. The arrogant cruelty of the murder of Emmet Till was so out there that I pierced the fog of "normalcy", and the Civil Rights movements aimed to keep that and similar horrors be pushed into the background consciousnesses of those who were not directly affected.
The fact that injustice has a very long history does not make it any more acceptable; only more pernicious.
JL , I Wish, ALL, of MANKIND, Could 'WAKE UP !" ' , & Smell the COFFEE ! . " Mother Nature, Reality, WISDOM !, .... ALL FALL, INTO One CATAGORY ! , Our LORD/GOD! , ALMIGHTY !! ( Remember, " HIS WILL, ....WILL be DONE ! OUR Very 'Exsistance' , is HIS WILL ! Gentle Quenching Rain, ..... OR ! 90 to 130 POUND HAILSTONES !! ( REVELATION 16, Verse 21 ) Will, BE! , HIS WILL !! You ! Are Absolute ! to SAY !, " I Wanna' BE !, ON GODS , SIDE !! " HAVE FAITH !, PRAY !, ( ALOT! ) AND! THE ONE "VOTE", That REALLY COUNTS . * GODS WILL, .....BE DONE !! BLESSINGS !!
No one wants to read something filled with all caps. They skip it. If you have something you want to share please express it in a few words that hold your intention of what you are trying to say.
This guy is all about lame efforts for an attention grab, sans anything relevant to contribute. Very annoying and insulting to HCR's excellent work and her readers.
I like your comment. And as far as reality is concerend, it is what bothers me so much about the parents who want to protect their children from difficult subjects in school. The parent can, and should, point out the the ulitmate reason for learning such subjects, that it is not to make anyone feel bad but instead to help us understand and do better in the future.
I think that kids can understand that they stand on the shoulders of the work and innovations of countless generations, but that they also inherit a legacy of their forerunner's follies and malice. It seems to me that "the young" often bring a fresh perspective to entrenched problems, that their elders tend to promote until the kids are old enough to start to impact their own entrenched society, at which point their potentially elevated aspirations rocks the boat, and the kids feel work-a-day survival pressure to adapt to the existing norms. Not that the solutions young people bring to the table are necessarily the best actionable choices, but that their perspective need to be and deserves to be taken seriously, as well as our "status quo" meaningfully questioned.
It seems to me that one of our societal rackets is to say, "Well it's too late for me, but the next generation will put it right". That just gets in the way. We as a whole society must determine, so far as it is within our power to determine, our own society's future. An abstention is as much of a vote as any. Ignorance and lies can kill; as COVID and many other aspects of our life demonstrate; and while no one can know it all, and even the aggregated wisdom of our entire species is inherently limited, attempted accuracy and honesty can be shown to be the best policy, and fortune favors the prepared mind.
After reading that article about Dr. Richardson, I am seriously considering a subscription with the paper/site/source-what do we call things things today? Do you get enough added value with a subscription to make it worth ?
I support The Guardian for much the same reason that I support HVR. The value of independent, informed voices is vital, particularly in these turbulent times.
Given this terrible attack, all of the world players are reacting quite as expected, so much so that the "larger hand behind the attack" may be hiding in plain sight. After all, the one party that benefits unequivocably from this attack is Benjamin Netanyahu and his Likud party. Did Hamas really expect to conquer Israel? Or are they merely strengthening the hostile polarity that keeps both themselves and Likud in power? I suspect the latter, since every time peace looks likely to break out in Israel and it's occupied territories, inexplicable provocations suddenly take place.
Hamas launched in 1988 in Gaza at the time of the first intifada, or uprising, with a charter now infamous for its anti-Semitism and its refusal to accept the existence of the Israeli state. But for more than a decade prior, Israeli authorities actively enabled its rise.
At the time, Israel's main enemy was the late Yasser Arafat's Fatah party, which formed the heart of the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO). Fatah was secular and cast in the mold of other revolutionary, leftist guerrilla movements waging insurgencies elsewhere in the world during the Cold War.
Meanwhile, the activities of Islamists affiliated with Egypt's banned Muslim Brotherhood were allowed in the open in Gaza — a radical departure from when the Strip was administered by the secular-nationalist Egyptian government of Gamal Abdel Nasser. Egypt lost control of Gaza to Israel after the 1967 Arab-Israeli war, which saw Israel also seize the West Bank. In 1966, Nasser had executed Sayyid Qutb, one of the Brotherhood's leading intellectuals. The Israelis saw Qutb's adherents in the Palestinian territories, including the wheelchair-bound Sheik Ahmed Yassin, as a useful counterweight to Arafat's PLO.
Israel's military-led administration in Gaza looked favorably on the paraplegic cleric, who set up a wide network of schools, clinics, a library and kindergartens. Sheikh Yassin formed the Islamist group Mujama al-Islamiya, which was officially recognized by Israel as a charity and then, in 1979, as an association. Israel also endorsed the establishment of the Islamic University of Gaza, which it now regards as a hotbed of militancy.
Yassin's Mujama would become Hamas. Israel jailed Yassin in 1984 on a 12-year sentence after the discovery of hidden arms caches, but he was released a year later.
After the 1993 Oslo accords, Israel's formal recognition of the PLO and the start of what we now know as the peace process, Hamas was the Israelis' bete noire. Hamas refused to accept Israel or renounce violence and became perhaps the leading institution of Palestinian resistance to Israeli occupation, which, far beyond religious ideology, is the main reason for its continued popularity among Palestinians.
Israel created Hamas like the US created the Taliban.
It's a reflection of the control the official narrative has over our consciousness that even our Heather writes that Hamas "gained control of the Gaza Strip in 2007" without mentioning that Hamas did so by winning that year's election for the Palestinian assembly! Immediately after that election, Israel imprisoned, with the aid of the Abbas clique, all the Hamas delegates from the West Bank, and closed off the Gaza strip. Israel and the PA have since worked together to isolate Gaza and made sure there would be no more elections.
There are actually roads Palestinians cannot take, requiring them to go around them to their homes. At a checkpoint our bus was boarded and our paperwork checked. We understood, though, this was fine promptly and quickly by the Israelis because we were American visitors; the Palestinians often had to wait hours to pass. Some women gave birth at the checkpoints, waiting there to pass on the way to a hospital.
And once again, a so-called "cakewalk" turned to quagmire. It is chilling to recall some of the puerile right-wing predictions about how willingly Iraq would become a Westernized client state. Terminal hubris confused with competence. Will we never learn to recognize the trap?
One must recognize the history that took place before Hamas was created. "The Balfour Declaration by the British government in 1917, enshrined in a League of Nations mandate in 1920, had said that a "national home for the Jewish people" would be founded in Palestine, while preserving the "civil and religious" rights of non-Jewish communities there." BBC.
Talk about the Mandate England had over Palestine. Talk about the agreement signed by the allied powers, the U.S and Israel at the time. Talk about Churchill reducing the land Israel was originally promised by 80%, in order to enlist his friend Abdullah's cooperation. Trans Jordan was created but never allowed Gaza's Palestinians to reside there. Israel in 1948 was the size of Connecticut. Talk about the fact that Israel never ejected Palestinians. They are represented in the Israeli gov't. today. I am not disputing that Netanyahu and his right wing extremists are a milignant force in Israel, but your analysis leaves out the historical record.
Why don't you go read about the Nakhba, and how Ariel Sharon made his first reputation running an ethnic cleansing operation. And you might check up on how much "freedom" the Israeli Arabs have as second-class citizens in Israel.
I just read the morning news update in the New York Times. There's an article about the history of Hamas. It has about 80% of the information I posted at That's Another Fine Mess (which BTW was easily found in 10 seconds on Google, with much coming from Wikipedia and an article written in 2014 by Mehdi Hasan, the last time this happened.) The missing 20% in the NYT article is about how Israel created Hamas to "divide and conquer" the Palestinian movement. This is how Americans become the most ill-informed people in the world, when even the nation's finest fishwrap can't print the whole truth.
I am not defending Ariel Sharon or Netanyahu. Why don't you stick to the subject at hand? I usually admire and support your well thought out comments, but I believe you have provided a one sided view on this conflict. History matters!
Next, the birth of Israel in 1948 was reduced to the Nakba, or catastrophe, a Palestinian narrative of total innocence that ignores the ethnic cleansing of Jews from every place where Arab armies were victorious and the subsequent uprooting of the entire Jewish population of the Muslim world. Post-1967 Israel was cast as an apartheid state – turning Zionism, a multi-faceted movement representing Jews across the political and religious spectrum into a racist ideology and reducing an agonizingly complex national conflict into a medieval passion play about Jewish perfidy.
And now, with the Gaza War, we have come to the genocide canard, the endpoint in the process of delegitimization.
Nitwityahoo is a compleat opportunist, out for himself - there's nothing he won't do if it helps Bibi. He'll take support from American "Christian Zionists" who are out to create the Battle of Armageddon in Israel so Robot Jeebus can come and throw all Jews but the 144,000 who will proclaim him the "messiah" into the fiery pit (It's there in the Bible). He'll ally with American fundamentalist religious extremists in the Settler movement who are fascist terrorists, if it keeps him out of jail for his corruption. He's the most dangerous kind of demagogue, because he will say and do anything since he believes in nothing but himself. Why do you think he and Trump get along so well? "Birds of a feather," as they say.
What do you mean “Mossad created Hamas”? I have never seen Mossad mentioned. I thought Hamas was a faction of the now defunct PLO was but I believe I was wrong.
This moment didn’t happen in a vacuum. The anti-Zionist forces in academia have been preparing the ground for decades, systematically dismantling the moral basis of each stage of Zionist and Israeli history.
The attack began on the very origins of Zionism, which was transformed from a story of a dispossessed people re-indigenizing in its ancient homeland into one more sordid expression of European colonialism. (Europe’s post-Holocaust gift to the Jews: leaving us with the bill for its sins.)
The consequence of totally nonfunctional legislative bodies in the US encourages other entities to wreak havoc, being certain that we have been emasculated by Republicans who really should emigrate to Mars or Venezuela. As the chant used to declare so forcefully, "The world is watching!"
Think you might chose a more gender neutral term than "emasculated" How about vitiated? I hate seeing our foreign policy cast as it has been so often in the past in terms of masculine swagger with the implication of swinging a big stick.
vitiate implies a destruction of purity, validity, or effectiveness by allowing entrance of a fault or defect. a foreign policy vitiated by partisanship.
VITIATE | definition in the Cambridge English Dictionary
I recall a chorus of "The whole world is watching", and sometimes a lot of it is, but we miss so much. The devil (and better angels) are so often in the details, which are very easy to miss, especially if we limit our attention to "If it bleeds, it leads" sources. The latter can be like performing brain surgery in boxing gloves. Sometimes disciplined, focused individuals can direct our attention to critical details we are apt to miss, or would rather not acknowledge.
I am inclined to view this attack as a byproduct of an intentional intelligence/security failure that has yielded Netanyahu precisely the excuse to engage in a devastating war against the two territories, with the added benefit of receiving international support. After all Netanyahu has a well known good relationship with Putin, and himself also has clearly and obviously been pursuing his own strong man agenda.
It definitely strikes me as a clever variation of Hitler’s Operation Himmler.
I visited Kfar Aza, a kibbutz on the edge of Gaza, in March. It was founded in 1951 by Jewish immigrants, many of whom were refugees from Egypt. Egypt expelled its Jews following Israel's declaration of statehood in 1948--around 75,000 people. Anyone volunteer to take in those Jews en masse? (Some did come to the US. I've heard their stories. They are not pretty.)
Kfar Aza is lovely. And under intermittent attack from Hamas. Our guide showed us the remnants of one missile after another. Kibbutz residents from a young age learn to plan their routes across the kibbutz with the nearest bomb shelter in mind. But that was not the worst. Hamas had begun sending little parachutes with what appear to be toys across the border. They are not, but rather disguised explosives. That target the youngest children--those too little to know better.
Egypt cut ties to Gaza because 100, 000 terrorists live there. Egypt doesn't want them. It's a pretty good bet that the people of Gaza would like a better option as well, but actually Israel can't create that option with terrorists who literally want to kill them all. Are trying to kill them all. It is simply infeasible to open borders to the people who don't want to kill you when opening those borders also lets in those who do. And who will.
The terrorists have, for the moment, taken over Kfar Aza. Again, the kibbutz founded, in part, by refugees driven out of Egypt. Egypt which closed its borders to Gaza without world condemnation. I'll leave it there.
The Palestinians must accept the same reality, that there will be endless conflict as long as organizations like Hamas claim annihilation of the Jewish state as their goal. The only path to peace is through peace-making. Somewhere I read that the average age in Gaza is barely over 20 years; one wonders when a people who have only known conflict their entire lives may come to the conclusion that it isn't working as a means to a better life...
One POSSIBLE solution is for Israel to become a republic and embrace democracy. Republic = equality under the law; democracy = popular control of government. Ruling a captive population by force and terror will always fail in the long run. The Romans used to grant citizenship to the people of the territories they conquered. Israel ought to do the same.
In the best of all possible worlds. On the ground how does Israel deal with the “ we want to destroy you and seize power for ourselves” faction while giving democracy to all? The US is currently dealing with a similarly minded but not so bloodily committed faction
Huh? As far as I can tell, it's the Israelis who seek to destroy the Palestinians. They've done a pretty good job of it -- hard to imagine it was by accident.
Um, no. "They" have not. The Palestinian population has grown in both West Bank and Gaza. Israel continues to be held solely responsible for a situation for which they bear only part of the responsibility.
When you lie--deliberately or through ignorance--about the situation, when you ignore the reality of what terrorist groups owning Gaza and getting close to the same in the West Bank are doing and will do to the Palestinians, but also to reducing Israel's choices, then I have to wonder why.
Patricia, you hit the nail on the head! Ignorance about the historical record has been pervasive in the comments today. People that know better choose to present a one sided analysis of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. Thank you for setting the record straight.
You are correct that there is guilt on both sides. But when one side has overwhelming power, and the other is all but helpless, there can be no doubt whose is the principal responsibility. As for "Israel's choices", it has and has long chosen against a path of peace. It could choose a path of justice; it could choose to live up to its obligation to respect human rights; it could have chosen to fulfill the various "peace agreements" that it has made. But it has chosen otherwise. Do you ignore the "terrorist group" called the government of Israel?
They don't seem to destroy. They defend when attacked. Israelis don't start fights - they finish them. The press usually doesn't tell what provoked them.
Yeah, right. Have you been sleeping for the last fifty years?
Israel rules its captive population as the Spartans did theirs: by massacre and terror. Is it surprising that that is the lesson the Palestinians have learned? "What's taught is what's known," (k d lang).
It's a cycle of tit-for-tat terrorism -- all we can do is wait for the next outrage, from either side, and hope that somehow human feelings will arise to break the cycle. Blind support for Israel does not encourage such a break.
Just Sayin', beautifully said, "the only path to peace is through peace -making" I would offer the yang to your yin, the only path to war is through war-making. Meaning the violent individuals and groups on both sides are responsible.
Horrors, especially GOP reaction, which limits our ability to sustain effective support for ANY ally!As always, an elegant and concise report, Heather.
Thank you, Dr. Richardson. I support most Jewish people and the country of Israel. I do not and never did support Netanyahu. He is not a good person, he does not have the good of the Israeli people in mind, like trump, netanyahu favors himself above all. Since Iran supports Hamas and Russia supports Iran, it would not surprise me if this attack on Israel is an attempt to divert aid and assistance from Ukraine to Israel. We do have treaties with Israel and must give whatever support we are obligated to give, but over and above all we must assure Ukraine beats Russian and the Ukrainian people retain their freedom. Send the money and supplies where it is most needed.
I thought the same, he could be supporting Hamas to take world attention from Ukraine, seeing how our government is in chaos due to the republican antic's here. He is not beyond doing something this evil.
Remember how quick he was to ring Netanyahu and congratulate him on his re-election? And not only that - he knows what and how much the US has sent to Ukraine. Plus he knows all about the submarines...
"The lack of a speaker is a problem. Although House committees can still meet, the House can’t do much."
I think it's just as well that cantankerous Republican members of the House are not represented in a major way in this current crisis. What do they have to offer, anyway? Some of the most extreme among them might welcome the conflict to further their theory of a "Christian" apocalypse brought about by conflict in the Middle East.
After funding government/Ukraine for the coming year, the 2nd best thing the GOP led House could do for America would be to adjourn until the next election. The best thing they could for America would be to emigrate to Russia and stay there, taking Trump along with them.
Minority report here, maybe. But we see/hear so little from this part of the world…
I won’t judge attacks, counter attacks and all the drama. But I will politely suggest that the only resolution is a two-state situation. Not picking any fights, but it is the only solution that does not propagate Fighting and creates real peace. Figure it out.🙏🏼 If you don’t, innocent people continue to die. I’m no expert and am an observer, neither Jewish nor Arab. Just concerned about humans. Sorry for any offense taken.
No offense taken, as I agree with you. In the early ‘70’s, I worked with an Iranian doctor who opened my eyes to the Palestinian perspective. They deserve a part of the land that is now Israel....
With so many topics that divide us as a nation, what is left to unite us? Of course, the fragmentation of media outlets doesn't help, both in terms of the number of them but also the number of commercial interruptions. It's almost as if we need to fight to regain our national attention span...
Thank you Dr. Richardson, as always, for a focus on the events of the day that is not only laser sharp, but also broadly encompassing of the interwoven complexities of the times we find ourselves. And what a mess we are in. While I remain a generally positive and optimistic person, it is hard to ignore a certain sense of foreboding afoot in the world today. So, we stay positive, with clear eyes as to the dangers in the world, and try to read, understand and support intelligent dialogue and actions that we can affect within our sphere of influence. Very grateful for yours...
Ralph, I very much appreciate your thoughtful reply to today’s LFAA and only would add that our ability here in the States responsibly to “affect [events] within our sphere of influence” largely will hinge on who becomes House Speaker. To that end, I submit we have one more shot to counter the likes of a Jim Jordan or Steve Scalise and press for a bipartisan mutually agreeable Republican alternative who owes nothing to the MAGA faction and who has demonstrated respect for governance and a normally functioning, problem-solving legislature.
A fellow Substack subscriber Jerry Weiss who also writes “Feathers of Hope” and who, since December, 2022, has worked tirelessly to galvanize a cross-party House coalition has presented four names he deems to be the strongest Republican candidates to enlist substantial support from colleagues on both sides of the aisle. They are Don Bacon (R-NE), Brian Fitzgerald (R-PA), Mike Gallagher (R-WI), and Dave Joyce (R-OH).
Seeing I can’t emphasize enough how urgent the moment is, I prevail upon all of us to contact these leaders on Monday and urge them to settle on any one of the four, all of whom have demonstrated a willingness to work with likeminded people across the aisle. My apologies for not having time to look up their D.C. and local phone numbers.
No Virginia, Biden did not help Hamas attack Israel, but with no House of Representatives Speaker, can the US appropriate funds to help Israel?
Dysfunctional Republicans, its your move
Israel doesn't need our "help." We already give them billions every year.
In any case, House GOP cannot provide any funds until they elect a Speaker. Timing is serendipitous
I don't think serendipitous as much as opportunistic. We can expect actions like this from bad actors as long as we continue to display our national weakness for the world to see.
Politics used to end at the water's edge. No more, and lots of folks are just waiting to take advantage.
The Autocratic weakness display by Netanyahu resisted by 100'000s of Israeli's certainly provided Hamas with a Window for War.
Look for them to either get the worst Speaker—looking at you Jim Jordan—or keep the House in limbo with the acting Speaker. This is a high leverage opportunity for the disruption caucus. We aren’t done with government shutdown yet. The Democrats need to rethink their hands off approach to the House Republicans and find a viable alternative to Jordan, or Scalise.
With the GOP evangelicals blowing up their Congressblobs' phones, you can bet there will be a new Speaker before you can say "rapture."
Which is allocated to purchase US military goods and service s. It’s a subsidiary to the US defense/military companies that Israel “launders.”
I think by "help", US officials on the news have been clarifying as intelligence sharing.
by the way, from https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/us-foreign-aid-by-country , the numbers for the top 10 in 2022:
10 countries that receive the most U.S. foreign aid:
Afghanistan ($4.89 billion)
Israel ($3.3 billion)
Jordan ($1.72 billion)
Egypt ($1.46 billion)
Iraq ($960 million)
Ethiopia ($922 million)
Yemen ($809 million)
Colombia ($800 million)
Nigeria ($793 million)
Lebanon ($790 million)
Afghanistan ($4.89 billion)..the majority of this is for humanitarian aid: food. Israel ($3.3 billion) for military aid.
Israel is among the top 20 global economies in GDP per capita.
Do they really need the 3.3billion?
The US economy was 23.32 Trillion dollars. Total foreign aid totals less than 1%. It's a fair question to ask why is the US spending funds and to we gain a benefit from that. Do we gain a benefit from helping others militarily, like we do Ukraine and Israel? There is no question that Israel needed military aid for its earlier wars just to survive. Do they need it now? As much? Considering the threats they have been facing and are facing now, in terms of relative scale and proximity to their population, the answer may still be yes. What are we getting in return? A strategic partner in the region? A test bed for American military technology? Financial freedom for Israel's high tech sector to develop technologies that the US public and military use daily? Political benefits? I don't really have deep knowledge to answer you. Politically, though, they do have strong support on both sides of the aisle for various reasons. I personally support the aid, so I'm not a neutral observer.
There is only one country receiving more US taxpayer money than Israel. That's very telling.
Marycat, your comments in this thread seem to be hinting at something very sinister. Can you explain? And what problem do you see in the US providing more financial aid to Israel than most of the other countries on the list provided by Jerry Helfand?
Interesting list. Are we still giving money to the Taliban? We saw how fst the Afghanistan government could jump ship. Isn't Columbia cartel country? None of these countries seem to be too stable.
The majority need humanitarian aid. I think we are gifting funds to Colombia to help them keep their drugs in Colombia. Or, ship them somewhere else. Or, plant corn.
...just being a bit facetious,....
If you’re addressing me, it would never have occurred to me to suggest that. If you’re addressing Santa Claus Virginia, it’s still puzzling. Nothing points to President Biden as a warmonger.
Hello Virginia. Not addressing you. Sorry for the confusion. I was addressing Republicans blaming Biden for the attack (falsely) by citing the release of Iranian money held in South Korea back to Iran(to be used only for humanitarian aid). None of that money has actually been released yet
Didn’t really think you were, but having written several posts yesterday, knew I might have been misconstrued. Thank you for getting back to me, and reminding me of the cartoon I keep!
Cartoon?
You don't think Hamas are aware that our Congress is paralyzed without a speaker? Thus a perfect time to launch an attack on Israel, when additional U.S. funds could definitely not be released to Israel?
And the perfect time to launch terror attacks in the US.
Some of Congress (mostly republicans) seem to be war weary (aren't we all?) and want to stop aid to Ukraine. Now Israel is embattled? Not a good chance of getting much aid.
The Republicans in the Senate are holding up confirmation of Jack Lew as Ambassador to Israel, too. Really good timing
As Biden said, If you don't get your disaster relief money, you know where to look.
Thank you Ralph and Barbara! I'm posting your suggestion to my FB and Twitter X and INstagram accounts.
We don't have to wait until Monday. There are live House switchboard operators right now at (202) 224-3121. I called, asked for the rep. and left a message acc. to Barbara's suggestion. urging "them to settle on any one of the four, all of whom have demonstrated a willingness to work with likeminded people across the aisle. "
Don Bacon (R-NE), Brian Fitzpatrick (R-PA), Mike Gallagher (R-WI), and Dave Joyce (R-OH)
Is there no qualified woman candidate!
Sadly, Nancy Pelosi is present but no longer Speaker. This moment requires her clone.
I had that same thought but I don't know the Republican women well enough to offer a suggestion so I decided to accept the referrals from Barbara Jo Krieger.
Hint: stay away from Boebert and Greene
Haha
Forget Joyce. I’m one of his constituents. He is not who too many try to make him to be. He’s not a moderate. He hides in his office too afraid to speak publicly and voted Trump policies over 90%. And he was on the House floor yucking it up with McCarthy just before the 15th vote in January instead of working with other R-moderates and Democrats to install a reasonable Speaker. That they call him a leader of moderates is a joke.
Thanks Max; I for one needed to know that for certain. I'm an Ohio interested soul. I also had heard mixed reviews on Joyce, but could not speak to it personally from a position of experience. Sounds about like I figured though; nothing more than one of those "go along to get along" sorts, and definitely not a leader - more concerned for his own skin. Thank you... If it does not exist, we have a big need for an Ohio centric forum for comparing notes in a non-partisan type of way. I don't have interest in some separate tribal thing; a greater good sort of thing is my thought.
Definitely the go-along to get-along boy. He’s that proverbial “nice guy” who accomplishes absolutely nothing he’d have to actually fight for IMO. We can no longer afford to send this type to DC and think they’ve got our backs.
I could share another story that would show how I’ll-fitting he is fir a job but would have to divulge a particular friend of mine. Closest I can get is the person is someone noted in the community he admired enough to get them an accolade from the Hill who tried to call him to go to lunch with the thought of talking some politics with him. He didn’t even return this person’s phone call who is also one of his constituents. . He doesn’t want to partake in what he knows will be challenging conversations. I believe he wants to be that better person but just doesn't have the courage to be so. Only my opinion.
Chaplain, In referencing your FB, Twitter X, and Instagram accounts, you have affirmed my faith that a single posting can send ripples of influence in ways one had not anticipated. I am deeply grateful.
You are more than welcome, Barbara. I on the other hand am deeply grateful that here and on Robert Hubbell's and Jessica Craven's newsletters, I am in community with people who are way more knowledgeable than I am in so many of these political arenas. Blessings, PS full disclosure, I completed FB and X, but I haven't gotten over to instagram yet : ) Blessings,
Tried to contact House switchboard to recommend Dan Bacon for the speakership but needed a contact. None of my own reps in blood red SC are appropriate so I tried Hakeem Jeffries but was cut off, I’m sure things are very chaotic.
We must try to cut off any nominations to restore McCarthy or Gym Jordan and similar MAGATS . Do you have another way to contact, ie email, ??? Suspect the situation is so critical a nomination will arise that we do not support due to the urgency of the matter. I am horrified we’ve been caught with our pants down so to speak on so many levels. Also wonder if our dysfunction played a part in the timing of this event?
Slight correction: it’s Brian Fitzpatrick (R-PA).
Karen, Thank you for the correction. Admittedly, this is not the first time I’ve transposed the name. Fortunately, when one googles “Fitzgerald” for phone numbers, Fitzpatrick pops up.
He’s my Rep; and I’ve called him!
And I’m glad Google helped!
My rep is Tim Burchett, Gaetz’s ally in this fiasco. No point in contacting him. For anything, really.
And my Rep. is Scott Perry, another of Gaetz's allies. No point in contacting him for anything either.
See my response here and below. It might make a difference and at least inform others:
Karen Borst-Rothe
3 mins ago
“Perhaps writing a well condensed version of relevant aspects of this argument about the importance of sensible House governance might help. Then passing that factual perspective to others in your district and to local news ir other receptive outlets. (At least doing this in writing might help counter the simplified, deliberate ignorance of their world view.)”
Ditto: John Moolenaar (R-MI), an empty suit if there ever was one.
Contact anyway, they need to hear from the opposition or else they would think that everyone agrees with them.
You’re right. I’m working with a team to launch Blue Tennessee, aimed at getting Democrats to fun for state offices. (Of 99 officeholders, 60 ran unopposed.) while we’re working at the state level, 2 of the 3 of my reps in the US Congress were state level before they ran at the national level. Https://Linktr.ee/BlueTennessee
Go for it! There are "like" people around you.
It will take work, but it can be done.
Good Luck!
I feel for you.
Hugs to you. Gaetz, et.al. Such a complete collection of thugs!
I will contact my Rep. Angie Craig today. Might help. Worth a try.
Did I mention Marsha Blackburn is my senator? <heavy sigh>
While these two are federal, they moved up from elected state reps. That is why I am involved with launching Blue Tennessee: https://Linktr.ee/BlueTennessee. We MUST do something.
Good because silence is agreement.
Perhaps writing a well condensed version of relevant aspects of this argument about the importance of sensible House governance might help. Then passing that factual perspective to others in your district and to local news ir other receptive outlets. (At least doing this in writing might help counter the simplified, deliberate ignorance of their world view.)
See my response her and below:
3 mins ago
“Perhaps writing a well condensed version of relevant aspects of this argument about the importance of sensible House governance might help. Then passing that factual perspective to others in your district and to local news ir other receptive outlets. (At least doing this in writing might help counter the simplified, deliberate ignorance of their world view.)”
Contact anyway, they need to hear from the opposition. If not, they think all their constituents are with them.
Dave Joyce is my congressman. I watched him on the House floor yucking it up with McCarthy just before the 15th round in January. I’ve watched him vote over 90% with Trump. I’ve watched him hide in his office hoping no one would see him time after time when he should have been speaking out.
As his constituent, I tried to write him on his online government website to share my dissatisfaction with an issue. The site wouldn’t allow me to send the message over and over again no matter what changes I made. Then I tried changing the subject line to “You’re Great” and told him in the content that if he received the message it was because he was screening his messages electronically and only allowed good ones. This message immediately was allowed to be sent. This is the character of the man and no one to trust. Unfortunately, I don’t believe there’s any moderate or good Republicans. Only ones who may play-act that they are. I know who Joyce is and wouldn’t vote him for dog catcher.
And BTW, he never responded to the “You’re Great” message I sent. I take that as an acknowledgment that he really does electronically screen messages you try to send him.
Max, Thank you for sharing first-hand knowledge I imagine folks will consider as they evaluate Jerry Weiss’s list, which I understand resulted from several months of research. For what it’s worth, I would note, some time back, that Robert Reich also advanced Joyce’s name as a consensus candidate.
Thank you Ralph, smart assessment indeed
Brian Fitzpatrick (R-PA) is my representative in congress. I will contact his office.
But the crazies in the Republican party want crazy. They will never support someone who isn’t MAGA. Still, I will make the call as suggested in hopes perhaps a level headed “adult” can be nominated anyway and receive support from both sides.
@LoveMuley, Similar to the cross-party coalition that earlier voted to raise the debt ceiling and recently voted to pass a relatively clean CR, Weiss, I believe rightly, is convinced, after months of research, that the right candidate, one who owes nothing to the MAGA faction and has signaled a willingness to work across the aisle, can enlist the 217 votes (1 seat currently is vacated) from a cross-party cadre of establishment colleagues.
Hooray for Jerry Weiss. Thanks for making us aware of his Substack. I've subscribed. The divisiveness and negativity has become overwhelming. We need more people seeking unity and change.
Mark, Thank you for writing. Indeed, you embody the elements of the movement we need to advance.
Barbara
Thank you. Reading up on these folks and ready to support them.
However, not much hope that my humble voice will be heard.
Linda, Thank you for your reply. For what it’s worth, I never lose sight of the fact that as any movement gathers voices it’s impossible to foretell precisely which one gets us to critical mass, whereupon the movement catches fire.
Calling the Capitol would only matter, if they were Republicant Reps from our state, correct?
Penny, Out-of-staters speaking for interests that impact the country-at large can and should call whomever is poised to respond. For what it’s worth, when I’ve advocated by phone for a consensus Speaker candidate, every staffer has noted my remarks and has assured me they would be passed to the congressperson.
Concur Barbara Jo, Feathers & Flight for a sane Speaker.
Call the reps from our individual states, you mean?
Which would only matter, if they were Republicants, correct?
Statements from Arab countries were all about the same. Do you think they will come to the aid of Palestinians or shall these people continue to be persecuted, until they are no more?
__ A statement by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs said that Saudi Arabia was "closely monitoring the unprecedented developments between various Palestinian factions and the Israeli occupation forces, resulting in an escalation of violence on several fronts".
It said Riyadh calls for "an immediate cessation of the escalation" between both sides and "the protection of civilians".
__ Qatar, which has been starkly opposed to normalisation with Israel, expressed "deep concern" over the developments in the Gaza Strip.
A statement issued by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs said Israel was "solely responsible for the ongoing escalation due to its continuous violations of the rights of the Palestinian people, including its recent repeated intrusions into the holy Al-Aqsa Mosque under the protection of the Israeli police".
__The UAE expressed "deep concern" over the escalation in a statement that stressed the need "to stop the escalation and preserve the lives of civilians".
The statement offered "sincere condolences" to all the victims of the recent fighting.
It called for "the immediate reactivating of the international Quartet to revive the path of Arab-Israeli peace", and urged the international community to advance all efforts made to achieve comprehensive and just peace, and prevent the region from being dragged to "new levels of violence, tension and instability".
__Egypt, which normalised with Israel in 1980 under a peace treaty, warned of "grave consequences" from an escalation in tensions between Israel and the Palestinians in a statement from the foreign ministry carried by the state news agency.
'It called for "exercising maximum restraint and avoiding exposing civilians to further danger". (The New Arab) See link below.
https://www.newarab.com/news/how-did-arab-states-react-hamas-attack-israel
What did Biden say about the Palestinians yesterday?
"I made clear to Prime Minister Netanyahu that we stand ready to offer all appropriate means of support to the government and people of Israel," Biden said in a written statement issued after their call.'
'In his televised remarks later, Biden issued a blunt warning.'
"Israel has a right to defend itself and its people - full stop," he said. "Let me say this as clearly as I can. This is not a moment for any party hostile to Israel to exploit these attacks to seek advantage. The world is watching." (Reuters)
‘Israel and the United States are seeking a united front in the region against Iran and its support for terrorist groups such as Hamas and Lebanon-based Hezbollah. While Netanyahu’s extreme right-wing coalition is unlikely to bend on either annexation or settlements, some U.S. officials are hopeful that his desire to achieve a legacy of peace with the larger Arab world could move him to reorganize his government.’
‘The hope has been that Saudi Arabia would follow in the footsteps of Bahrain and the United Arab Emirates, establishing diplomatic and economic relations with Israel as part of the Abraham Accords signed during the Trump administration. Last month, the Biden administration also signed a non-treaty security pact with Bahrain that it anticipated would serve as a template for other agreements in the region.’
‘But the scale of the attack on Israel, Hamas’s holding of hostages, and the prospect of further violence has upset all projections. If the upheaval continues as previous, albeit smaller, incidents have, “the most likely scenario is an Israeli attack on Gaza that lasts for a while, with a significant amount of death and destruction,” said Jonathan Panikoff, a former deputy national intelligence officer for the Near East and now director of the Scowcroft Middle East Security Initiative at the Atlantic Council.'
'But “the longer it goes on, the more the Arab street will get angry and the harder it is to have a situation in which Saudi Arabia says okay, as soon as this ends, we’ll get back on track,” Panikoff said.’
‘In statements Saturday, Hamas invited others to join them in the fight, although it appeared unlikely any Arab states would take up the offer. One concern, however, was the possibility that Hezbollah — like Hamas, armed and backed by Iran — would move into Israel from the north.’ (WAPO)
‘This Gaza war didn’t come out of nowhere’ (excerpt from Vox)
‘Everyone forgot about the Palestinians — conditions have been set for two decades, and Biden’s focus on Israel-Saudi talks may have lit a match.’
‘It took Hamas’s deadly attack today to remind Israel, the United States, and the world that Palestine still matters.’
‘The militant group based in occupied Gaza launched aerial attacks and broke through the heavily secured fence into the State of Israel. Hundreds of Israelis have been killed, a historic scale of violence for the country. The Israeli counterattack will inevitably lead to more death and destruction for Palestinians and a tightened occupation.’
‘It comes after nearly two decades of the US and world leaders overlooking the more than 2 million people living in Gaza who endure a humanitarian nightmare, with its airspace and borders and sea under Israeli control. The attack comes amid an ongoing failure to grapple with the dangerous situation for Palestinians in the West Bank where Israel’s extreme-right government over the past year has escalated the already brutal daily pain of occupation.’
‘Instances of Israeli security forces and Israeli settlers antagonizing Palestinians through violence are on the rise, from the pogrom on the city of Huwara to a new tempo of lethal raids on Jenin. Israeli government ministers have been pursuing annexationist policies and sharing raging rhetoric; both incite further violent response from Palestinians and appear at a time when new militant groups have emerged that claim the mantle of the Palestinian cause. The now-regular presence of Israeli Jews praying at the Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem, one of Islam’s holiest sites, have further pressurized the situation. A Hamas commander cited many of these factors in his statement.’
‘But the ongoing reality of the occupation has not featured prominently in US or Arab leaders’ engagement with the region in recent years, even as circumstances for Palestinians worsened.’
‘The question must thus be asked to the Israeli government, the Biden administration, and Arab leaders: How did they forget about Palestinians? How did they so brazenly ignore Gaza?’
‘President Joe Biden has not reversed his predecessor Donald Trump’s policy of putting aside the question of Palestine and instead has exerted immense capital on the normalization of Israel’s relations with Arab states, no matter how extreme the policies of the Israeli government.’
‘In the current US-led diplomatic equation, there is no space for Palestinians, except for talk of minor concessions to ease daily humiliations. Biden said recently, as many of his surrogates often do, that the US remains intent on’ “preserving the path to a negotiated two-state solution.”
‘But negotiations between Israel and the Palestine Liberation Organization have been frozen since 2014 under President Barack Obama, and most Palestinian analysts at this point acknowledge that US administrations since President Bill Clinton have engaged in a failed, asymmetrical process that never would have allowed for the conditions of an independent, sovereign state of Palestine.’
‘And so the symbolism of Hamas breaking through Israeli security barriers and wreaking havoc on Israel — including the kidnapping of at least one Israeli soldier as well as civilians — will resonate across Palestine, the Arab world, and beyond. (VOX)
See link below.’ (VOX) See link below.
https://www.vox.com/2023/10/7/23907912/israel-palestine-conflict-history-explained-gaza-hamas
'Hand of Iran'
“I believe that the hand of Iran will be found in elements of this,” ‘said Jonathan Schanzer, senior vice president for research at the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies, a Washington-based think tank’
‘He said the assault by Hamas was a marked change from the Palestinian group. Before it was focused on suicide bombings and crude rocket attacks; this time it is “going deep into Israel and pulling off an operation that marks a significant departure.’ “This strikes at the heart of the Israel Defense Force. It strikes at the heart of Israel. This is unlike anything that we’ve seen from Hamas in the past. And it demonstrates a strategic decision undertaken by the organization that I don’t think would happen without its patrons in Tehran.”
“There are questions about whether other fronts will now turn hot, which is a serious concern that Israel has long held with regard to the Iranian encirclement strategy,” he added.’
“Will the West Bank turn hot? Will Shi’ite militias activate in places like Syria? Will Hezbollah get involved? We will see over the next few hours or days to come whether this was just simply an attempt by Hamas to make a statement and to announce itself anew or whether this is part of a broader strategy where other elements beholden to Iran participate. This is the war I think everyone has feared with an Iranian goal of encirclement and perhaps even an attempt to strangle the Israeli state.” (Politico) See link below
https://www.politico.eu/article/iran-hamas-attacks-against-israel-palestine-jerusalem/
True, Fern, this attack on Israel did not come out of nowhere.
In 1987, I was in Israel for 2 months; I came to love the country and its people. One day, I walked into a Palestinian village where roads were unpaved, stone houses had no running water and no electricity, villagers had a curfew and, as I recall, could not leave the country. I wondered how I would feel if, less than 10 miles away from my home, people had freedoms, water and light when I did not. The experience made me sad. In 1987 a solution seemed obvious to this outsider; but here we are in 2023. I hope that this village still exists, that its people at least have water and electricity.
History can be a great teacher if we are willing to look and learn.
One must differentiate between Gazans and Hamas. Gazans who try to resist Hamas putting bombs under their apartments and children’s schools are publicly hanged and sometimes all the men in their family.
There’s a reason Egypt joined Israel in blockading Gaza by sea, land, and air.
Despicable. (I don't watch the animated movies bearing that name because it neutralizes the important meaning of that modifier.)
Retired Gen. Barry McCaffrey stated that "this very well may have killed peace negotiations"
....??.....what peace negotiations?
Fern, thank you so much for this thorough synopsis. I have been shocked by the failure of any reporting on the background and on this : "‘It comes after nearly two decades of the US and world leaders overlooking the more than 2 million people living in Gaza who endure a humanitarian nightmare, with its airspace and borders and sea under Israeli control. The attack comes amid an ongoing failure to grapple with the dangerous situation for Palestinians in the West Bank where Israel’s extreme-right government over the past year has escalated the already brutal daily pain of occupation.’
The lack of consideration of this is shameful!
Thank you for learning as much as you can about the causes and effects of such situations. You may, in addition to the analyses of HCR and other thinkers, appreciate the work of historian, Timothy Snyder. He has written On Tyranny, Our Malady, The Road to Unfreedom, Black Earth, and Bloodlands. For more about him, please see the link below.
https://timothysnyder.org/
More thanks, Fern! I will be sharing your long comment far & wide! Also asking Pres Biden & my MA Senators & Reps answer to your question:
“ How did YOU forget about Palestinians? How did YOU so brazenly ignore Gaza?”
Are you sure they did forget?
No, Susan, I’m not sure.
Thanks for reminding me!
I haven’t heard back from them yet….
Laine, thank you for spreading the question: 'What has been and is happening to the Palestinians? Please do NOT include my name. I am simply your friend. Thank you!
Fern, I did not mention your name.
Here’s what I just sent to Biden:
“Regarding your comments in response to the current horrific conflict: can you not be more evenhanded? How can you forget about the Palestinian people?
How can you so brazenly ignore Gaza, and the history of brutal oppression suffered by the Palestinians? Please!
Hamas does not represent all of them, although it is acting on their behalf.
Please use your position & power in the world to acknowledge that the Palestinian people deserve compassion & support!
Thank you
Thank you, Fern. What I know about that area of the world could be written on a 3"x5" note card (remember those?) with a chisel tip marker.*
I used to say "on a matchbook cover" but those departed common usage 50 years ago. 3"x5" cards can still be purchased at Staples....for now.
'Matchbooks', as a former smoker, your brought me back. I can smell striking the match! Ah, 'Memories Are Made of This'! Do you remember the song, Ally?
Johnny Cash - Memories Are Made Of This
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGoBuptSkR0
Dear young 'uns, before beloved Johnny was beloved Dean Martin!
https://youtu.be/mv9PSkNkUfs?si=IpyKeBv_KpyuMCR8
Hah! Chaplain Terry: As Mary Wells said, "You beat me to the punch!" And I still have a crush on DM!
That level of crush doesn't go away easily! There was something about his Italian genes and smokey voice that.....oh excuse me I need a glass of ice water...over my head!!!
I'd never heard it, and I love Johnny Cash! Excellent song.
My folks were both smokers; I HATE the smell of tobacco, matches, and someone who has just had a cigarette...
My dad smoked cigars and pipes. I hated the smell of the cigars, loved the smell of the pipes.
I guess I should be grateful that I got sick after my first (and only) cigarette, but sometimes I did wish I could make that sophisticated statement....especially after seeing Paul Henreid light two cigarettes at once...and then slowly take one from his mouth and smoothly hand it to Bette Davis (Now, Voyager 11942) as they gazed into one another's eyes....sigh.....It's even posted in youtube as "The Cigarette Scene."
https://youtu.be/2-KGiwGn1d8?si=mJmVSjh721iN0u8l
PS A moment of levity at this tragic time. I am grateful.
Oh the intimacy-promising power of being able to "French inhale" as a freshman during Friday night dates at Michigan State!
Not you, Ally, please, not you!
Never smoked a day. Don't hate smokers, just the smells.
Don’t worry Fern. Some of us still remember and adore all the wonderful smells and sounds and rituals of smoking a cigarette. Twas a Dunhill for me. And a Dunhill lighter too.
Basic stuff from Wikipedia:
Human rights in Israel - Wikipedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Israel
Thank you this. Typical entitled humans:
" Israel faces significant human rights problems regarding institutional discrimination against Arab citizens of Israel (many of whom self-identify as Palestinian), Ethiopian Israelis and women, and the treatment of refugees and irregular migrants. Other human rights problems include institutional discrimination against non-Orthodox Jews and intermarried families, and labor rights abuses against foreign workers"
Illuminating synopsis of the situation in Israel, Fern. Were you a reporter or State Dept specialist in another life? Thank you for the work gathering these details.
Ah, my earlier life and work did teach and encouraged me to think, to dig, to care and to organize, without eliminating the pain and a glimmer of hope. Salud, JP.
They all win. Saudi Arabia and Putin get to pretend they are working to resolve issues, Netanyahu gets to gather territory and keep those who were protesting indoors while I bet he secretly passes his measures to consolidate power further while telling his people they must be united against "the enemy". I have serious doubt Netanyahu did not know this was coming with their Intelligence and Security.
Putin wins because he gets the US involved in Israel's fight and detracts from Ukraine, which works just fine for MAGA Christofascist Nationalist Republicans.
Oh, and of course Iran wins as well. Iran has been funding Hamas to ensure unrest between Palestinians and Israel, not because Iran cares about either, but because spreading fear and extreme "Islamic" beliefs works for Iran. Extremes in any religion is not about the religion at all, but about power and control using "God" as cover.
Kimberly Montgomery: Yes--exactly.
I’m not an expert in any of this. But all I’ve seen in my 73 years is:
- numerous peace treaties agreed to between Israel and Palestine followed almost immediately with Israel breaking the treaty and continued Israel building on the Gaza Strip when they just agreed to stop.
- Trump allowed Jared to create a supposed peace treaty WITHOUT Palestine at the table and basically told Palestine FU if you don’t succumb.
- Trump killed the Iran nuclear agreement his predecessor negotiated that WAS WORKING for the world but Donny had to tip his hat to Netanyahu of course.
It is horrible what happened to Israel yesterday, but Nut-and-Yahoo will likely use it to annihilate Iran and close down Palestine forever (dragging us in) as he’s wanted for years. I’m for all people’s freedoms. But I’m not looking forward to to the genocide that will take place just to satisfy Israel. The world needs to see to Palestine’s citizens’ rights also. I foresee many miscalculations in what’s to come just as the miscalculations after 911 never made the responsible parties (Saudi) pay a thing under Bush and Obama, and actually get rewarded under Trump.
I think we have a duty to ask whether the N-hu government really blindsided??? Or was it a choice to look the other way? After all, the Israeli army had experienced a lack of morale and enlistmebt since N-hu started his anti-democracy campaign. And now, suddenly, Israelis have another more pressing enemy and enlistments are off the charts.
I wouldn’t put anything past Netanyahu. Remember Putin bombing his own people and coming to the supposed rescue early in his dictatorship? Net is the same dictator wannabe . His own country should be questioning their “lack of intelligence” just like our country is questioning the “lack of law enforcement” on J6 after Trump replaced so many in the month before the insurrection.
Fern, I don't know if you're aware of the conditions upon the State of Israel's founding (5 Arab nations attacked the nascent State, a country founded as a haven for Jews following the Holocaust as well as centuries of Jews being evicted from their homes in many countries around the world) or the subsequent, constant threats and terrorism of Arab organizations toward the Jewish people. I don’t know if you personally know any Jews who left their homes in Gaza in 2006 in the hope that peace would be at hand, only to build and regularly use bomb shelters when they resettled on the other side of the border. I am not a fan of Netanyahu. He should probably be in prison. The plight of the Palestinian people is real and my prayers are for my immediate family in the Land as well as for my “cousins” (Palestinians). Hamas is a terrorist organization that makes no bones about calling for the destruction of Israel and the Jewish People. Can we agree that the situation is fraught, extremely complicated and most of us (including me) can’t speak intelligently about how to solve the long, protracted problems? Women, children, elderly and disabled folks have been abducted during a Holy Day and are being held hostage, some taken to Gaza. Israeli soldiers, many of whom are aged 18-21 have been killed defending the country in this assault. It’s also worth mentioning.
Do I know why you posted your history lesson about the Jewish people and attacks by Arab nations on Israel to the attention of the person who posted a comment about the persecution of Palestinians by Israel? Do you know that I'm Jewish? You appear to think that you know more about this subject than I do. Do you know how patronizing you are?
Fern, I don’t know you and you don’t know me. I am neither a historian nor a maven on any particular topic (I am curious about many things). What you sensed (and mistook for an obnoxious attempt to school you) was my frustration that as a terrorist organization wages a multi-tier attack on Jewish civilians, you and others choose to spotlight only the suffering of Palestinians. This is typical when Israel is in the news and it irks me. That you identify as Jewish adds to my frustration and bewilderment. My statements beginning with ‘I don’t know if you…’ were meant sincerely and without guile or pretense. They were an invitation to remember the difficult history of this place; that it’s complicated and not only one group suffers - so why take THIS moment to focus on the suffering of only one group? I’m responding to your personal comment because I prefer to give you the benefit of the doubt. Maybe you regret being nasty rather than seeking clarification. Heather’s comments section is a place where folks come together to discuss and disagree respectfully. That’s always her message. Let’s honor her and start over. I’m sorry you misunderstood me. It happens in the written message, but misunderstand you did. I think I ask a fair question and as Jewess, why not acknowledge this current situation with more nuance?
The following except from 'Is Israel at War With Iran?' by By Arash Azizi in the Atlantic provides a thoughtful view of what is at stake for Israel and its neighbors in the Middle East at this time.
'One reason the attacks are surprising to so many is that, for months, the trend in the Middle East has been toward diplomatic reconciliation and the smoothing-over of rifts. Despite its murderous record, the Syrian regime was readmitted to the Arab League; Turkey has had a rapprochement with Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, and Egypt; and Iran has restored diplomatic ties with Saudi Arabia. In his annual “Islamic unity” speech this week, on the occasion of the Prophet Muhammad’s birthday, Khamenei expressed support for this reconciliation trend: “If Iran and countries such as Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Jordan adopt a common position on fundamental questions,” Khamenei said, “oppressive powers won’t be able to interfere in their domestic affairs or foreign policy.” The three countries Khamenei named were all U.S. allies not usually on good terms with Iran; Cairo doesn’t have diplomatic ties with Tehran, and those between Iran and Jordan are very limited. Both have had relations with Israel for decades, as they were the first Arab countries to recognize the Jewish state.'
'But in the same speech, Khamenei left no doubt as to where Tehran stands on Israel. The supreme leader claimed that the “Zionist regime” was full of “hatred” toward all of its neighbors and pursuing a goal of dominating the region “from the Nile to the Euphrates.” He went on to promise that “the Zionist regime is dying” and warned countries seeking to normalize ties with Israel that they were “making a mistake … betting on the losing horse.” Israel, he said, is “a cancer that will be uprooted and destroyed by the people of Palestine and forces of resistance in the region.” Shortly after the October 7 attack, Palestinian leaders, including Hamas’s Ismail Haniya and Palestinian Islamic Jihad’s Ehsan Ataya, issued explicit messages to Arab countries seeking normalization with Israel, warning them in strikingly similar tones.'
'Saudi Arabia might appear to be receptive to this messaging. Its foreign ministry’s statement following the attacks carefully avoided condemning Hamas and instead reminded Israelis of “repeated warnings of the dangers of the explosion of the situation as a result of the continued occupation, and deprivation of the Palestinian people of their legitimate rights, and the repetition of systematic provocations against its sanctities.” But Riyadh has hardly needed Iran to determine this position, which has been Saudi Arabia’s historical stance, and which it has never said it would change: No recognition of Israel so long as Palestinians remain stateless.'
'Therein lies the real dilemma for the Israeli government. The decades-long delusion that Israel could ignore, manage, shrink, or simply forget its conflict with its Palestinian neighbors has been a costly blunder. Netanyahu imagined that he could sustain the occupation of the West Bank without hampering the country’s continued diplomatic and economic success. But as other Israelis have long warned, this was a bubble ultimately due to burst. The Iranian regime is arming Palestinians and driving them toward its own murderous agenda vis-à-vis Israelis. But Israel’s continued subjugation of Palestinians is what allows such a festering wound to exist in the first place, giving Tehran an easy issue to exploit.'
'Allying with Tehran, doing its bidding, and bringing terror upon innocent Israeli civilians will not bring Palestinians any positive outcomes. Seven million Jewish Israelis and the State of Israel are not going anywhere, and so long as Palestinians don’t seek a strategy predicated upon coexistence, they will find no path forward. We have been here before: During the Second Intifada of 2000–05, the murders of Israeli civilians by Hamas and other Palestinian factions served only to weaken Israel’s pro-peace camp and lay the ground for the rise of the far right. A similar outcome today will not be in either society’s interest. Nor will it help the Iranian people, many of whom have long shown their opposition to the regime’s anti-Israel obsession, and some of whom are already protesting the regime’s support for the Palestinian attacks. They have no interest in a conflict with Israel.'
'As he was hurrying to the northern front on Saturday, a reserve senior officer of the Israel Defense Forces told Haaretz: “We were living in an imaginary reality for years.” He was talking about Israeli intelligence failures, but an equally imaginary reality is that Israelis can have normal lives so long as millions of Palestinians don’t. We can only hope that responsible actors in the region and beyond can bring about a cease-fire in the days ahead, before the conflagration gets any bigger. But in the long term, countering Tehran’s murderous agenda will require a durable solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict itself.'
(TheAtlantic) Sorry that a gifted link is not available.
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2023/10/hamas-iran-tehran-axis-israel-war/675586/
I subscribe to The Atlantic and will read this, thank you for sending. It's not time for this now, however. Instead, in the words of my Rabbi: "Right now it is proper to say Tehillim. Chapters 120 and 121 are appropriate. Right now it is worthy to banish all thoughts of hatred of our people with whom we may disagree, to put our petty differences aside and concentrate on making ourselves and everyone around us better. We hope that Israelis will get this memo as well. We will much more readily be able to confront our bitter enemies if those with political differences can sit at a table and work out their differences. I believe that we will finally see this happen soon. Many people in our inner circle have children or relatives who were called up for the army. 150,000 reservists we’re just called up." Just an offering of the current reality. Shalom.
Thanks, as always, Fern, for providing the rest of the ice-berg so that tip-of-the-ice-berg thinkers have an opportunity to see a broader, deeper reality. In addition to Heather, Joyce Vance, Robert Hubble, and Jessica Craven, Peter Beinart's Friday broadcasts are another valuable source of crucial, in-depth perspective.
Samantha Verrone, I am sorry that we cannot communicate as people open to each other's points of view. My sense is that your idea of Israel is fixed in a way that is impenetrable and absolute. Our reading of the facts is not the same. Salud!
PS Nothing that I wrote was in support of Hamas. One of the main points in my comment concerned the policies and treatment of the Palestinians by Israel and provided the link to a detailed article on that subject in VOX. Another point raised was possible role of Iran in Hamas' attack on Israel.
Again, your assumptions about me are erroneous. I've given no evidence that my ideas are impenetrable or absolute. I spoke of my own ignorance about solutions for the region, but that what's clear enough is that the situation isn't black or white; that Jewish civilians are under siege in a way we haven't seen in many years. I didn't accuse you of supporting Hamas. I asked you questions you have chosen not to answer. So be it.
Fern, thank you for these additional articles to study. How do you stay hopeful in all of this?
Fern certainly does a tremendous job of adding to the conversation. This is a human tragedy that has been brewing for decades. How, indeed, do we stay hopeful? But giving up is not an option!
Dear Someone,
Never give up. War is no answer.
How do you make peace with people who have been mad at you since 1948?
There is always a way.
Fran, thanks for reminding us that there is no innocence on either side. Bebe has treated Palestinians as an unwanted burden to be disposed - this is where it lead. There is blame on both sides.
Foreboding indeed...
Well said.
Ralph, thank you for this-beautifully said.
Thank you Ralph Allen,
I am getting back under the bed.....
Do know that whatever sense of sanity we can hold onto will be my mantra...I am here sending my energy and love to those who seek truth over manipulation and lies. Please please let us be smart.... maybe for all the other creatures that inhabit our planet and who do so without harming the rest of us! May we consider those who do not harm, but who exist as positive life forces.
🌎💕🦋🎶🌈
What an effing mess our world is in! All caused by men. Reminder: the recent Nobel Peace Prize was given to Narges Mohammadi, an Iranian human rights activist who is jailed in Iran. Jailed for reporting the horrendous tortures and murders happening to its people.
Marlene- that was my reaction too. Honest to God, a sub sector of the male of the species continues to foist violence everywhere now and throughout history and for what gain/benefit?! Yes, there are some rogue women, but it is not in our DNA to imprison large swaths of populations, blow things up, kill people, and set life up for misery and destruction.
Israel treats the Palestinians like slaves withholding the basic necessities. They limit the ability of Palestinians to advance in society and control other parts of their lives.
While I don't condone or praise Hama's actions, this was never going to end well. When you have nothing to lose and are treated badly, this is what happens.
I agree that it was probably men that planned this attack, but like Republican women that vote time and again for Trump and his MAGAs, they are not without blame.
Violence is wrong. The attack by Hamas will not get them what they want. In fact, it will set back the Palestinian cause dramatically. The international reaction (blowback) to a surprise attack leaving so many casualties will hurt for decades. Stupid.
But Gary, you are spot on. Now, at the risk of inviting an onslaught of criticism, let's be clear that the truth as to why this happened is painful and almost impossible for most "Westerners" to accept. We need to hold "Bibi" and his ultra extreme comrades responsible for the oppression and horrific life they have sentenced the people of Gaza to. This was no random attack. This was a retaliation. This was a scream for help.
My hope is that this will bring attention to the brutality that Palestinians have suffered.
And maybe, just maybe, "Bibi" will catch enough flack for letting this happen on his watch that he will be toppled. Israel is known for having one of the finest intelligence services on the planet. This failure should be on Netanyahu - the Trump of the Middle East.
There are many, many moderate peace loving Israelis who have been advocating for Palestinian rights. For a solution. Whether it be Israeli citizenship or whether it be a two state solution. But Netanyahu has assembled around him ultra extreme players who have no interests other than their own. In a geo-political and historical sense Benjamin Netanyahu invited this attack.
No attack or violence is OK. Don't get me wrong. But you can't put a lot of people in a cage and starve them of a reasonable life and expect them to send white doves of peace.
You are spot on. Netanyahu, like chump, is a crook, and squatting in office as protection from prison, as chump yearns to.
Abuse of a group of people who have no options is cornering a beast. What has happened to innocent civilians certainly looks exactly like Russia.
Right On!! Biden and the rest of the US should recognize the Palestinians have rights too. Our unlimited support for Israel while they deny those rights to the Palestinians have been and continues to be a major policy error on our part.
The United States had even supported the South African Defense Force's efforts in Angola. In the 1980s, hard-line anti-communists in Washington continued to promote relations with the Apartheid government despite economic sanctions levied by the U.S. Congress.
The PLO is recognized by the USA as the governing body in Palestine, but the PLO has never been able to govern, so Hammas, which does not negotiate, has taken over. How can lsrael negotiate with such literally unruly people?
It is my understanding that the PLO disintegrated after Arafat died. Hamas is a terrorist organization which doesn’t even govern its people. The Palestinians are caught between a rock and a hard place with both Israel and Hamas taking advantage of them. Hamas abuses them as much as Israel does. I don’t give Bibi a pass, nor the Likud Party.
Not criticism, Bill, but praise. I agree totally with your post. This is a total mess and its beginnings go back to at least WWI. It could have been solved long ago by people who value peace. I do not approve of violence, but I have read enough about the Israeli treatment of Palestinians to understand it. I have long viewed the entire area of the Middle East as a quagmire.
History of Israel: Russian pogroms!
Sometime last century, can't keep track of the event but when Israel did some bulldozing of Palestinian homes in a crackdown, I thot of doing a political drawing as I did at the time.
This would show the carnage in Palestine by Israelies and up in the clouds would be Hitler & Stalin saying "We taught them well."
Bill, I think you are right on. I hope and pray the Biden administration sees this too.
Bravo, Bill. Well stated.
I totally agree that violence is wrong. Iran backs Hamas with funding and weapons and apparently was an integral part of these attacks.
As we look to Iran and their violence to women, should we expect an armed uprising in Iran as well? It seems from what the media reports that there has been little progress in both Iran and Israel in spite of their non-violent protests.
Thank you for your response.
Yes, having Palestinian friends and knowing that the United States does little to acknowledge the daily existence of people independent of Hamas in Gaza always tempers my support of Israel and the aggression of "settlers."
You have it....the aggression of "settlers."
Sadly, a number of them come from New York.
Didn't know that. Sad.
Gender blame isn't going to solve anything. It's human error. House Minority Leader Jeffries wrote a reasoned op-ed yesterday. The House needs to realize their path forward is through compromise. Israel is all the more reason for a speedy resolution to our speaker issue so the Gang of Eight can get to work.
Too bad Israel will not compromise with the Palestinians.
Ted, with respect for the obvious truth in your statement, please remember that Israel’s Arab neighbors have vowed to wipe Israel off the face of the world. Repeatedly. No Arab country willingly accepts Palestinian refugees. Why not? Though there are obvious ties to Iran in this conflict, will we discover other Arab countries/autocratic countries are also contributing? We already know that Russia is helping. Why? Obvious answer is to attack the US and further destabilize us.
What about the ongoing problems in the region in Syria and Yemen? Why so little focus on solving war and famine there from the Arab world? (The origins of the civil war in Syria are water rights for shepherds and farmers who were just shut off from access in the deepening drought that continues there. The climate crisis on steroids)
Rep. Ilhan Omar of MN has repeatedly raised the problem of the human rights abuses of the Palestinians but each time, she veered off into anti-semitic remarks on the floor of the House. The last time it happened, Pelosi publicly and roundly chastised and then disciplined her. So how and who speaks for Palestinians here? Without demonizing a people whose history is full of attempts to extirpate them?
Giant problems. No easy answers in my opinion.
Sheila, your comments are well founded. Why hasn't Israel's Arab neighbors been questioned about their vow to wipe Israel off the face of the earth? What prompted this vow? Without getting into the weeds, could it be that Israel's Arab neighbors have broken every treaty and agreement between the allied powers, the U.S. and Israel, going back more than 70 years? More recently, Israel gave up the Gaza under Israel's prime minister Ariel Sharone. What did they get in return? Bloodshed and violence from Hamas, a front group for Iran. Why hasn't Jordan absorbed some of the millions of Palestinians living in dire straights? In fact, why hasn't any of Israel's Arab neighbors who complain of the treatment being meted out by Israel willing to help? The answer lies in Iran and Russia's interest in toppling the international order.
Well said, Sheila. Thank you.
No problem there Sheila. Still someone (Israel) has to stop pushing and start to realize they are a large part of the problem. To tell the Palestinians "we will stop building and then keep building" Well......
Absolutely. Look at all the bloodshed they could have avoided.
They have tried. But Hammas doesn't compromise.
Well said.
You’re right, we women do not go that evil route. We are prime negotiators, deal-makers. We multi-task and we’re damn good at it. I honestly believe more girls/women will forego having children after all of these events. They do not want to bring others humans into a very chaotic world.
But some are cheering the arses on, met some this weekend wearing their “God is love” tee shirts and chump caps. Pharisees all…. Kudos to the women resisting such phony power plays.
I saw that crap...ugh. At least it is just some and not all the crazed women, Jeri.
in fact, less than I expected in that red, rural berg. But I didn't have a wide sample.
No 'mean girls' in your universe? Please listen to CSpan. To women in elected office, appointed office, in non-government groups such as the NRA, individuals phoning in.
Men do not have a monopoly on irrationality and violence. Women do not have a monopoly on reason and conciliation.
"Mean girls" has zero equivalency to actual rape, pillage, massacres, killing, bombing. Women rarely kill other people's children - occasionally their own. They will kill defensively to protect but as a group not the aggressors. And, women did not create weapons or continually improve their "effectiveness". The elderly, women, disabled, and children do bear the brunt of violence regardless of the "reason" or "justification" for war and violence because they end up literally caught in the crossfire. None of that is political commentary on the deadly situation in the Middle East.
That is just not true. On any level.
Read history. Read the newspapers. Look at the Greek and Hindu gods. Women's human potential for violence is only limited to certain spheres by their social and political subjugation - not by innate characteristics.
You know what, Lin . You really should give us a chance to take the lead. Women could not possibly do a worse job tham men throughout history. It has been war, war and more war. Great Record ! Last night we watched “ The Deer Hunter” and I was on the verge of tears throughout. Those heedless, goofy boys in the beginning and the broken, lost men at the end of their tour in Vietnam. How awful to face this again and again. I do think I have better innate characteristics. I wish I had the power.
lin', you are only focusing on innate as causal. By violence, I mean, words, actions, and neglect. Conditioning by families and other instiutions and organization in society is much more to blame than the innate. Look more deeply and you will find that violence and neglect coupled with the absence of sufficient unconditional love in a family often creates violent behavior patterns. Sadly, some families are the place where violence is conditioned and passed through generations. Other institutions and organizations support that conditioning with the violence, not love, they put out into the world. Unconditional love does not create violence.
Janet - false equivalency is right. We will never solve the problem of male violence by pretending it doesn't exist and do horrendous damage.
You are right, IMO, Lin, men have no monopoly on irrationality and violence. We have would-be dictators here in the U.S. among our fremale population. But as to the broader problem in Israel, which was Palestine for 2,000 years, and where Israel hadn't existed for 2700 years, I recommend two books by an israelie history professor who fought in the Six-day War - Shlomo Sand, author of "The Invention of the Jewish People" and also "The Invention of the Land of Israel." They add some insight to a problem that in my viewpoint is irreconcilable.
Sand in fact does not consider the situation irreconcilable. He takes the stance of working from where we are. "He supports Israel's existence "not because of historical right, but because of the fact that it exists today and any effort to destroy it will bring new tragedies." (Wikipedia)
'Working from where we are' is a stance that best facilitates negotiations. It puts the past in its place for the purpose of moving forward. Don't bring your apologetics and grievances. Bring your aspirations and practical strategies for achieving justice as fairness going forward.
A major hindrance is power in the hands of right wing religious extremists. A lesson going forward for Americans. The unprecedented political success of right wing religious extremists and the attending unprecedented failure of intelligence in Israel - the ideological degradation of democratic institutions - should be a warning about the dangers America is bringing on itself by the deadly frivolities of Republicans. From Charles Koch and his bagman Leonard Leo's court capture to Mitch McConnell hedging his bets on Trump by keeping a Trump candidacy running, to the Freedom Caucus House follies.
lin...."right wing religious extremists" and here we have a huge problem no matter what religion they adhere to.
The friction between and among Islam, Christianity and Judaism is toxic. Religious beliefs are generally not subject to rational discourse. Here in the U.S., while the Religious Right exerts itself politically, I think that the principal motivator is racism. Why would Evangelicals follow the word of Trump instead of Christ (Matthew 25: 34-46?) It's because, in my opinion, that their racism is stronger in them than their commitment to the words of Jesus. (For the record, I don't believe that a person named Jesus as represented in the New Testament ever existed, but the Evangelicals do.)
The Battle for God by Karen Armstrong was published in 2000 but is still the best explanation for the fundamentalist developments in Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.
Responding to the stress of change by trying to turn mythos into logos looks to me to be the basis for all the authoritarian movements in the west.
Interesting assessment, lin. Thank you.
Lin, I agree with most of what you have said. However, looking at only the present conditions in Gaza ignores the historical record. Kevin McCarthy found out that agreements matter. Trust is paramount. I am sure you're aware that the League of nations signed off on a home for Israel. The Balfour Declaration, the Picot agreement, four major wars, and four Presidents have not succeeded in bringing peace to the region. Ariel Sharone removed all of his troops from Gaza. Israeli settlers that lived there for years were evicted from their homes and absorbed elsewhere. Why hasn't one of Gaza's neighbors accepted the Gazan's? Why has Iran taken a vow to wipe Israel off the face of the earth. People that place explosives under their own peoples'homes could care less about the Gazans. Each war brings the same criticism of Israel, not the Palestinians or their enablers. Yes, these supporters give lip service to the way Hamas treats their people ad indoctrinates their children, but there is always a BUT the Israelis are to blame in the final analysis.! The criticism works for those that see the Palestinians as the victims. I submit that there are two sides to this story. The Israeli gov't has made tremendous sacrifices in the hope of achieving a lasting peace and have utterly failed!
I know there are “mean girls”, lin, but they are few and far between from men who have a desire to rape and murder.
I agree. Men are responsible for 90% of the violence world.
We women can be just as bad as men, particularly in goading them on to “protect us & our children”.
HulitC, that's a false equivalency statement. If that is not your intent, then perhaps you should clarify it.
Please point out the false equivalency.
lin˙, the words, "women can be just as bad as men" is a false equivalency statement because it implies that men and women are equally responsible for propagating and perpetrating violence.
But all humans are equally capable and responsible for violence. The human potential is there in all settings. And given the political power, in warfare as well - Margaret Thatcher and the Falklands War.
You can play with words but yes women can be just as bad, just in different ways then men.
The difference is testosterone.
I guess we should not forget, too soon, that it was Hillary Clinton, who, in 2011/2012, pushed hard for Obama to arm the "rebels" in Syria. Thus began the huge mess in Syria that has led to more than a decade of civil war and the largest human diaspora since WW II and the largest human diaspora from the Middle East in history.
Obama, out of office, once said that arming those rebels was the single worst decision of his administration.
Hillary's passion for blood decision did lead, ultimately, to the largest human diaspora from the Middle East (to Europe, the US, South America and Australia) in middle eastern history.
Hillary's bloodlust decision, which resulted in that large human migration to Europe, is the most significant reason that far right parties are gaining power in Europe now due to the massive immigration of "different" people to Europe.
One could say that Hillary's desire for blood, by arming a bunch of bloodthirsty "rebels", in the hopes of deposing Bashar Al Assad has destabilized the entire world and not be wrong.
Let us not forget the women with poor judgement that have massively affected our planet as well as the men.
As for Hamas, IF I was living in the West Bank as an Arab, I would probably be a member.
Since 1948 when the US army forcibly cleared the Arabs out of Jerusalem and forced them into camps without much food or water and without care for their children the Arabs have been beyond poorly treated by Israel and the US.
.....AND, now as Israel breaks all of its agreements about not building in the West Bank and as Israel CONTINUES to bulldoze Arab houses in the West Bank, sometimes with the grandma STILL IN THE HOUSE, I figure I would have a particular burn too.
The mess that the US created in 1948 just goes on and on and on and on.
Give it up Mike S. I read your comments most of the time. But today. just SHUT UP about Hillary.
Rhonda,
Thank you for your feedback. What I wrote is exactly the truth of history. It is not me that is speaking, it is our history. We should not forget it because we like Hillary.
If we do, how are we different from a Republican who wants to forget Reagan, Bush, and Trump?
Maybe you could couch your argument in terms of faulty use of intelligence rather than ascribing blame to one woman over her alleged "blood lust?"
Carol and Jim,
Ah, it is true that I don't know if she was lusting for blood. That was just the outcome, lots of blood.
Maybe she was just ignorant. Which led to massive loss of blood.
Could be. If so, I take back the blood lust comment.
Mike, history is important, as well as the covert decisions made by diplomats engaged in multi- level international chess games to further specific agendas. Thanks for going beyond today’s news to offer “root causes” of mass immigrations of people away from their lands. I was never a Hillary fan; her cold calculating manner was unsettling to me but my point is, someone starting accusing “men” in general for the world’s violence; you offered a rebuttal using Clinton. Don’t shut up about Clinton, she’s earned her critics with her own actions; she is no sacred cow
You know what struck me from your comment? “Her cold calculating manner.” If she were anything other as SoS, she’d have been characterized a hysterical woman. Her display of a style of management highly prized in a man is denigrated in a woman. I don’t mean to say you’re sexist—I only mean either way, as a woman, she’d be criticized. Been there, done that.
I found this highly enlightening. https://open.substack.com/pub/simonwdc/p/the-gops-appeasement-of-putin-is?r=6ptqj&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
How does Putin find time to run Russia with his hands all over the globe?
I’ve admittedly been weak on my studies about the Middle East. I always felt that I was coming in at the middle of the story and was so confused. It’s only been the last few years that I’ve tried to grasp the history of this entire area.
This attack was horrific, and certainly the ‘surprise’ factor raises a lot of questions as Dr. R suggests!
I guess my ultimate confusion is that Israel was created (this is a gross oversimplification) in an area populated by other people. And that alone seems like a recipe for trouble. And Netanyahu has been telling the residents of Gaza to get out?! This is really confusing for me to understand! They can’t, am I right about this?
I guess I’m having trouble seeing this as a black and white issue.
Both sides have been complicit in prolonging the disharmony it seems?!
I certainly hope that you don’t react negatively to my comments, it just seems so impossible to resolve?
Yes, you understand correctly. Jews who survived the Nazis were homeless and landless. They needed a place to go. Israel was created. Trouble was, there were already people living there. Their farms and homes were taken and now they were displaced. Areas they were shoved into and/or promised to them have shrunk. Israel has not been an accommodating landlord, and Bibi in particular has become more and more right wing. Most of the Israeli people want there to be peace but Bibi has no interest. There is absolutely no future for young Palestinians. It’s the saddest situation on earth. It’s also complex.
MLMinET. Israel wasn't just created without the agreement in 1920 from the allied powers and the U.S. The land that was promised to them in the balfour declaration was reneged on. Churchill, in order to get the cooperation of his friend Abdullah the land promised to the Jews by 80% in order to create Trans Jordan the land that does not presently allow Palestinians to enter. The facts do matter.
so sad....
My sentiments exactly. I too I only have limited knowledge of this geography and history and remain quiet on these issues due to ignorance.
I will say though as a Jew my heart has gone out to the Palestinians caught in this crossfire. I visited Israel some years ago and my overall feeling of the country was one of terror and sadness.
Bless you Marj
Cynthia, it's certainly complex and definitely not black and white. It's made more complex over the years as insults, real and perceived, have compounded over the decades. One point: Both Israeli and Palestinian societies are complex and have internal rivalries that create inconsistencies and problems as different factions cycle into power. Another point: Palestinians are not part of any surrounding Arab country. Jordan didn't want the West Bank Palestinians and Egypt restricts movement of Gaza Palestinians. Many of those Palestinians' parents used to live within the present day boundary of Israel, but were displaced just before and during the 1948 conflict. They have been a people at society's margins since before the start of the 20th century, before the creation of Israel. The reality is that originally, there isn't any good reason for an Arab-Israeli conflict.
Palestinians, unfortunately, never had an effective advocate, partially because they are originally migrants from other parts of the Middle Eat and N Africa. Jews did have advocates and also garnered sympathy after the Holocaust. When the UN voted to create 2 countries, one for Palestinians and the second for Jews to join the Jews already there, Arab countries rejected that plan and invaded the fledgling Israel in 1948.
It gets ever more complex from that point. Both sides have made egregious errors since, and both have reason to point blame at the other. But the underlying origin story is important to keep in mind as one hears the hostile accusations. I'm leaving out the 1967 war, the rise of Al Fatah, the Palestinian Authority, and Hamas. I'm leaving out the 1973 war exactly 50 years ago, another surprise invasion by surrounding Arab countries. I'm leaving out the rise of militant Jewish factions that have grown in influence and are now, in different forms, part of the governing coalition leading Israel. I'm leaving out Syrian, Egyptian, Jordanian and Lebanese politics. I'm leaving out the influence exerted over the years by Saudi Arabia, Iran, Turkey, Russia, the U.S. and various groups within it.
It's a hot mess, while millions of Israelis and Palestinians just want to live their lives. Individually, they are hard working, respectful, idealistic, and even funny. I've visited there multiple times a year for decades (personal and business), and I still don't understand it. I do hold the conviction tthat regardless of any legal excuse, Israel should never have allowed Jewish settlements to be built in the West Bank.
Jerry, Iran has vowed to wipe Israel off the face of the earth? Why hasn't any of Israel's Arab neighbors rejected that vow? They have reneged on every treaty and agreement brokered between the allied powers, the U.S and Israel going back more than 70 years.
You summarized Israel's history, but left out the fact that Jordan did not exist before Churchill reduced Palestine, the land originally promised to Israel by the allied powers and the U.S. by 80%. Churchill was seeking the cooperation from his friend Abdullah II and created Trans Jordan. That is the land Gaza's Palestinians inhabited and should inhabit today. Palestinians were not ejected from Israel. Many Palestinians stayed and are represented in the Israeli gov't today.
Iran is ruled by its religious leaders. The Quoran says all infidels must be killed.
Yes, yes. but I was trying to keep the history simple and focused so I can respond to another comment. Of course Palestinians were not completely ejected from what is today's Israel, but many did leave their homes in anticipation of an anticipation of an Arab victory in 1948, which never happened and which meant they were then unable to return to their homes.
Cynthia, in describing your own understanding of the history, you've also described mine, to some extent. I've been watching for some time and have some Jello opinions I don't express because I'm sure I don't fully understand the complexities of the system. I'm keeping my ears open and hope someone offers us a little more insight.
Jennie, you describe me as well, especially utilizing the steadfastness of jello to illustrate.
Jews have lived in the area for centuries. The land we are talking about was originally a swamp. Arab Sheiks were more than happy to sell the land to the highest bidder. Jewish organizations bought thousands of acres. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_land_purchase_in_Palestine#Influence_on_population
Cite your source for the US Arny pushing Arabs out of Jerusalem. It was part of a region controlled by England at that time. That's just one turd you aim to spread. In general, you mix pearls of truth with propaganda, making you unbelievable. Stick to the facts that show U.S., Arab, and Israeli missteps that is the tragedy of errors that is the Arab/Israeli conflict, and you might get some intelligent replies. Until then, you keep sounding like a Russian troll.
To whom are you directing your comment?
I was responding to Mike S's comment
Mike, this whole post seems rather unlike you. In particular, the part about US troops in Jerusalem in 1948? The British Army in Transjordan generally sided with Jordanian forces, but the British Army forces holding Jerusalem at the time seems to have supported, or at least tried to protect the Jewish population. I can’t find any documentation of US troops on the ground there. What are you talking about? We’re you thinking of some other date?
Your arguments are so full of holes I won't even bother...
Anyway, you'll never convince me I should ever set foot in a Muslim country because of their attitude towards women. Everything else follows that.
England had a big hand in the situation in Israel, having turned off the lights, walked out and left the country ungoverned.
What you claim, that a sub-sector of men, not all men, are responsible for violence is a fair statement. But similarly, not all women are peace makers, and are perfectly capable of cruelty in their quest for, and retention of political power. There are so many examples in history of extremely cruel women, though clearly fewer than examples of men, because for much of history, men have wielded political and social power through patriarchy. The belief that women are less violent is rooted in socialization across cultures that teaches "feminine" virtues. In the nature vs. nurture debate, such feminine virtues and behaviors seem less natural than is supposed.
Ummm, please be careful with commentary that might be interpreted as tar and feathering half the population. Do the names Sidney Powell, Lauren Boebert, MTG ring any bells? Hardly nurturing and caring individuals. Have you noted the sex of half the supporters of the Beast in his rallies? I don't disagree that testosterone is a dangerous thing. Just keep in mind its Boris AND Natasha that were causing chaos and women can be just as venal, greedy and pitiless as men when it come to the pursuit of power and control.
For a moment, there, I was trying to see parallels between Rocky and Bullwinkle and today's American political parties, but the world has changed too much, and I've yet to get a sip of coffee.
I think Fractured Fairy Tales has the greatest similarity to our current political landscape. ;-)
Marlene, I have dealt with some pretty vicious women in my day. Those women put the violence, and viciousness, of men to shame.
Marlene, Janet, Jeri, Daniel, can we please leave the gender issues out of the discussion? Joe and Jill Biden are encouraging examples of two extraordinary individuals of opposite sex who have striven and continue to strive to make this world a more just and equitable place for all people.
I do apologize, Peter G. I had no intention of making my comment s as nothing about ‘gender’, or ‘sexist’ in any way. I was merely stating that all my years in law enforcement I had dealt with quite a collection of women who were quite vicious in their ways. I’ll gone step even further, for your sake, and say that I also dealt with men who were the same.
Also, a lot if the viciousness brought on by a lot of women were the cause of their men, spouses, relationships, etc. When a woman is abused by any man, and they retaliate, she should be given a medal, not prosecuted, or persecuted.
Thanks, Daniel. We suffer as a society from over reaction to the attitudes of a few misfits, like Matt Gaetz or Lauren Boebert or, in your case, a small minority of bad apple police officers, when we extrapolate their extremism to their more professional colleagues. That is our bad and the credible media hardly helps when it succumbs to amplifying such attitudes.
You are correct. The media has a really bad habit of amplifying the bad apples in the bushel. No matter if it’s in law enforcement, firefighters, first responders, or any business, but they never amplify the good that we did. Ever. But, personally, I never did what I did in my career for any praise or amplification. If the news cameras showed up, I went the other way, or found someplace to hide. I was undercover to much to be on camera in a popo uniform!
BRAVO Peter G! Well said.
We need some education here. Please read Why Men Can't Listen and Women Can't Read Roadmaps. It's fun and enlightening.
I have no doubt, I can think of a few examples, headlining daily. Or, think back to the first person I ever called evil, a she devil…
As suggested yesterday, please contact your Republican Congresscritters and urge them to get back to DC and sort out the mess they have made by giving in to the far-right members of their party.
I will again contact Don Bacon as he has shown at times that he can be reasonable unlike the majority of the Republicans caucus.
All caused by men? Please. There is a long list of female big mess contributors and perpetuators. Maggie Thatcher was evil incarnate. I’ll give you a solid majority assertion that men are the issue, but ‘all’ is fallacious. Here’s one of our own contributors to the ‘effing mess’:
https://www.caitlinjohnst.one/p/queen-warmonger-hillary-clinton-complains
Thx for the Clinton link. Award Ceremonies. How fitting
Marlene, I agree. The men who have oversized, rampant, dastardly egos cause violence and destruction everywhere they go. Thankful, for the men who are not like this.
I never meant all men but if people cannot ascertain what I meant, then I can’t help them.
Marlene Lerner-Bigley (CA), P.S. I changed my comment. Thanks for pointing out how my word choice struck you.
Marlene Lerner-Bigley (CA), I felt compelled to respond to your post because I shared in your justified anger at the men who start conflicts and wars that always destroy the innocents more than them. I was also touched by your example of the brave Iranian woman. I didn't know if you were generalizing all men or not, so I just responded in a way that would make my anger clear, that I was not generalizing. But when I reread my comment, I can see how you may have thought I was assuming you were generalizing. I apologize for that. It was not my intent. I think my choice of the word, though, was not the best choice. I will think on it to see how I can change it to better reflect my intent and thoughts.
What a wonderful response, M! I really appreciate it and I bet other women will too. Thank you.
I was blaming men, then I realized it's not the male of the species, it's the species. The human race is the only mammal where the males play at games that destroy the homes of the women and children that they should be, like the other mammals, protecting. From what I can see, the females are complicit.
And, what a joke that humans think they are godlike.
God would not agree.
My sister said that at birth, male babies should have testosterone extracted from their bodies. World problems would be solved. ;)
When women run the world...maybe then.
But, the countries that keep the males intact would have a fiercer fighting force.
The others would have a peaceful population of sissies.
When women run the world...maybe then.
But, the countries that keep the males intact would have a fiercer fighting force.
The others would have a peaceful population of sissies.
When women run the world...maybe then.
But, the countries that keep the males intact would have a fiercer fighting force.
The others would have a peaceful population of sissies.
When women run the world...maybe then.
But, the countries that keep the males intact would have a fiercer fighting force.
The others would have a peaceful population of sissies.
When women run the world...maybe then.
But, the countries that keep the males intact would have a fiercer fighting force.
The others would have a peaceful population of sissies.
When women run the world...maybe then.
But, the countries that keep the males intact would have a fiercer fighting force.
The others would have a peaceful population of sissies.
I kept thinking why don't the women just tell the men to STAY HOME!....It just doesn't work that way, unfortunately.
Thank you for bringing this to light….
What if Native Americans or Black people rised up and took revenge for the hundreds of years of abuse, neglect, and cruelty? Many of us would not blame them, or even ask, what took them so long. I had that thought about Jan. 6th. If it was Black people or NA's, it would be understandable, but it was white men who could afford to take the day off and travel to the Capitol, and who have the LEAST excuse to attack this country.
AMEN! And it’s funny that you bring this up because I was having exactly the same conversation with a friend of mine 2 days ago. What the R’s are afraid of is that the white race is shrinking and so is organized religion. That’s why the fundamentalists and white supremacists acted out. They too, want to eliminate Jews and Blacks from society.
One has to wonder what would happen if politicial "leaders" stayed out of it and let the people themselves forge a solution
Hmm…now there’s a thought!👏🏼
Marlene, (I like that name -- it was also my mother's, after Marlene Dietrich) as a man rounding 3rd n the game of life, I heartily concur. The world would be a different --and better-- place if ruled by women. I've long believed that. However, I also believe tranquility wouldn't last, as men would no doubt seek to depose their female leaders and revert to their (our) ways which I believe are as embedded in our DNA as much as maternal instincts are in yours. Perhaps in 10,000 or so years, should we last as a species, we will have a single gender, blending the characteristics of male and female most likely to lead to our long term survival.
Netanyahu just may be cold blooded enough (unsurprising for being the intensifier big time of apartheid in Israel and included the naked unpunished military murder of the clearly marked woman as a (Palestinian) journalist to have known about the attack beforehand but purposely remained silent figuring the Israeli human sacrifice "for the homeland" was worth the opportunity to smash the Palestinians into bits (with Israel's far superior military force/money) which has been his playbook for a long time. Anyone believing the propaganda about the Palestinians were "unprovoked" has been living on Mars. Israel's treatment of the Palestinians has been utterly repugnant and unacceptable and relentless for years.
And the Settler crazies (most of them Americans) who have been assaulting Palestinian farms and villages for the past year with the connivance of the Kach terrorist Itzhak Ben Gvir, who Nitwityahoo gave the Interior Ministry to (putting the coyote in charge of the chicken coop) who has allowed the assaults to go uninvestigated and unpunished are the ones directly responsible for creating the "sea" for the Hamas "fish" to swim in.
Nitwityahoo is now finding out what his fucking around for the past 20 years has created. And Israel is paying for letting him and the far right fascists take control. And all so Bibi doesn't have to go to jail for his personal corruption.
I agree, TC! The Likud Party is made up of mostly ultra-Orthodox men who have only one thing in mind and that is to occupy the entire West Bank. Netanyahu is not the architect but he is a strong supporter of more settlements there. I can’t stomach him! He is Israel’s Trump. The liberal Israelis will blame him and rightfully so. I feel badly for the progressive Israelis and for the Palestinians. The Palestinian people have never been properly taken care of by Hamas.
Right with you again, Marlene! and TC! I need to shut down and try to get to sleep as it is 2:30am on the East Coast and unlike Heather, I'm useless on 4 hours of shut eye!!
Sleep tight until we win this fight!
Marlene, I agree, but would like to caution you about smearing all of the Likud party with being all ultra-orthodox and supportive of total takeover of the West Bank. That's like calling all American Republicans haters of democracy. Both have allowed ugly factions to take over their political agendas.
Jerry, as the daughter of Holocaust survivors, I will call out every single person who tries to take away democracies from people using violence, lies, rape, and thievery!
“the settler crazies.” I just commented on them In reply to Selena’s comment. They’ve been assaulting the Palestinians the past year??? They’ve been categorically assaulting them since 1948….
They've been particularly out of control this year, with one of their own in charge of the police.
Well there you go...couple that with all of a sudden allowing Jews to pray at the Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem and what do you think is going to happen? These actions and the demeaning treatment toward the Palestinians is pure provocation....
The settlers been doing this since early 1900's when De'Gania Bet was established.
Damn, that sounds familiar
Good point, TC. Mossad is considered the best intelligence service in the world. The fact that Israel was “surprised” by this attack would either indicate that Mossad isn’t in bed with Netanyahu, or that he ignored the info on purpose. When Biden says, “we stand ready to offer all appropriate means of support to the Government and people of Israel,” he probably means to separate the two so he can address them individually when he needs to.
We've never done that before, though we should have. There's a first time for everything.
I get this TC, I read your letter right before Dr.R’s. Perfect companion pieces. I’m a late bloomer on the Middle East, but I’m trying to dig in and get caught up. Would appreciate any suggestions for any good books that can help me understand.
I’m about halfway through the ‘Rise and Fall of the Third Reich’, and I would love to transition to this subject after....
Thanks for keeping us informed!
“The Great War for Civilization: The Conquest of the Middle East” by Robert Fisk is probably the best overview book I have ever read on the Middle East and the reasons why we have the problems there today, brace yourself it’s sobering. There’s no way we can look at what’s happening in Israel 🇮🇱 today with understanding without seeing the “why”, there are many good books about the Middle East, this would be a primer for all of the others.
“Contested Land, Contested Memory” by Jo Roberts.
Yes, that's excellent.
thank T.C. I'm frustrated that neither book is available on Audible ... I get terrible eye strain ... but I shall persevere!
Try the e-book - you can adjust the size of the print and brightness of the screen to get what you need. A Kindle is a good investment.
Thanks!
TC, for the first time I disagree with you, because I believe the Israelis don't attack unless provoked.
Why do you believe this?
Susan, I am no expert on any of this, just another human who wonders how humans are always trying to oppress other humans and have been since our existence it seems.
My view has seen the Israelis as super aggressive oppressors of the Palestinians, constantly pushing them from their homeland and violently so quite often.
What makes you hold such a different view and how do you come by it? Seriously. I'm not looking for a fight, just understanding of different perspective.
The Israelis attack the Palestinians every day in many different ways, but not with rockets and bullets.
Do you really fault them for fighting back?
"I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore." Network
I used to think that, way back there
<Sour laughter>
Sounds familiar...
Sounds familiar.
Thank you. You said it much better than I ever could have. I have wondered how the vaunted Israeli intelligence missed the build up. That just doesn't seem possible. So innocent lives on both sides become the pawns in a game of power, and in this case, how to stay in power.
You said it better than I could. I have always felt that it is Israel fault for building more and more on the West Bank taking away the Palestinian s land. Feel they think they can do whatever they want because we will support them.
Yep, we have enabled Bibi and he has run amok. I used to have unquestioned support for Israel, but Lordy, that was back when Vanessa Redgrave supported Arafat.
When I got off a bus in Bethlehem and looked up, up at the enormous wall cutting the city in half, I got it.
I know walls have their place, but I like Patton's quote re such. "Fixed fortifications are a monument to the stupidity of man."
Yes, that was so weird for me. Still is.
Sticking more and more people into a small space is asking for combustion
Sort of like a "concentration" camp
In the elapsed time between 9/11/2001 and the second Iraq war, I thought that perhaps the Bush administration knew about 9/11, based on their actions afterward to exploit the situation to lie and start a disinformation campaign and get us back into Iraq. But they probably didn't know. They were just being evil in their willingness to exploit the situation. And deep down they were probably glad 9/11 happened, certainly Cheney and Rumsfeld.
Given the numerous warnings they apparently received from foreign intelligence, I would assume the Bush administration was well aware a major incident was about to unfold.
I do think that they believed that the targets would be military institutions. I remember that the Defense Language Institute stopped public access in August 2001. Two of my thoughts on 9/11 were "the gatez will never open again" and "Bush is going to find a way to blame this on Iraq, so se can attack them." (I had just read Shrub, in which Molly Ivins described how obsessed Bush was in "finishing" daddy Bush's job in Iraq)
I remember the first thought I had when I looked at the TV and saw the second plane hit the twin towers. "Now we get to find out what 'fuck around and find out' means."
They were deliberately ignorant, although W was just ignorant.
Well said, Ms Sweet. And anyone that doesn't realize by now that Israel has been the US's proxy in that region forever is wearing blinders. We are fully complicit in the horrific conditions the Palestinians have been subjected to under Netanyahu in particular. This violence should have come as a surprise to no one.
Knew about? I wonder if Netanyahu paid for it, in advance, from his own pocket.
I doubt very much that Netanyahu ever financed Hammas.
Hamas was initially bankrolled by Israel, to serve as a counterweight to Fatah.
Why do you doubt it, if I may ask? He has certainly benefitted from their attack, hasn't he?
Yep, got the war he has been wanting
And he also gotten the suppport that was waning dramatically. Suddenly he has people enlisting in the army where they were losing personnel. A shared enemy can bring people together. Win-win for Bibi.
Bloodshed unites, until fools punish indiscriminately. We are the best proof
Maybe it’s another war that Putin wanted.
Putin, Bibi and chump have been on the same page for years. Chaos, corruption and power. Who doubts it???
Selena, my sentiments exactly. This Hamas comparison to 9/11 is the surprise element only. We didn’t subjugate Saudis into submission cruelly turning them into second class citizens to extract their revenge. Although Hamas igniting such loss of life shatters my heart, I understand human nature. Israelis stripping Palestinians of their property and freedom hurts. I saw it first hand. When in Israel, after asking our Palestinian driver what it was like living there, he pointed to these huge dazzling white villas that settlers had built on seized Palestinian land and wouldn’t allow the Palestinians in their neighborhood. Not to mention the hundreds of thousands Palestinians displaced and thrown out of their homes since 1948. After a while, the brutality of your neighbor takes its toll and reaches a breaking point…,
Senator Bernie Sanders has said , that it is time for the state of Israel to begin treating the Palestinians like human beings. If Israel had heeded his advice this might have been avoided. But their inhumane policies continued; for example they have a practice of randomly demolishing a Palestinian home to exact retribution for various attacks. Since they are often unable to pinpoint who is responsible for aggression they punish anyone they choose. This is contrary to the Geneva Conventions and is a war crime. Although the U.S. might condemn such action, words alone will not stop such atrocities. True , Hamas is just as lawless and both sides keep the hostile actions going and going. There was combat in 1948 when Israel officially came into existence and todays news is no different than what has been going on for 75 years. I would suggest that the UN send in peace keeping troops after a ceasefire can be established. Until then , the killing and hostage taking will go on.
No kidding. I have never understood why they all can't just share the land. I realize the naiveté of my over simplistic view and just detest this innocent loss of life.
My fear is that generations having grown up with the "fight" on both sides, will not know how to live in peace. Then again, I have heard stories about the people living in peace. So maybe it's the politicians who benefit from a lack of peace.
Marj, I am with you. I have a somewhat pedestrian view of that part of the world (solidly founded on my absolute non-belief in any of the religions originating in that area) and my beliefs and opinions are not based on any actual knowledge.
Like we missed pearl harbor? Or even 9-11?? Or who killed jfk? Ugh.
Bingo. Lots of elected officials and pundits living on Mars these days.
https://www.caitlinjohnst.one/p/theyre-repeating-the-word-unprovoked
This.
My understanding is that Israel has given Palestinians all the same rights as Israeli citizens, minus actual citizenship, as long as they obey Israeli law.
Israel gives the Palestinians all the rights of a wild animal. Sparta used to declare an annual war on its captive populations, and allow any Spartan to kill any one of them without repercussion. That's the model for Israeli rule.
Perhaps you should visit.
Well perhaps giving Palestinians citizenship is the answer?
Thank you for telling both sides of the story. If the Hamas attack was a terrorist attack, so have all the attacks by the Israeli Defense Forces and Israeli settlers in Palestine been terrorist attacks. As an 81 year old cultural American Jew, I have long been against Israel’s horrible treatment of Palestinians. Most of the world’s riches go toward war and “defense” largely because there’s money in conflict, most of which is artificial. Politicians who profit from this state of affairs should be voted out of office and, perhaps, tried and convicted of war crimes.
Bibi’s war will keep that from happening.
Amen!
As long as Israel continues along the policy of subjugating and containing the Palestinians and aggressively establishing Jewish settlements in the West Bank, they can expect endless conflict in the form of uprisings from one faction or another of the political organizations that represent the Palestinian cause for independence. We can call them terrorist organizations for their tactics and their manifestos, but given that they don't have access to the industrial capacity to build a real war machine, they will continue to use what they have at their disposal. I visited Jerusalem almost 30 years ago and the status of the Palestinians has only deteriorated in the interim. Israel, of all nations, whose history across millennia is filled with periods of subjugation and cultural violence, should recognize that there is no "solution" in their treatment of another culture with similar claims to the same ground across more than a thousand years, whose 3rd holiest site is on the same temple mount as was once the Jewish nation's Temple. There's a fundamental difference between supporting Israel's security from external threats and taking sides in it's internal affairs, especially in a state of conflict which dates far further back than the establishment of the modern Jewish state. I'm sorely disappointed that our response to this inherently unstable state of affairs is to pledge unwavering support for Israel, not unlike the unthinkable concept of supporting South Africa under apartheid. The Jewish nation's history of oppression and our solidarity with their right to exist does not provide them an indefinite pass in how they treat inhabitants within their borders who demand recognition at a similar status.
When I was in grad school 50 years ago, I knew an Israeli Sabra classmate who had been a platoon commander in the IDF company that liberated the Wailing Wall in 1967. He told me that as they worshiped there for the first time in 20 years, he heard his company commander say "God, help us - we won." Israel squandered all of that when they let the Kach Krazies (all Americans) in to the West Bank.
The Israel of today, an apartheid State, armed to the teeth, funded with American taxpayers' money, and run by the narcissistic Netanyahu and the religious fanatics, would be unrecognizable to the leaders of Israel in years past. Thinking of Meir, Dayan, Eban, etc.
Absolutely! Apartheid nation is the first thing that came to mind as I saw what Israel has become. Without US support, Israel would have been forced into either a two-state solution or coexistence with the Palestinians.
Or, Herb, a Balkan kind of solution as there are so many competing factions operating in the Middle East making it more "the Muddle East!".
Absolutely correct.
Indeed, just like Abe would think of todays repubs. WTF
As I learned while in Israel, anyone who is or wants to be an American politician MUST support Israel to be elected—AIPAC.org.
Have you read O Jerusalem? It’s a masterpiece about the struggle for control of Jerusalem in 1948 as the British left. I read it decades ago. It has helped me understand the fierceness of both sides. However, that struggle has become infested by extremists in Israel, and that daily subjugation of Palestinians now existing in a ‘jail like’ strip has become intolerable especially under Nithoho’s thumbs.
Just Sayin, Thank you and others in this thread for pointing to Israel's role in its own pain: their failure to see Palestinian people as deserving life. I was appalled to hear Biden's "unwavering" support for Israel. I had foolishly expected him to say that the US would be suspending all financial aid to Israel until a solution is found that is life-giving for the Palestinians. Then I reasoned that there is no way our government can function unless Biden is re-elected and he can't expect support unless the "terrorists" are opposed and the beleaguered are supported. This position, while "disappointing" (to use a common euphemism in the public sphere for something closer to "maddening") is just one more example of how tough it is to navigate in this world. We are always having to weigh means and ends, realities, the impossibility of effecting the actual change we want to see. It's part of the tragedy of human life.
Yes. It is a terrible conundrum. I already got an email from the New York State Democratic Party asserting its unequivocal support of Israel. It's one of the few issues on which Democrats and Republicans seem to agree at the highest level.
Well outlined Just Sayin', however, what keeps appearing from both, all three, ALL sides of conflicts over Israel's existence or any state in the Middle East seems to be the ethic, almost the requirement for vengeance, "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" kind of thinking, codified in the Christian Old Testament as well as in the Koran. Israel has appeared over time to have escalated that to the Roman tactic of "decimation," retaliating tenfold. This has left them with bordering populations which themselves cannot eliminate their core dedication to the erasure of Israel, a stance rendering any diplomatic or even practical solutions virtually impossible. Adding to that state of affairs the ever more authoritarian stance of Netanyahu and it is difficult to imagine any real solution emerging from these wars and attacks no matter who gets involved.
I concur. Good analysis.
You are exactly right.
Totally agree Just Sayin’,
The hypocrisy of nitwityahoo is insulting to any thinker. Are we so dull as to think we can hide under a blanket and no one sees the light?
Well said.
Thank you, Professor Richardson.
I had just finished reading the wonderful piece about you in The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/books/2023/oct/07/american-democracy-heather-cox-richardson-trump-biden) when I opened my email to read today's Letter.
Yours is a strong and true rudder in the storm that is America today.
I saw it too. well worth a read. Among other things I appreciated the closing paragraph:
“So it’s partly a search for history but it’s also partly a search to feel like you understand the world again, which is hard to do when you’re being bombarded with hearings and lies and all that kind of crap. I actually think that the meaning of it is less about history than it is about returning to a reality based community.”
I like the "ring" of "a reality based community". It seems to me that this will remain aspirational, since Nature never fully shows her hand, but we "clever" primates have been able to dope out enough of the code to get some good things done; and of course, a lot of mischief. I want to better know reality because, it seems to me, that Reality Rules. We can play all the games we want; reality always holds (expletive deleted). Reality isn't always fun, or even fair, but it seems we have potential, by learning her ways, to more often stay on her good side. That seems self-evidently a wise and existential choice.
Viva Reality Based Communities! May they prosper.
Good words, JL!
JL Graham, Marvelously put down. “…been able to dope out enough of the code” “…since nature never fully shows her hand” “…isn’t always fun or even fair”. “…to more often stay on her good side.” All so finely wrought. I’m a lover of allowing truth to reveal herself, and being prepared to notice.
I am reminded of a memorable passage from a 2004, the New York Times story about the impact of the still-under-construction Large Hadron Collider on the credibility of String Theory:
"Dr. Shenker said it would be great to find out that string theory was right.
From the audience Dr. Greene piped up, "Wouldn't it be great either way?"
'Are you kidding me, Brian?' Dr. Shenker responded. 'How many years have you sweated on this?'
But if string theory is wrong, Dr. Greene argued, wouldn't it be good to know so physics could move on? 'Don't you want to know?' he asked."
It's not just for technical subjects. The Guardian also recently ran a story titled " ‘We have to come to grips with history’: Robert P Jones on The Hidden Roots of White Supremacy" https://www.theguardian.com/books/2023/sep/09/robert-p-jones-book-roots-white-supremacy-trump-biden-race which is an excellent read. I suspect there may be even deeper roots to racism than the "doctrine of discovery" but it proved to be very popular rationale for societal sociopathy. Tyranny always seems to indulge in faux-lofty bogus justifications. The article cites Biden, who is not my ideal president, but a refreshingly thoughtful one most of the time and for whom I am thankful:
The 46th president urged America to face its history with all its peaks and troughs, blessings and blemishes. He told an audience in the White House grounds: 'We can’t just choose to learn what we want to know. We have to learn what we should know. We should know about our country. We should know everything: the good, the bad, the truth of who we are as a nation. That’s what great nations do, and we are a great nation.'
Biden added, a little bleakly: 'We got a hell of a long way to go' .”
Figuring stuff out, or attempting to, can not only be satisfying, its a survival skill.
I read the Guardian article but did not buy the book. It’s not on Kindle yet. The article had an impact on me greatly widening my perspective on the origins of white Christian’s inhumanity to man. How did it become so ingrained and so accepted and how did it last so long without being stopped? Sounds like the edict issued by Nicholas V in 1452 was the first written rationale for condoning barbarism among white Christians. They took it from there. Genocide of the indigenous inhabitants of “America”, kidnapping and enslavement of Africans, human trafficking, our prison system, the suffocation of the middle class, and the ostracism of the poor.
But I’m not so sure that edict was the origin.
It was certainly an organized effort to excuse sociopathy. Extreme predatory sociopathy, Hitler's Nazis being one such example, seem indistinguishable, at least in effect, to what is often called "evil". Do some people lack a gene for compassion? It's possible. I have heard it professionally claimed; but our own capacities for compassion seem selective, my own included, and whole societies seem vulnerable to "Doublethink" injustices. Biden said it: 'We got a hell of a long way to go' to meet our own celebrated standards. "Normalized" injustice is hard to pry loose because so many have adapted and are to that degree invested in it. The arrogant cruelty of the murder of Emmet Till was so out there that I pierced the fog of "normalcy", and the Civil Rights movements aimed to keep that and similar horrors be pushed into the background consciousnesses of those who were not directly affected.
The fact that injustice has a very long history does not make it any more acceptable; only more pernicious.
JL , I Wish, ALL, of MANKIND, Could 'WAKE UP !" ' , & Smell the COFFEE ! . " Mother Nature, Reality, WISDOM !, .... ALL FALL, INTO One CATAGORY ! , Our LORD/GOD! , ALMIGHTY !! ( Remember, " HIS WILL, ....WILL be DONE ! OUR Very 'Exsistance' , is HIS WILL ! Gentle Quenching Rain, ..... OR ! 90 to 130 POUND HAILSTONES !! ( REVELATION 16, Verse 21 ) Will, BE! , HIS WILL !! You ! Are Absolute ! to SAY !, " I Wanna' BE !, ON GODS , SIDE !! " HAVE FAITH !, PRAY !, ( ALOT! ) AND! THE ONE "VOTE", That REALLY COUNTS . * GODS WILL, .....BE DONE !! BLESSINGS !!
No one wants to read something filled with all caps. They skip it. If you have something you want to share please express it in a few words that hold your intention of what you are trying to say.
Plus, it’s very difficult to read, if you wanted to do so.
This guy is all about lame efforts for an attention grab, sans anything relevant to contribute. Very annoying and insulting to HCR's excellent work and her readers.
GOD. BLESS !!!, You !, ....too !
Susan. !
(My. UPPER. CASE,, ....
is. For, .....Express ion. !, SORRY !,
I. OFFENDED, you, BLESSINGS !
I like your comment. And as far as reality is concerend, it is what bothers me so much about the parents who want to protect their children from difficult subjects in school. The parent can, and should, point out the the ulitmate reason for learning such subjects, that it is not to make anyone feel bad but instead to help us understand and do better in the future.
I think that kids can understand that they stand on the shoulders of the work and innovations of countless generations, but that they also inherit a legacy of their forerunner's follies and malice. It seems to me that "the young" often bring a fresh perspective to entrenched problems, that their elders tend to promote until the kids are old enough to start to impact their own entrenched society, at which point their potentially elevated aspirations rocks the boat, and the kids feel work-a-day survival pressure to adapt to the existing norms. Not that the solutions young people bring to the table are necessarily the best actionable choices, but that their perspective need to be and deserves to be taken seriously, as well as our "status quo" meaningfully questioned.
It seems to me that one of our societal rackets is to say, "Well it's too late for me, but the next generation will put it right". That just gets in the way. We as a whole society must determine, so far as it is within our power to determine, our own society's future. An abstention is as much of a vote as any. Ignorance and lies can kill; as COVID and many other aspects of our life demonstrate; and while no one can know it all, and even the aggregated wisdom of our entire species is inherently limited, attempted accuracy and honesty can be shown to be the best policy, and fortune favors the prepared mind.
Thanks for linking the Guardian article about our professor, Richard. I agree with you, it was a wonderful piece.
After reading that article about Dr. Richardson, I am seriously considering a subscription with the paper/site/source-what do we call things things today? Do you get enough added value with a subscription to make it worth ?
I support The Guardian for much the same reason that I support HVR. The value of independent, informed voices is vital, particularly in these turbulent times.
HCR - sorry.
That is a keyboard error. I usually confuse HRC with our dear Professor HCR, but that is a dyslexic thing.
I, too, support The Guardian. I'm considering upping to a monthly rather than a sporadic donation. I value their work.
So important to support journalism with integrity, now more than ever.
If you're talking about the Guardian.. it's free. And it's well worth our time..covers many US things..often in a unique way.
Yes. Do it.
Professor Richardson was interviewed on PBS, which we saw yesterday. Amazing.
Thanks for the link!
Great article!
Thank you for posting the link.
Given this terrible attack, all of the world players are reacting quite as expected, so much so that the "larger hand behind the attack" may be hiding in plain sight. After all, the one party that benefits unequivocably from this attack is Benjamin Netanyahu and his Likud party. Did Hamas really expect to conquer Israel? Or are they merely strengthening the hostile polarity that keeps both themselves and Likud in power? I suspect the latter, since every time peace looks likely to break out in Israel and it's occupied territories, inexplicable provocations suddenly take place.
The Mossad created Hamas in 1987. They outsmarted themselves when they created this Frankenstein's monster.
Thanks for the comment! Do you know more, especially why they created it? Was it sorta like the CIA arming the Taliban as a proxy against the Soviets?
Yes. See my post below.
How so?
Like this:
Hamas launched in 1988 in Gaza at the time of the first intifada, or uprising, with a charter now infamous for its anti-Semitism and its refusal to accept the existence of the Israeli state. But for more than a decade prior, Israeli authorities actively enabled its rise.
At the time, Israel's main enemy was the late Yasser Arafat's Fatah party, which formed the heart of the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO). Fatah was secular and cast in the mold of other revolutionary, leftist guerrilla movements waging insurgencies elsewhere in the world during the Cold War.
Meanwhile, the activities of Islamists affiliated with Egypt's banned Muslim Brotherhood were allowed in the open in Gaza — a radical departure from when the Strip was administered by the secular-nationalist Egyptian government of Gamal Abdel Nasser. Egypt lost control of Gaza to Israel after the 1967 Arab-Israeli war, which saw Israel also seize the West Bank. In 1966, Nasser had executed Sayyid Qutb, one of the Brotherhood's leading intellectuals. The Israelis saw Qutb's adherents in the Palestinian territories, including the wheelchair-bound Sheik Ahmed Yassin, as a useful counterweight to Arafat's PLO.
Israel's military-led administration in Gaza looked favorably on the paraplegic cleric, who set up a wide network of schools, clinics, a library and kindergartens. Sheikh Yassin formed the Islamist group Mujama al-Islamiya, which was officially recognized by Israel as a charity and then, in 1979, as an association. Israel also endorsed the establishment of the Islamic University of Gaza, which it now regards as a hotbed of militancy.
Yassin's Mujama would become Hamas. Israel jailed Yassin in 1984 on a 12-year sentence after the discovery of hidden arms caches, but he was released a year later.
After the 1993 Oslo accords, Israel's formal recognition of the PLO and the start of what we now know as the peace process, Hamas was the Israelis' bete noire. Hamas refused to accept Israel or renounce violence and became perhaps the leading institution of Palestinian resistance to Israeli occupation, which, far beyond religious ideology, is the main reason for its continued popularity among Palestinians.
Israel created Hamas like the US created the Taliban.
It's a reflection of the control the official narrative has over our consciousness that even our Heather writes that Hamas "gained control of the Gaza Strip in 2007" without mentioning that Hamas did so by winning that year's election for the Palestinian assembly! Immediately after that election, Israel imprisoned, with the aid of the Abbas clique, all the Hamas delegates from the West Bank, and closed off the Gaza strip. Israel and the PA have since worked together to isolate Gaza and made sure there would be no more elections.
There are actually roads Palestinians cannot take, requiring them to go around them to their homes. At a checkpoint our bus was boarded and our paperwork checked. We understood, though, this was fine promptly and quickly by the Israelis because we were American visitors; the Palestinians often had to wait hours to pass. Some women gave birth at the checkpoints, waiting there to pass on the way to a hospital.
Sounds plausible. It seems to me that the CIA coup in Iran enabled the theocratic fanatics. Too clever by half.
Exactly right. And just like how we created the Taliban in Afghanistan.
And once again, a so-called "cakewalk" turned to quagmire. It is chilling to recall some of the puerile right-wing predictions about how willingly Iraq would become a Westernized client state. Terminal hubris confused with competence. Will we never learn to recognize the trap?
One must recognize the history that took place before Hamas was created. "The Balfour Declaration by the British government in 1917, enshrined in a League of Nations mandate in 1920, had said that a "national home for the Jewish people" would be founded in Palestine, while preserving the "civil and religious" rights of non-Jewish communities there." BBC.
Talk about the Mandate England had over Palestine. Talk about the agreement signed by the allied powers, the U.S and Israel at the time. Talk about Churchill reducing the land Israel was originally promised by 80%, in order to enlist his friend Abdullah's cooperation. Trans Jordan was created but never allowed Gaza's Palestinians to reside there. Israel in 1948 was the size of Connecticut. Talk about the fact that Israel never ejected Palestinians. They are represented in the Israeli gov't. today. I am not disputing that Netanyahu and his right wing extremists are a milignant force in Israel, but your analysis leaves out the historical record.
Why don't you go read about the Nakhba, and how Ariel Sharon made his first reputation running an ethnic cleansing operation. And you might check up on how much "freedom" the Israeli Arabs have as second-class citizens in Israel.
I just read the morning news update in the New York Times. There's an article about the history of Hamas. It has about 80% of the information I posted at That's Another Fine Mess (which BTW was easily found in 10 seconds on Google, with much coming from Wikipedia and an article written in 2014 by Mehdi Hasan, the last time this happened.) The missing 20% in the NYT article is about how Israel created Hamas to "divide and conquer" the Palestinian movement. This is how Americans become the most ill-informed people in the world, when even the nation's finest fishwrap can't print the whole truth.
I am not defending Ariel Sharon or Netanyahu. Why don't you stick to the subject at hand? I usually admire and support your well thought out comments, but I believe you have provided a one sided view on this conflict. History matters!
https://www.timesofisrael.com/report-anti-israel-campus-protesters-were-prepped-for-months-by-outside-activists/?utm_source=The+Daily+Edition&utm_campaign=daily-edition-2024-05-05&utm_medium=email
Next, the birth of Israel in 1948 was reduced to the Nakba, or catastrophe, a Palestinian narrative of total innocence that ignores the ethnic cleansing of Jews from every place where Arab armies were victorious and the subsequent uprooting of the entire Jewish population of the Muslim world. Post-1967 Israel was cast as an apartheid state – turning Zionism, a multi-faceted movement representing Jews across the political and religious spectrum into a racist ideology and reducing an agonizingly complex national conflict into a medieval passion play about Jewish perfidy.
And now, with the Gaza War, we have come to the genocide canard, the endpoint in the process of delegitimization.
And where do you place Netanyahu in this history? What is he trying to do to Israel and the Palestinians?
Nitwityahoo is a compleat opportunist, out for himself - there's nothing he won't do if it helps Bibi. He'll take support from American "Christian Zionists" who are out to create the Battle of Armageddon in Israel so Robot Jeebus can come and throw all Jews but the 144,000 who will proclaim him the "messiah" into the fiery pit (It's there in the Bible). He'll ally with American fundamentalist religious extremists in the Settler movement who are fascist terrorists, if it keeps him out of jail for his corruption. He's the most dangerous kind of demagogue, because he will say and do anything since he believes in nothing but himself. Why do you think he and Trump get along so well? "Birds of a feather," as they say.
Made me laugh. Guys like Trump and Netty are so alike they don’t recognize or respect each other. Not really. They each think the other is a wannabe.
What do you mean “Mossad created Hamas”? I have never seen Mossad mentioned. I thought Hamas was a faction of the now defunct PLO was but I believe I was wrong.
I just posted a full history of how the Israeli security agencies created Hamas over at That's Another Fine Mess.
https://tcinla757.substack.com/p/how-israel-created-hamas
Sometimes I wonder why I'm still here, but then I read TCinLA
Thank you, Susan.
This moment didn’t happen in a vacuum. The anti-Zionist forces in academia have been preparing the ground for decades, systematically dismantling the moral basis of each stage of Zionist and Israeli history.
The attack began on the very origins of Zionism, which was transformed from a story of a dispossessed people re-indigenizing in its ancient homeland into one more sordid expression of European colonialism. (Europe’s post-Holocaust gift to the Jews: leaving us with the bill for its sins.)
I’m pretty sure if you follow the money in this, you’ll end up at Putin. He ultimately benefits.
The consequence of totally nonfunctional legislative bodies in the US encourages other entities to wreak havoc, being certain that we have been emasculated by Republicans who really should emigrate to Mars or Venezuela. As the chant used to declare so forcefully, "The world is watching!"
Think you might chose a more gender neutral term than "emasculated" How about vitiated? I hate seeing our foreign policy cast as it has been so often in the past in terms of masculine swagger with the implication of swinging a big stick.
Merriam-Webster
https://www.merriam-webster.com › dictionary › vitiate
vitiate implies a destruction of purity, validity, or effectiveness by allowing entrance of a fault or defect. a foreign policy vitiated by partisanship.
VITIATE | definition in the Cambridge English Dictionary
Cambridge Dictionary
https://dictionary.cambridge.org › dictionary › vitiate
4 days ago — to destroy or damage something: He said that American military power should never again be vitiated by political concerns. SMART ...
Georgia, thanks for teaching me a new word. I've never used the word emasculate as it has always seemed a rather stupid description to me.
I recall a chorus of "The whole world is watching", and sometimes a lot of it is, but we miss so much. The devil (and better angels) are so often in the details, which are very easy to miss, especially if we limit our attention to "If it bleeds, it leads" sources. The latter can be like performing brain surgery in boxing gloves. Sometimes disciplined, focused individuals can direct our attention to critical details we are apt to miss, or would rather not acknowledge.
I am inclined to view this attack as a byproduct of an intentional intelligence/security failure that has yielded Netanyahu precisely the excuse to engage in a devastating war against the two territories, with the added benefit of receiving international support. After all Netanyahu has a well known good relationship with Putin, and himself also has clearly and obviously been pursuing his own strong man agenda.
It definitely strikes me as a clever variation of Hitler’s Operation Himmler.
It's not safe to be Putin's tool.
I visited Kfar Aza, a kibbutz on the edge of Gaza, in March. It was founded in 1951 by Jewish immigrants, many of whom were refugees from Egypt. Egypt expelled its Jews following Israel's declaration of statehood in 1948--around 75,000 people. Anyone volunteer to take in those Jews en masse? (Some did come to the US. I've heard their stories. They are not pretty.)
Kfar Aza is lovely. And under intermittent attack from Hamas. Our guide showed us the remnants of one missile after another. Kibbutz residents from a young age learn to plan their routes across the kibbutz with the nearest bomb shelter in mind. But that was not the worst. Hamas had begun sending little parachutes with what appear to be toys across the border. They are not, but rather disguised explosives. That target the youngest children--those too little to know better.
Egypt cut ties to Gaza because 100, 000 terrorists live there. Egypt doesn't want them. It's a pretty good bet that the people of Gaza would like a better option as well, but actually Israel can't create that option with terrorists who literally want to kill them all. Are trying to kill them all. It is simply infeasible to open borders to the people who don't want to kill you when opening those borders also lets in those who do. And who will.
The terrorists have, for the moment, taken over Kfar Aza. Again, the kibbutz founded, in part, by refugees driven out of Egypt. Egypt which closed its borders to Gaza without world condemnation. I'll leave it there.
The Palestinians must accept the same reality, that there will be endless conflict as long as organizations like Hamas claim annihilation of the Jewish state as their goal. The only path to peace is through peace-making. Somewhere I read that the average age in Gaza is barely over 20 years; one wonders when a people who have only known conflict their entire lives may come to the conclusion that it isn't working as a means to a better life...
One POSSIBLE solution is for Israel to become a republic and embrace democracy. Republic = equality under the law; democracy = popular control of government. Ruling a captive population by force and terror will always fail in the long run. The Romans used to grant citizenship to the people of the territories they conquered. Israel ought to do the same.
In the best of all possible worlds. On the ground how does Israel deal with the “ we want to destroy you and seize power for ourselves” faction while giving democracy to all? The US is currently dealing with a similarly minded but not so bloodily committed faction
Huh? As far as I can tell, it's the Israelis who seek to destroy the Palestinians. They've done a pretty good job of it -- hard to imagine it was by accident.
Um, no. "They" have not. The Palestinian population has grown in both West Bank and Gaza. Israel continues to be held solely responsible for a situation for which they bear only part of the responsibility.
When you lie--deliberately or through ignorance--about the situation, when you ignore the reality of what terrorist groups owning Gaza and getting close to the same in the West Bank are doing and will do to the Palestinians, but also to reducing Israel's choices, then I have to wonder why.
Patricia, you hit the nail on the head! Ignorance about the historical record has been pervasive in the comments today. People that know better choose to present a one sided analysis of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. Thank you for setting the record straight.
You are correct that there is guilt on both sides. But when one side has overwhelming power, and the other is all but helpless, there can be no doubt whose is the principal responsibility. As for "Israel's choices", it has and has long chosen against a path of peace. It could choose a path of justice; it could choose to live up to its obligation to respect human rights; it could have chosen to fulfill the various "peace agreements" that it has made. But it has chosen otherwise. Do you ignore the "terrorist group" called the government of Israel?
They don't seem to destroy. They defend when attacked. Israelis don't start fights - they finish them. The press usually doesn't tell what provoked them.
Yeah, right. Have you been sleeping for the last fifty years?
Israel rules its captive population as the Spartans did theirs: by massacre and terror. Is it surprising that that is the lesson the Palestinians have learned? "What's taught is what's known," (k d lang).
It's a cycle of tit-for-tat terrorism -- all we can do is wait for the next outrage, from either side, and hope that somehow human feelings will arise to break the cycle. Blind support for Israel does not encourage such a break.
Just Sayin', beautifully said, "the only path to peace is through peace -making" I would offer the yang to your yin, the only path to war is through war-making. Meaning the violent individuals and groups on both sides are responsible.
oops, I meant groups, but goups might work too.
That is true. The young ones may get an education but then have nowhere to go.
Horrors, especially GOP reaction, which limits our ability to sustain effective support for ANY ally!As always, an elegant and concise report, Heather.
Thank you, Dr. Richardson. I support most Jewish people and the country of Israel. I do not and never did support Netanyahu. He is not a good person, he does not have the good of the Israeli people in mind, like trump, netanyahu favors himself above all. Since Iran supports Hamas and Russia supports Iran, it would not surprise me if this attack on Israel is an attempt to divert aid and assistance from Ukraine to Israel. We do have treaties with Israel and must give whatever support we are obligated to give, but over and above all we must assure Ukraine beats Russian and the Ukrainian people retain their freedom. Send the money and supplies where it is most needed.
Putin.
I thought the same, he could be supporting Hamas to take world attention from Ukraine, seeing how our government is in chaos due to the republican antic's here. He is not beyond doing something this evil.
Remember how quick he was to ring Netanyahu and congratulate him on his re-election? And not only that - he knows what and how much the US has sent to Ukraine. Plus he knows all about the submarines...
Simon nutshells much of it here in Hopium Chronicals. https://open.substack.com/pub/simonwdc/p/the-gops-appeasement-of-putin-is?r=6ptqj&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email
"The lack of a speaker is a problem. Although House committees can still meet, the House can’t do much."
I think it's just as well that cantankerous Republican members of the House are not represented in a major way in this current crisis. What do they have to offer, anyway? Some of the most extreme among them might welcome the conflict to further their theory of a "Christian" apocalypse brought about by conflict in the Middle East.
After funding government/Ukraine for the coming year, the 2nd best thing the GOP led House could do for America would be to adjourn until the next election. The best thing they could for America would be to emigrate to Russia and stay there, taking Trump along with them.
100 'Large BLACK KITTIES !' .....NAILED IT ! Completely WORTHLESS CLOWNS ! PS 'MANX CATS!, ' RULE ! BLESSINGS !
Minority report here, maybe. But we see/hear so little from this part of the world…
I won’t judge attacks, counter attacks and all the drama. But I will politely suggest that the only resolution is a two-state situation. Not picking any fights, but it is the only solution that does not propagate Fighting and creates real peace. Figure it out.🙏🏼 If you don’t, innocent people continue to die. I’m no expert and am an observer, neither Jewish nor Arab. Just concerned about humans. Sorry for any offense taken.
No offense taken, as I agree with you. In the early ‘70’s, I worked with an Iranian doctor who opened my eyes to the Palestinian perspective. They deserve a part of the land that is now Israel....
You sound like you expect to be attacked. Why? The two-state solution has been around for a very long time.
With so many topics that divide us as a nation, what is left to unite us? Of course, the fragmentation of media outlets doesn't help, both in terms of the number of them but also the number of commercial interruptions. It's almost as if we need to fight to regain our national attention span...
"...need to fight to regain our national attention span" SO MUCH THIS!!