672 Comments

Yet none of the Republicans I personally know will acknowledge the link between Trumps refusal to authorize the weapons shipment and Ukraine defense capabilities. Every time I mention it I get, “ Yeah but Hunter Biden…” as if Hunter Biden caused this war. The ignorance of these cultists is astounding.

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Another "but her e-mails". They don't think, so they repeat slogans.

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But blathering hateful one-liners is what made Fox billions of bucks

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TRUMP = Twisting Reality Using Malicious Platitudes

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Love this

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love it!

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Perfect!

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Billboard material!

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That's perfect!

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❤️

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Looks like Liz Cheney just gave us the one-liner we've been looking for: "The Putin wing of the Republican Party." And that has the added "panache" of being truthful, not hateful.

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Like. We could even shorten it a bit and just call it the Putin Party.

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The Putrid Putin Party

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Agree and like (heart feature not working, again).

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I believe that to be quite a sizable wing.

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Right! How about the fuselage of the Republican party?" 'cause it is.

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Well . . . when one does not have a brain of their own. Pavlov working well!

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Michael, Generally speaking, I imagine these people’s perspectives, at least to some degree, would be less foolish and more reasoned were it not for media that continue poisoning the conversation by peddling outright falsehoods and conspiracy theories. Though I don’t have a ready solution to offer, the situation clearly demands one.

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Call out fox "news" as fox entertainment would be a good place to start. After all, that is their defense of peddling lies and propaganda.

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Lynn, Another possibility is to work with our providers to remove Fox from our respective packages. Though I imagine the initial response would be something to the effect “that can’t be done,” I’ve been advised, were I to persist, I could get it done.

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I tried in Vermont, twice contacting the CEO of GMA Video. He said, of course, that he couldn't remove fox from the bundle because "people want it". I asked him if he really wanted to be giving people disinformation and lies, thus undermining our democracy. Asked him to think of his children. I canceled the package but least I got my protest to him and I did get replies. Maybe Vermonters here could also try, and others nationwide? If enough of us do it, we will show that "people don't want it"!

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It is not only the most popular "news" show by all entertainment polling ratings, it is the dominant TV "news" channel on military bases. No wonder the top brass is trying to ascertain the degree of, and eliminate, the large amount of white supremacy among the troops. Sad that their "military intelligence" has not correlated the amount of Fox "News" viewing to the extent of it.

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FOX: So popular that it was/is often in medical and business waiting rooms. I ask to turn it off or do it myself. TFG’s damaging influence continues.

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Scary!

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

The lack of critical thinking skills throughout most of our population reflects rather badly on our educational system. We are well into another generation (each 25 years or so) of Fox's Food for Fools accompanied by increasing civic irresponsibility.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Sally, I imagine you have earned the utmost respect of every subscriber, including yours truly. That said, my understanding is that people are pressing their carriers, with some success, to drop Fox from their individual subscriptions. The thinking is that if enough of us succeed, Fox, over time, will take a substantial financial hit. Of course, if the carrier denies our requests, I imagine the majority will cancel their subscriptions. For now, I think my husband and I will follow your lead and see what we can accomplish by joining up with like-minded folks in our community.

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So, I only have wifi on Xfinity now. I am also a Vermonter. For me, the TV spectrum not only included Fox, but also the dearth of meaningful content in their "packages." Now, I am streaming via Apple +. It works for me!

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Just get off cable -- then you can tell them to take their "bundle" and...store it in a most unlikely place, far away from you. Of course, you need strong internet access, but now I watch what I want, when I want. The only "ointment fly" I've discovered is that we had to subscribe to YoutubeTV in order to get sports, but Fox is easy to avoid on that platform.

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We "cut the cable" years ago, rely on over the air access to local stations, and subscribe to a select number of streaming services PLUS, of course HCR's newsletters.

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Me too, cheaper

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Easy to avoid on Youtube TV but unfortunately it's still on their list.

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We don't have strong internet access in rural Vermont.

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Hopefully that will soon change

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I have read of people getting that accomplished and I am going to do a little more research and ask them to remove News Max and OAN

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I cut the cable and switched to You Tube TV where you can select the programs you want to get, “fox news” is not on my list, btw I saved between 50-80 $ a month

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Barbara, I sure like knowing you could be able to "Get It Done".. Go Girl. However, as I posted earlier, rather than focusing on the removal of faux, tho done very quietly under the table should be part of it. My thinking is that the effort should be focused on overshadowing their looney toon repub-DUB platform. Making them lost baggage would only be part of slight-entertainment 'this New site' would offer. Because we know 'the faux' will switch every which-way to make ""Us"" to look like we are the fools and libtards trying to undo the country. There is SO MUCH material out there..waiting for The New..tadaa..."Entertainment Today". Again, the "Key" being to not acknowledge their existence. Their guests..? Hahahaa..., those mealy-mouthed POS's.., plenty to "entertain the nation, by "calling out" utter stupidity (U name it).... I call that 'front paging their miserable un-Americn ass. Treat that program (faux) as a non-entity, silence by not addressing that site would drive them ballistic, along with Hannity, Jones, Gewlianni, jerks all.

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Well, I see it this way. Russian warship-Fox News….Go f*ck your self.

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MadRussian 12A, Though I read your reply with great interest, having devoted a good part of my life to media reform, I mainly care that news media be guided by democratic principles of fairness and accuracy, that it provides open, vibrant, and diverse coverage, and that it fulfills its critical responsibility to expose deception and reveal the truth.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Good idea. Comcast provides Fox free without asking in its basic package. But MSNBC and CNN and other less entertaining news stations cost extra. We pay.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Fox News is openly beyond free speech. Seditious heresy against this nation especially since we have another “undeclared” war on our hands now. I don’t think there is any question that we are for practical purposes at war! We may not be able to hide in the hedgerows until Ukraine bleeds out.

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I stopped calling it Fox News years ago, except for Chris Wallace's Sunday program. I call it Fox TV, for that division has been 80% pure propaganda in the classic model set forth by Goebbels since 2007 (apologies to Chris Wallace, Shep Shephard, and Bret Baier). But I do admire the person who coined the term "Faux News."

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I refer to it as POX.

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He just showed up on CNN — hm-m-m-m

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The 'key' to me is, develop a un-suppressed site that caters to the real facts...like the Guardian does in print, but structured to "entertain" our kind of audience. Give us the "facts" and entertain us with the clear stupidity of repub-DUBS. Call THEM out. Make ZERO ref to faux. Make faux a non-entity. WE DO have million & billion - airs with the wherewithal to do this! Do we have freedom of speech here.., or don't we? Will someone please step up.

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Bloomberg, Dems are sorry they dissed you. We need you

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Um-m-m — that’s been done and it has gradually been part of change.

From “The Week” in 2017:

“How a new generation of left-wing podcasters are dethroning Rush Limbaugh and right-wing talk radio”

Sorry, I was unable to copy the live link.

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Could we call it something catchy like “Voice of the Free World”?

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Two thou 17 is too long ago. Admire you for noting it. I truly believe that levity is an essential element. Making fun of the repub-DUBs stupidity is the best way to "laugh" together, while being subtle allows a decibel of truth to permeate the thickest of skulls.

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I think this is a great strategy. It reinforces their non-legitimacy as a source of hard news, with the benefit of having a court ruling affirm it for anyone

who tries to push back.

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That "ready solution" was available until Reagan took a sledge hammer to fair and honest reporting. Then, the doors were opened wide for the Murdoch sewerage.

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Vince, First, an apology for not responding sooner. That said, in my view, though your remark is not entirely inaccurate, it neglects to explain the deregulation pressures that began during the Reagan era and that opened the door to the faux news of Rupert Murdock’s empire. My understanding is that said pressures emerged from a vociferous and relentless right wing campaign buoyed by the Republican National Committee.

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Thank you for this clarification. I was unaware of the underpinnings and machinations that set this deregulation in motion. We are the worse off because of it. That is especially true since the arrival of Donald Trump; and, now, a war in Europe. The disinformation being spread is most disturbing.

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Vince, Here’s a quote from Thomas Jefferson I imagine you’ll appreciate: “If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.”

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Ignorance, the root and the stem of every evil. -- Plato.

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Good memory Vince - a benefit to those of us who didn't recognize the writings on the wall.

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Thank you! I intuited Reagan as a shill for evil well before he became president.

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as a Californian, so did I..

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To me, the term "the media" is just a poorly aimed shotgun blast from the hip which misses the real target, ie "the Purveyors". Huh? Yes! To me and many others, "the media" refers to the reporter. I ask for some kind indulgence here, and entertain your well-founded criticism as good commentary. Unfortunately, the "reporter" is the face of the media. And "reporters" are most often the target...getting kicked, spit on, cameras busted, and "the Target" of our disdain for what appears on the nightly news. No? I vote YES. Yes yes.., call the reporter, trying to raise a family, pay bills, spineless for bowing to the constraints imposed. GMAB. Why? Easy, way way in the foggy background lies the purveyor, receiving payment in kind from advertisers and sponsors alike. The latter of course preferring to have their position purveyed. No? C'mon. The 'advertiser(s)' hahaha..meanwhile, are interested most in 'viewer hits'.., the result of the media (ughhh) reporters, faux, presenting crap whatever outlet/program gets plenty of "hits", which make advertisers very happy.... errr ahhh... and the PURVEYOR'(s) two olympic heated swimming pools warm and comfy up in the hills of Kat man Due (or, U-knam-it). So, may we quit blasting the "media" with 00-buck... and address these "purveyors". No? And why not "call them out"...do they have too much clout? H'mm. Spines or Slinky's? Do we have freedom of speech or don't we?

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Mar 9, 2022·edited Mar 9, 2022

MadRussian12A, First, my apologies for the delayed response. That said, if I understand you correctly, you are asserting that commercially, profit-driven media enterprises can’t make the sort of money they do and still engage in public service and deliver in-depth investigative journalism. Though your point is valid, I take heart in the increasing number of public interest groups (Common Cause among the earliest) that relentlessly press for media coverage governed by democratic principles aimed at shaping the ability of citizens to think critically about important issues.

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Barbara.., thank you very much for your response.It appears you rank among a higher echelon of people where 'ethics' prevail. And I recognize the changes you see. However (hahahha here's the good ole "however"..).., at the Big Rountable you have a seat along with a handful & a half of some "others". I would like to be one of them, or at least be offered a seat in the room. The focus of this group is to 'ensure' President Biden WINS the election. Some of the things decided upon might rub you raw, being "ethical". But right now we need to take hold of THIS situation like never before. Again, and I've said this before: "this ain't no puss game". With your altruistic thoughts, your input is invaluable, but I ask that you refer to my previous sentence.

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MadRussian12A, I appreciate your reply and would add that because politics largely is perception I’m not beyond doing what’s necessary to achieve certain ends.

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thank you for your understanding. There appears so much more Obama might have done. the demo's allowed that to muddle their thinking and lost. All the stuff KingDUB rode in on!! The DEM'S could have grabbed that material and yanked the mat right out from under the DUBS, but they failed to be clever enough to "front page" the shallowminded repubDUBs to show how they got in the way of progress. The good ole Dem's took the high road..., and paid dearly for doing so. This past election, Biden's ability to stand in the face of pure tyranny carried the day which the Dem's would have lost. This coming election, there is so much to to work with... if we are clever.

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Michael, They, those Republicans you know, remember the name 'Hunter Biden'. That's amazing, what good memories they have!

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If you responded, "I do remember Hunter Biden. I don't remember his crime...please refresh my memory?" I bet they wouldn't be able to tell you what he supposedly did that was illegal.

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Oh, Martha, do you think your question would be understood? Comprehension, is it still taught in the schools?

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Yes - comprehension and critical thinking skills are definitely taught in schools - more so than in the ‘50’s/‘60’s/‘70’s. That’s why so many Pro-Putin Republican parents are up in arms (some literally) about CRT and books that get kids to think about another person’s perspective - because they don’t want their kids to open up their minds to other ideas and be empathetic to other people’s situations.

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Krissy, Yours is a very serious, and revealing observation. To the degree that it is a reflection of Americans' war with the facts, so is it another measure of the great trouble our democracy is in.

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It has been a really long time since I was in school but I do remember being horrified that my niece was being tested with a mimeographed multiple choice high school history test in the early part of this century!

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Oh c'mon.., surely they would. They read the tabloids. They can tell you all the asspects of the Card-dashigans too. I understand tabloids are placed in all the pews in The Church of Trump. Don't go there Martha...hahahahahhhaaaa. arrrghhh!!

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You're forgetting their remarkable critical thinking abilities, their unquenchable thirst for bi-partisan co-operation, and their deep love for free and fair elections.

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🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

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😂 🤣 😂 🤣 😂 🤣 😂 🤣

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Bruce, you are absolutely right, but I wanted to name one thing that 'they' can do!

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Lie.

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B.I.N.G.O.

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point taken Fern :<)

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Bruce, What's with your nose? :>)

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Isn’t that last sentence true of all cults,

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Just ask them,

"How did Trump putting military aid on hold unless Zelensky launched an investigation HELP Ukraine?"

"What did you find so admirable about Trump withholding aid from Ukraine?"

"Tell me what makes this a good and decent thing to do."

"Tell me how your support of Trump pressuring Zelensky in exchange for military aid is a good look for you."

If they say, "yeah, but Hunter Biden..."

Ask, "What did Hunter Biden do to make Trump's friend Putin invade? Give me a detailed breakdown"

Ask, "What was good about Trump saying that he trusted Putin more than US intelligence?"

When dealing with people who don't know anything about anything, always ask open questions to demand detailed explanations of uncomfortable truths.

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How bout a new one liner to reiterate: freedom is not free

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How 'bout Thiel's comment that democracy has become incompatible with freedom? I think he's defined freedom as the ability to hurt and cheat whomever you please, whenever you please, without some pesky government interfering.

You see, that's what they want. They want a government that too weak to interfere with their activities, but still strong enough to field a police/military to keep the taxpayers, who are paying for it, from exacting revenge. They don't want the United States to fall, they just want it weak and easily manipulated.

Of course, this is painting with a very broad brush and rich people are not all "Rich F**ks." But the Rich F**ks are numerous enough and wealthy enough that their impact is enormous in our society, and the more sensible rich people are too torpid to disengage from them.

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Amen, amen, amen! Once children wanted to be cowboys, firefighters, doctors, teachers, football stars, ballerinas, even just mommies. Now, to be rich is their ambition.

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Home run Carol. When I entered corporate America our new hires with shiny and impressive business degrees burbled over with enthusiasm only to be the first to triple digits pay grade. They sharpened their knives and drove them into the backs of anyone ahead of them.

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Thiel best example of turncoat American

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Steve Bannon ties Thiel for that title.

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Thiel: “Excellent non-definition of freedom!

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Indeed! And comfortably embedded are those "purveyers of death" for democracy.., right along with those who would be prevailed upon. Money isn't a boundary, only the means to the end. Alas, but our country does have the means to deal with it...., if we choose to. Let's never give up.

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Yes, what a laundry list. And to think we should have read George Orwell as non-fiction.

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Also to quote Daniel Kahn, "Freedom is not a verb"

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A right slogan for decades

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Their ignorance is their badge of courage.

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My ex-classmate in Elkhart has posted support for Ukraine. However, it has been crickets about January 6th. She is one of those who would rather be ignorant rather than understand the problems in this country. I doubt she would acknowledge death star's contributions to the Ukraine mess either. And this week some local here tried to say that something Heather had said was a rumor. I doubt he had any idea who she is, but he does now. Btw, Heather is coming to Portland soon.

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Our Heather is going to Portland??

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Yes, I will look up the place and time. I think it's in April.

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Arlene Schnitzer Concert Hall, Portland OR, April 12, 2022

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The ignorance is deliberate, I just call it stupid since it is intransigent

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Dan Pfeiffer suggests that the problem with Democratic messaging, as reflected in polls, is insufficient education of Republicans. He links to Dr. Richardson’s interview of President Biden as an example of doing it right!

https://messagebox.substack.com/p/the-democratic-communications-chasm?r=6pp8t&s=r&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email

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Agree 1000%. Last time I looked, had over 500,000 views on YouTube. I want to add here, Ellie, that I thought it was such a relaxed, yet focused President Biden in that interview. Good leading questions and comments from Professor Richardson, but such active listening on her part. I like when two professors chat.

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Yes, two professors who manifest the best of teachers: down to earth, darn knowledgeable with facts at hand, plain spoken, humble yet authoritative, oozing integrity, and good hearted!

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Good summarizing skill, Ellie. 😂

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I don't get the "insufficient education" angle. That reminds me of those computer programmers of days gone by who would write impossible-to-use applications and then complain because people wouldn't read the manual.

Most people ain't gonna' read the manual or the wordy news analysis. Not now, not ever.

We need to craft simple, concrete and emotionally resonant messages that meet them where they are.

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Exactly our task of education: "Craft simple, concrete and emotionally resonant messages!"

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Seasoned teachers work diligently to get the emotionally relevant part. Necessary to really understand needs of students, besides one’s own. Developing that skill in a very sequential, rational way gives rise to the ability to work with any kid, any culture , any race, any disposition etc and form connection which builds trust.

Think of your fave teacher(s) from past? What is it that makes them a fave?

I cannot tell you how many past students say to me years later…”Miss…you drove me crazy at the time but I still think about a lot of things you taught me. And you were right about a lot of stuff. I wasn’t even sure I trusted you, but I knew you loved me.”

Bam! That’s everything!

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YES, even president Biden had to soften his message, "not that they're stupid," they didn't know the affordable care act saved them from getting kicked off their insurance due to a preexisting condition...they just didn't know.....sigh.

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Can you bring up the volume on that 'sigh'? Thanks, Lynn.

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Yeh... it was KABOOM...so good.

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LOL ! No Kidding !

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If we didn’t learn anything else about TFG it was to” Own The Press”. Every time he stepped out the door to get on that Helicopter they were like ‘Bee’s To Honey ‘. If there was a question he didn’t like he really didn’t answer it but instead took control by answering with is ‘Alternative Facts ‘ . President Biden needs those ‘Bee’s ‘ there and take control with the ‘Fact’s. Hit some out of the Park and walk away. TFG has made it a life long endeavor to be ‘ Relevant ‘.Biden could run circles around them. He’s been at this way longer, he’s an intelligent Statesmen and would never boast. He’s got to know you have to be the Honey to Feed the Bee’s.I know he’s busy but 10-15 minutes on an Exit would help.We live in a world of ‘Sound Bites ‘. Give them some. But I hope there is more interviews with HCR. Once I got over the shock I was delighted and captured. Not to mention so excited. Took a while for my eyeballs to get back to normal. It’s all awesome and good. This guy is profoundly right. Thanks for sharing.

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It seems like there’s alway a “good reason” for ignorance. Isn’t it more a lame excuse? How long can we blame the schools for not teaching enough critical thinking skills. What about values and common sense possibly learned at home?

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It's less about blame and more about all of us doing our part to support fact-based education, both in the here and now opportunities, and as you point out, with teaching critical thinking skills to young people--at home and in the schools and universities.

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Yes, home and schools working together. Quite a challenge with many parents who still believe TFG’s election was stolen, also believing the lies about CRT and wanting to return their schools to a time before the Scopes Trial. Maybe a slight exaggeration but the dismantling of public schools is a big concern. Agreed , we all have to do our parts in supporting education that moves us forward.

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I think that the barrier is more Pavlovian. Some of us like to consider and discuss; some of us merely salivate when the right noises are heard.

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I think it would be most appropriate to send them back to school, sentenced until they are able to graduate with a passing grade.

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It would be interesting to require passing the citizenship exam before being allowed to opine on political issues.

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I understand and I don't even watch much in the way or click-bait and memes. I do better reading transcripts, I'm print oriented, but I had no trouble (thankfully) staying focused on the interview. Perhaps because I watched it last thing at night with lights out so that the full-screen video was all that was visible?

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Additionally, Trump resisted the eventual sending of the Javelin missiles until his aides could convince him that it would be good for American business.

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We really need to keep dragging these facts out and making them defend them again, and again and again. Get all up in their faces with it and don't stop.

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Over the years I have weeded out the knuckleheads in my life. At this point I personally don't know any Reps.

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In addition to being very funny, a keen personality/political test, you had me thinking about whether I know any Republicans. I do know two of high character. They were the in the long gone old world (Eisenhower) branch of the Party.

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That may be why we are in separate armed camps.

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Just like yeah but Hilary’s emails. Garbage! Agree, in theory, that finding a way to have productive discourse would be ideal…but..fear it is wasted energy on those who appear ignorant but are truly so insecure that truth and reasoning play no part in their thought process.

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That's why we go for the influenceable folks in the middle.

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Productive, schmucktive. We need to nail their hides to the barn door.

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Michael, my all time fav. Is when he took Ivana and the kids on a Ski Vaca. and his Mistress, Marla to the same place. Here’s his 3 kids watching they’er Mother and his Girlfriend ‘Tongue Lash ‘ each other in front of TV cameras . As sick as it gets.But hey, keep sending him you’re Donations cuz he’s most likely broke if the GOP is paying his Lawyers. Hahaha ! Fools ! I read Ivana got 1/2 of Maralego. Have no idea if it’s true ?

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The "ignorance" of these cultist is self-ordained. When one witnesses the likes of Flynn, Bannon, Carlson, Bosar and on and on and on, it is clear there is a huge enemy population right here on home base. They represent the soulless darkness that has overtaken parts of our country. They thrive on tyranny, dishonesty and violence.

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They got nothing, they never have anything, so they just respond with the pat lines from their playlist. Over and over and over.

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I resent that.

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With all of the comments on this thread, I am totally curious to know why you resent this comment? I can only think there must be some misunderstanding.

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You are on the money! Your use of ‘pat lines’ prompted me to a false indignation . Sorry it caused you any concern. Those of us named Pat are often prodded by our friends. I will have to change my pat answer to ‘ I resemble that.’

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Oh jeez! I am so sorry. That was funny. I didn't see it. Thanks for letting me know!

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You stepped right in to that.

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Ha! Ha! That’s what I resorted to years ago. One unexpected consequence of our current era seems to be that folks are losing their sense of humor 😉

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I am actually dealing with a death in the family so this one can't be blamed on politics.

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This comment has sparked a fiery trail, one of the best I've seen. Yes, the difference between "These truths we hold self-evident" and "that's (not) who we are".

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The NYT rejected my latest comment:

Manhattan District Attorney Bragg’s closing down the grand jury proceedings on possible Trump criminal activities reminds me of Pulitzer-Prize-winning Jesse Eisinger’s book, THE CHICKENSHIT CLUB.

The title came from Southern New York Federal Attorney James Comey’s first meeting with his prosecutorial staff. He asked his prosecutors “Have any of you ever lost a case? If so, please raise your hand.” Not a hand came up. Then Comey said “You are all members of the Chickenshit Club.”

“You are all frightened to take on difficult cases that may blemish your ‘perfect’ records.” Eisinger’s book also described the ‘chickenshits’ in the Department of Justice who chose not to prosecute ‘difficult’ cases.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Keith, thanks. Explaining away Trump's routine escape from prosecution after a lifetime of criminal activity, including sedition in an attempt to overthrow the American government with prosecutorial ambition is a partial explanation.

The most important part of the this story is how two career lawyers spent FIVE years pursuing charges and were in the final grand jury indictment process. That would have wound up pretty soon and the fact that the new NY DA short circuited it is of great importance.

The two lawyers themselves QUIT, after the new DA killed the whole process near the end, in protest so they were willing to take it to the prosecutorial end.

It was a politician, the DA, who killed the final grand jury process.

A more complete hypothesis may include money and fear.

First Money: Trump, or Trump supporters (maybe in Russia) have routinely handed out enough money to insure his absence from prosecution.

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/332270-eric-trump-in-2014-we-dont-rely-on-american-banks-we-have-all-the-funding-we

It is not just that a DA may want a 100% record, although, many do. It is also that an elected politician, the DA, are more than willing to take money to close the case 10 minutes before charges were produced from the grand jury.

Second Fear: In Trump's case he has been supported by Russian Oligarchs for roughly 30 years.

Who wants to have one of their kids disappear for going after a loser like Trump?

Nobody.

The above observations are hypotheses based on the fact that poor people routinely go to jail for no crime or minor crime mostly because of lack of representation and advocacy. For more info on going to jail innocent if you are poor see....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just_Mercy_(book)

Trump: Has PLENTY of people advocating for him with plenty of money.

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The corruption in the USA is sky high and so is hurling accusations, which are readily accepted due to bias and or general beliefs on the part of large groups of people. This comment by you Mike would be of more consequence with evidence attached. Why has the IRS not had a case against Trump for all these years? How are our economic and legal systems corrupt - systematically so? They are major contributors to the heinous wealth gap in the country. This needs to be spelled out, so that the MAGA crowd, in addition to everyone else, knows how we have been and continue to be robbed, in part by those who so easily manipulate the American people.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Fern. Thanks for your effort to ensure veracity in published comments.

Here is one quote from Eric Trump outlining the source of Trump's money:

https://thehill.com/homenews/news/332270-eric-trump-in-2014-we-dont-rely-on-american-banks-we-have-all-the-funding-we

But, Fern, there will not be a public link to an article outlining how John Doe lawyer/DA took money into a secret Swiss Bank account, then, one week later dropped a case against Trump.

So, let me modify my comment to include the words hypothesis.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

❤️Bravo. You understood. Eliminating the 'truth' was a forte of you know who. It is one of the oldest games around. It has to be addressed in government and in what comes out of our mouths and what is expressed in our writing. Propaganda isn't limited to one side of an argument.

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Fern, it is not propaganda that two career lawyers quit after having pursued the case for five years and were in grand jury indictment proceedings when the new DA called off the whole thing after being on the job a month.

The above is fact.

It is imperative that people who can think then come up with the most probable reasons that the case was dropped when it was so close to producing charges.

Links to payoffs will not be found on the web for posting here Fern.

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To kibbitz a bit: Yes, The New York case is fact, and we know it, but for the sake of others who might read it and NOT know it; a citation of the printed information from a trusted source makes us different from talking heads who don’t have to prove anything — but just keep repeating it!

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Fern, I will be monitoring my own comments even more for cites and sources than I already do; however, I like the other replies to your reply as well.

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Gus, my intent concerns the value of facts, coming as close to the truth as we can and not indulging in unsupported accusations and the thoughtless use of language. Truth has taken a terrible beating; deep divisions among people encourages biases, finding fault to find fault, mistrusting almost everything and everyone. Standards disappear, incivility grows and 'reality' evaporates. Such behavior are aspects of a collapsing democracy.

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I don’t know how I know it’s true, I just know it’s true. Usually takes 20-30 years for any kind of public verification. Hoping for faster verification on the Kennedy/Deutsche Bank connection. So our deliberately molasses-paced legal system is a set up for the mob…

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Amen, Fern! The corruption and the wealth disparity of the U.S., as well as the dynamic interaction of the two, is something all Americans should be taught until they understand. Otherwise, those degenerate conditions will continue and progress until we are a truly failed state with the vast majority of Americans becoming serfs with very few rights. It's no wonder that revolution took place in late19th/early 20th century Russia considering that some 80% of the people were serfs or slaves. They had very little to lose by rebelling to get their rights.

We need a Department of Honorable Conduct to serve as a beacon as well as insure honest and moral methods of running a government are established and enforced. Employees would take an oath with serious consequences if they break their oaths. It might be like the Vestal Virgins of ancient Rome who faced death if they betrayed their oaths. Or like Elliot Ness and the Untouchables who were beyond corruption (as I recall). Individually, members of the DoHC could serve in the model of General George C. Marshall who was a person of immense character and ability completely dedicated to serving his country. FDR chose him [above 34 leaders who outranked him] to build the U.S. WWII military. The whole U.S. respected and fully trusted Marshall. We desperately need a George C. Marshall now. Winston Churchill named him "the architect of the Allied victory" in WWII. When Marshall had a stroke and was dying, Churchill visited him. After leaving Marshall's room, Churchill said Marshall was "the greatest Roman of them all." Funny enough, he stood up to Churchill as no one else would. After WWII, President Truman chose Marshall to be Secretary of State where he developed the Marshall Plan. As soldier and civilian, he was one of a kind. (As an aside, my father knew Marshall well [officially] as he had to brief Marshall daily on Soviet Affairs.)

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Hayden I consider George C. Marshall the greatest American of the 20th century. He was the lynch pin of WW II, could face down and be highly respected by Churchill, had incredible integrity and professional selflessness, and saved Ike’s ass several times (which Ike neglected to acknowledge when he was campaigning in Wisconsin in 1952.

Forrest Pogue’s 4-volumes on Marshall I find definitive many years later. There was also an 88-minute video (S. C Humanities Council?) that filled in some human spots from Pogue and others. Marshall’s assessment of Western Europe, after he returned from an unproductive meeting with Stalin, was the spark for the Marshall Plan, which couldn’t have been approved by a Republican Congress without Marshall’s robust support. Also, because of Marshall, the House approved the second year of the peacetime draft in 1941 by one vote.

I believe that he was the only general to receive the Nobel Peace prize.

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Keith, Listening to you and Heydon is close to heaven.

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Keith, I'm glad to see another admirer of General Marshall. Yes, Marshall saved Ike's ass on at least a few occasions. I'll mention a lesser-known example of this here. I'll wind around a bit to finally get to that instance.) My father was part of Ike's General Staff in London starting in September 1942 as they planned Operation Torch, the invasion of North Africa. The planners were really rushed for time and worked round the clock, doing in two months which normally would take at least six months. Ike arrived in Algeria in late Nov. or Dec. [after the Op. Torch landing] with half of his staff to set up his HQ in Algiers. The second half of Ike's staff, which included my father, sailed from Scotland on the SS Strathallan with 5,000 British and American soldiers on Dec. 12 headed for Algeria. Also on board were American photographer Margaret Bourke-White and Ike's driver/companion Kay Summersby. After a rough crossing through the Bay of Biscay with 60 ft. waves, the ship passed through the Straits of Gibraltar and into calmer waters. It was the night before their scheduled arrival, and around 1:30-2:00 am, they were torpedoed, and the ship started going down. My father went over the side and ended up in the water clinging to a piece of flotsam and swallowing sea water and oil all night long. He lost everything on the ship and swam [naked] to the beach the next morning. Dad was in hospital for at least a week with horrendous headaches. So, he arrived at the Algiers HQ at the end of December, a few weeks before the Casablanca Conference in January. FDR and Gen. Marshall wanted Ike to come there from Algiers which he did of course.

Now, here's an item which you probably won't find in history books or at least I didn't nor was this item known by the librarian at the Eisenhower Library; and it relates to Ike being saved by Marshall. After Ike went back to Algiers and while the Casablanca Conference was still going on, Ike sent Marshall a telegram, asking him to make a stop in Algiers before returning to Washington, D.C. Ike was having a lot of problems with antagonism between British and American staff members, notably the officers. There had been some serious fights and supposedly one British officer was killed. Ike didn't know how to handle it all since he was really OJT in his command position. Marshall did stop by for a quick meeting with all the staff officers. Gen. Marshall had such presence, and he simply told the American officers that if they didn't behave properly, they'd be sent home, which meant in shame. Marshall's experience and bearing saved Ike in this case.

Ref. the Wisconsin incident, I believe Ike's ambition to be President is what led him to leave Gen. Marshall "out to dry" after Wisconsin's Senator Joe McCarthy had made allegations about Marshall leading a secret communist gathering in Washington. I've read that Ike regretted his behavior in that incident for the rest of his life. The guilt must have been horrendous--that is, to abandon the esteemed Marshall who had given Ike every opportunity to be where he was.

I better stop for now. I really get carried away on this subject. I wrote a book about my parents' journey through WWII ("Buck and Bernice: Love in the Reign of War") in which I wrote a chapter about General Marshall. I'd be happy to send you a copy of that chapter if you write me at: buckandbernice@gmail.com and request it.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Heydon, I had the chills reading your eloquent and historical reply. It is a keeper, and I still have the chills. Thank you.

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Thanks, Fern. I appreciate that.

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With utmost respect, Heydon.

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Sadly, they don't care. They simply assume "all politicians are the same" and one of the enduring appeals of Trump is he isn't one (amusing, isn't it?)

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Gotta ❤️this one, Fern!

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We need more heart than ever! Thank you, Marlene. Here's to looking at you❤️🌿❤️🌻❤️!

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

“Who wants to have one of their kids disappear for going after a loser like Trump? Nobody.” I agree, Mike. I also know that our IRS - as a tool to fight this corruption- has been systemically underfunded for decades making it unable to pursue high net-worth corruption. You need excellence and time to peruse these corrupt power-mongers. IRS cannot afford the best and brightest, nor have they extensive time to deeply untangle the intentionally made knot of secrecy needed to peruse these cases. So paying off Congress, for decades, to underfund the IRS, has crippled our best, first tool fighting corrupt players like trump.

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Yes, the IRS has limited funding, but, they DO go after people and they NEVER went after Trump.

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They go after the small fry they have a chance in hell of netting with limited effort OR PUSHBACK. The wealthy, with their tax attorneys on retainer, make a hell scape for IRS white collar investigators. But oh my! The USA is sloshing around in hidden money. Fully funding the white collar crime unit of IRS would reap America billions that its owed.

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Yes, well TFG and the other so-called millionaires/billionaires as well.

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Michelle, totally agree with you.

That the IRS is underfunded is FACT. My thoughtful ‘hypothesis’ is that some of the IRS officials are overfunded....

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Gus, very good hypthesis indeed!

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That's it - so really the only advantage of the West is, that it can lay its hands on Trump - what it will do with that still very much remains to be seen. Do your thing, US of A.

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In South Florida there are a lot of Russians. Store signs are written in Cyrillic in Sunny Isles. Also, we have had Russian Mob attacks like throwing acid in ppl's face.

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We were staying in Sunnyvale maybe 10 years ago, we were surprised at the number of Russians there. Trump has a hotel/condo there that then seemed mostly empty.

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Thought it had more than a few Russian pregnant girls.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Mike, your arguments make no sense, and as Fern said, you provide no evidence. Heat but no light. The last thing the new DA wants to do is drop the case against Trump. Unless he sees that the case is weak. It lacks hard evidence, as the NYT explained in detail today. There are no emails or correspondence from Trump (he doesn’t use email for this reason, and he tears up all the notes from his meetings) stating that he knows he was cheating on his taxes or on loan applications. There is no credible insider willing to testify (Weisselberg is willing to go to prison rather than turn state’s evidence - he’s the guy who has all the financial info on Trump). The 2 attorneys who have invested 5 years in this case hate to give it up, and don’t want to admit that their case isn’t strong enough. Think about this - if they had the evidence would they still not have indicted Trump after 5 years? I understand that Trump is guilty as sin, a fraud and a con man. But I also get that Trump is slippery enough (trained by Roy Cohn) to leave no evidence and avoid prison. It’s not the new DA’s fault. Can you imagine how bad it would look if the new DA indicted Trump, and the jury found him not guilty due to insufficient evidence? Nor is there a fix. in. There are far more wealthy people who’d love to see Trump behind bars, if that sort of thing was purchasable. Trump is despised in NYC, and hated by the wealthy elites (with a few exceptions, like My Pillow guy). There’s no conspiracy (leave those to the Qanon wackos).

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JR, I think your opening line needs qualification. Mike's comment makes perfect sense, as does yours, which opposes Mike's conclusion. This is exactly why many (if not most) conspiracy theories work. The heart of any conspiracy theory is, "Here is the truth, which makes perfect sense. However, there is no evidence for this truth, because it has been deliberately concealed. And there is no evidence for the concealment, because the people who concealed it were good at their job."

Or the evidence is inherently unknowable. For instance, you state, "The last thing the new DA wants to do is drop the case against Trump." You have no evidence for that statement, and even if you knew the new DA personally, you could have no evidence, because he could be lying to you. You are talking about how another person ranks internal motivations. Hardly anyone living has an especially clear notion of their OWN ranking of motivations, much less someone else's.

One rule used in science is Occam's Razor, which gives preference to simplicity. That works reasonably well with "inanimate" reality, because we assume electrons and gasses don't have "motivations" at all. Move it up to the level of "animate" reality, even at the level of microbes, and you suddenly get "motivations." How, exactly, does a yeast colony work? Certainly not like an ideal gas.

I've dismissed a lot of "hearsay" about Trump and Putin that is, right now, starting to look a WHOLE lot more probable. For instance, John Bolton has said that Putin held off on his invasion of Ukraine because he expected Trump to withdraw the US from NATO in his second term. In 2017, this would have sounded like a completely wild conspiracy theory. In 2022, it makes perfect sense. Is there evidence beyond Bolton's statement? ::shrug:: Time will tell.

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Sorry Joe, not buying it. The reason it makes no sense for the DA to kill this case is that doing so likely ends his political career. He is an elected official, in a post that most pursue as a stepping stone to higher, state-wide office. Said DA is being pilloried today by commenters here, in the NYT and elsewhere. Most accuse him of taking bribes or being a secret Trump enabler. All promise to never vote for him again. Others call him a coward. His political career is over. The cowardly, low-risk thing to do for the DA would have been to issue an indictment he didn’t believe in and go to trial. If Trump was declared not guilty, the blame would go to Cyrus Vance, or the 2 career lawyers. The DA could say, “I just got here, I was following their advice”. Or he could blame the judge, or the jury.

Meanwhile, Mike’s saying the case was dropped because of bribes by mythical (Russian or otherwise) billionaires or fear of children being assassinated by Russian oligarchs. You know, logical stuff.

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JR. Let's say you were a DA but were offered $45 million to kill the case.

Would you worry much about re-election after the deposit was made in the Swiss Bank account??

:-)

I think not my friend.

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Mike, that’s the silliest conjecture I’ve heard here so far (which is saying something). How about, “Let’s say that Danaerys Targaryan threatened to fry the DA with dragon fire unless he dropped the case.” You’re just making stuff up. We have to be better than the MAGA crowd. No baseless conspiracies, stick to facts.

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That's a good argument, given that this is a New York DA. OTOH, if he's a Trumpite....

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A Trumpite? Do you know anything about the man?

“Bragg, a Democrat, earned his A.B. from Harvard University, a J.D. from Harvard Law School, clerked for Hon. Robert P. Patterson, Jr. in the Southern District of New York, and was a Visiting Professor of Law and Co-Director of the Racial Justice Project at New York Law School. Alvin is a former member of the Board of Directors of the New York Urban League and a Sunday School teacher at his church…. In 2017, Eric Schneiderman, then serving as attorney general, appointed Bragg Chief Deputy Attorney General of New York. Bragg ran the criminal justice and social justice divisions, overseeing lawsuits brought by the state against the Donald J. Trump Foundation, Harvey Weinstein and The Weinstein Company, and the addition of a citizenship question on the 2020 United States Census. He left the position in December 2018 and became a professor at the New York Law School, where he was co-director of the Racial Justice Project. Bragg is a member of the board of directors for the Legal Aid Society. He has represented the families of Ramarley Graham and Eric Garner in civil litigation against New York City.”

Does he sound like a Trumpite? Can we not resort to ridiculous conjecture?

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

You say Mike's comment makes 'perfect sense'. Can you present an argument for that Joseph that will not take up more that two legal size pages and make sense as well?

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It seems pretty obvious to me.

Two lead attorneys spend five years building a difficult case, with support of their boss, and are coming to the end of the process, and suddenly, they have a new boss who quashes the investigation. They quit. Those are the basic facts, right? The question is, why?

Two hypotheses are obvious, amid others.

1) Michael's hypothesis is that the new boss is a shill who shut down the investigation for corrupt motives, and the attorneys quit in disgust.

2) JR's hypothesis is that the new boss is clearer-eyed than the old boss, concluded that the case could not succeed, and decided to shut down the investigation as a waste of time and resources. The attorneys quit in disgust.

A third variant suggests itself.

3) The new boss, taking over, started asking some hard questions of the two attorneys, the attorneys did not have good answers and, "not feeling appropriately supported" by their new boss, threatened to walk out. The boss, angry at being railroaded by his subordinates and concerned by the lack of good answers, decides to call their bluff and shut down the project, after which the attorneys quit.

All three of these hypotheses, in the absence of evidence, make perfect sense. I've seen all three scenarios play out in corporate environments over much lower-stakes conflicts.

Does that clarify?

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Joseph.

Yes, Why would the new DA interrupt the grand jury process EVEN if he had a perception different from the people who spent FIVE years on it.

Let it play out like all the rest of them do. If the grand jury produces no indictments, well, there you have it.

BUT WE WILL NEVER KNOW now will we.?

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Much time and many suppositions would have been unnecessary had you read the article in question. See the link below.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/05/nyregion/trump-investigation-manhattan-da-alvin-bragg.html?searchResultPosition=1

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Fern is correct; it`s called an "Opening Argument" which must resonate with a Jury & be supported by copious amounts of admissible evidence. Note, jurors have done their own property evaluations.

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Bryan, Thank you for the amicus brief. Can I take you with me?

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Joseph,

Makes perfect sense. I am sure if Trump wins, he will remove us from NATO.

Tucker Carlson will tell Americans what to think about that, and, they will think what Tucker Carlson wants them to think.

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Thank you JR for your perspective on this.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

JR.

Thanks.

Two career lawyers with the NY DA office spent five years pursuing this case and at no time indicated they wanted to throw in the towel. They were in the final stages of sorting grand jury indictments. To kill the case BEFORE that outcome is what makes no sense JR.

But, to make sense of what makes no sense, I wrote what I wrote.

The two lawyers on the case, at no time, bagged it or said it was not possible to win indictments.

Then, one month after a new DA was elected, he killed the grand jury standard process.

Why?

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I've been thinking along the same lines. Trump was never alone in his crimes. He would never have made it into the Oval Office alone.

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The US can thank Robert and Diana Mercer for funding Cambridge Analytica's development in Britain, then paying to establish it in the US and paying the Trump campaign to adopt it; then paying for Facebook to use it. The Mercers also paid for Steve Bannon's and KellyAnne Conway's salaries to take over the floundering Trump campaign in 2016 after Manafort resigned.

Then there's the deal Trump made with Sheldon Adelson--always transactional. Just as Trump adopted the Federalist Society List of potential SCOTUS nominees in exchange for money and votes, Trump adopted Adelson's wish list for Israel in exchange for Adelson's money. (not being antisemitic; had friends in ZOA who bragged about the deal.) One more item on Adelson's list: Marion Adelson received the Presidential Medal of Freedom from Trump.

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And all of this took place in plain view of those who are heavily involved in political matters. It's no wonder that our democracy is in peril, and that's not hyperbole.

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Republicans not only knew; made crucial introductions and applauded—and voted for Trump. It’s a pivotal moment for the US, as Heather stated with President Biden

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He was a useful idiot, not only to Putin, but also the Republicans, and will continue to be - until he is viewed as a liability.

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Head spinning here…

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Thanks Mike. After following your link I was hooked. I feel compelled to read it.

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Yes indeed.

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I thought the practically synchronized timing of (1) the closing of those grand jury proceedings (and the resulting/nearly immediate resignation of the two attorneys who had invested so much time in the case’s investigation), and (2) the invasion of Ukraine was not coincidental. The news barely covered (1), buried as it was under the rumble of Russia’s invading tankers. That TrumPutin mutual admiration and alliance has never been more suspicious!

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One of the articles (https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/05/nyregion/trump-investigation-manhattan-da-alvin-bragg.html) about Bragg's take over from Vance makes some of the turmoil around the iDJiT investigation appear to be an interoffice kerfuffle.

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Pamela, we can assume that new DA provided the information to the NY Times, hence, it is biased to make it look like the new DA's perspective.

The truth is, two career lawyers were in the process of closing out indictments in a grand jury process that needed NO interruption whatsoever.

The DA's keebosh on the case smells so bad I can hardly breathe.

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I feel the fire coming from all ends of your body. Oh, it’s mine!

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It is not only Prosecutorial Fear (the Cs Club); proseccutors need a cohesive team with capable investigatory skills and an experienced Trial Attorney`s knowlege of the "FRE", Federal Rules of Evidence. Much broader use of Pre-Trial motions called motions in limine would help too. Check out the skilled lawyers in the Backroom of the Jan 6th Committee offices. Team members do not have to be lawyers. It's called good legal work.

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Mar 6, 2022·edited Mar 6, 2022

Bryan Manhattan DA Vance brought in two superbly qualified lawyers to handle the Trump criminal prosecution. They pleaded with DA Bragg to continue the case. When he refused, they resigned the same day. These prosecutors were ready to risk their reputations in trying a ‘difficult case.’

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I am well aware of the new DA`s blunder. As to the specific prosecutors who resigned, their sterling reputations & skill are already well known well beyond NY.

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So what happens now? Is there any way to override DA Bragg’s decision?

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Barb As Manhattan DA Bragg has the ultimate authority, as did Vance, to decide whom to prosecute. Only if there were an avalanche of protest to his decision might it be possible to have a reversal. Bragg is elected and, thus, can not be fired.

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And, I wonder who helped get him elected?

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Then Manhattan DA Vance supported Bragg in an election where nomination meant election. Ethics and principles are not hallmarks of New York elections.

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How do we let his office know how we feel?

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Bragg has been beset with an avalanche of protest surrounding many of his decisions. He might be fired when he’s up for re-election.

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If Bragg’s actions might possibly affect his re-election, by then I will be in my 90s. I’m not holding my breathe.

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