Republicans seem to be intent on banishing the separation between church and state, seeking to impose Christianity as the country’s sole religion. This, and In light of their growing censorship of books, ideas and historical records that don’t conform to their “high” moral standards, one can’t help but wonder if their goal is to usher us back into the Dark Ages…
Republicans seem to be intent on banishing the separation between church and state, seeking to impose Christianity as the country’s sole religion. This, and In light of their growing censorship of books, ideas and historical records that don’t conform to their “high” moral standards, one can’t help but wonder if their goal is to usher us back into the Dark Ages…
They are NOT imposing Christianity. They are imposing Fundamentalism, which as as much to do with actual Christianity as it has to do with actual Judaism, Islam or Hinduism. Fundmanetalism is its own religion and it is time to stop calling these Fundamentalist scum "Christians," "Jews," "Muslim" or "Hindu."
I had a friend recently ask me “why Christianity had turned to be a bad word”? I explained that it was not the word but the doers that called themselves by that word. True Christian’s are those that just follow the teachings of Christ. I do not see any such actions by our government,especially Republicans today. I do hope that we are headed for some sort of reckoning. It is so disheartening to watch evil continue to succeed.
Indeed. While I am a practicing Catholic, there are parts of the dogma I don't agree with (why do I continue to attend? Many reasons, too much to explain here) .I have always liked the "WWJD?" that came out of the conservative faction, what a shame that they don't FOLLOW that thought. And come to think of it, I see less and less of WWJD? these days.
Thank you, TCinLA. Fundamentalists in the traditions you name interpret the texts of their traditions in ways that use literalism to understand single words and sentences, argue that the text is inerrant (has no relationship to the culture or audience of its time because humans did not write it), miss the foundational breadth of love that undergirds the ideas being presented, and have no time for ambiguity. They miss the point and endanger everyone because the point of faith is an expansive welcome to others rather than a wall-building project.
You're so right. The quote below, while a Christian reference, applies to all other major religions as well.
"Love and justice go together. Justice without love can be brutal, and love without justice can be banal. Love is the heart of justice, and justice is the social form of love."
Marcus J. Borg and John Dominic Crossan, The First Paul: Reclaiming the Radical Visionary behind the Church’s Conservative Icon (New York: HarperCollins, 2009), 26, 138, 204–205.
Professor Marcus J. Borg served as Canon Theologian at Trinity Episcopal Cathedral in Portland, Oregon for many years.
His Sermons and Bible study classes were, and remain today in my memory, truly inspirationally life transforming!
Professor Borg, mostly with John Dominic Crossan have authored many must read, (in my humble opinion), easy to read scholarly concepts most pertinent to today's life living situations.
Just read on the web [okay, I know] “ The most well‐known fundamentalist denominations in the United States are the Assemblies of God, the Southern Baptist Convention, and the Seventh‐Day Adventists. Organizations such as these often become politically active, and support the conservative political “right,” including groups like the Moral Majority.
Interestingly, the “Moral Majority” now includes Mormons because Jesus coming to America is the epitome of US Fundamentalists’ dream. And for the commonality with the Catholic Church on women’s roles, reproduction, and LGBTQs.
Chris, I disagree that Fundamentalism is not "another religion" but comes from the "core" of religious traditions, and here is why: Think about the "originalism" of some of our Supreme Court justices. It follows the same damaged and damaging rubric about the Constitution as Fundamentalists do about the texts on which they rely. Interpretation of founding documents (Constitution and Declaration of Indepence for the U.S. and the Bible for Jews and Christians) is a complex and ever-evolving enterprise UNLESS you are an "originalist" or a Fundamentalist. Then, you grab onto the understanding of the texts that most fits your political or theocratic goals which, in both cases, aim to rule over others in detrimental ways. Fundamentalism is limited and limiting and doesn't honor the richness of the texts under examination. That is what makes it a different "religion."
Melinda, great insight. What I take away from your comment is that fundamentalism is basically an over-simplification of concepts, and using that over-simplification to control others.
I believe that Melinda Quivik has your answer, just below. She is more eloquent than what my initial response to your question would have been. She says it better.
Ally, were you replying to me or to Chris Buzinski? Melinda wrote a deeply insightful response to Chris's first post. Chris responded with what can only be called a truly bonehead reinterpreation of what Melinda wrote. My brief response was to Chris (brief because I saw no need to point out the apparently deliberate misreading Chris gave to what Melinda wrote. I agree with you that Melinda writes with clarity and eloquence.
As fast as they can, but they have corrupted the teachings of Jesus as only evil can. Why their self-righteous blather is the best evidence that they are Pharisees.
Jeri, it could be argued that the Pharisees were the original fundamentalists of Judaism. Their legalism was what has become an identifier of today's fundamentalist aberration of any given religion. Paul was a Pharisee, licensed to kill under LAW. Fortunately the Pharisees restricted themselves (in the main) to their fellow Jews, both politically and within religious boundaries.
Hey, thanks for all your comments and replies to others tonight! I always slow down and think about what you have to say, and have largely restrained myself from joining all the discussions. A lot of good stuff to read...
The monotheistic God is almost always interpreted as patriarchal. He is the Father and we are the children. You pray to him for personal protection ("I alone can fix it"). You want to please him, "or else". You have a personal relationship with him/his son, making you and what you want quite special and important, and it gives you the right to go and take it. Sound familiar?
The goal of the far right religious leaders, since at least the 1980s, has been to take over the government at all levels, in order to impose their views on the rest of us. I remember very clearly reading, in the late 1980s, about how they were organizing using fax machines, phone trees and mail, before the internet and social media, to get their members to pressure Congress on social issues and anything their leaders decided was “evil” (pretty. Y h anything they didn’t agree with). Anyone remember the uproar over Robert Maplethorpe’s photos? That was all manufactured by those religious leaders ( with help from Jesse Helms and his ilk) and they continue to do the same- they have always been very open about their goals and no one seemed to take them seriously. And now here we are.
Republicans seem to be intent on banishing the separation between church and state, seeking to impose Christianity as the country’s sole religion. This, and In light of their growing censorship of books, ideas and historical records that don’t conform to their “high” moral standards, one can’t help but wonder if their goal is to usher us back into the Dark Ages…
They are NOT imposing Christianity. They are imposing Fundamentalism, which as as much to do with actual Christianity as it has to do with actual Judaism, Islam or Hinduism. Fundmanetalism is its own religion and it is time to stop calling these Fundamentalist scum "Christians," "Jews," "Muslim" or "Hindu."
I had a friend recently ask me “why Christianity had turned to be a bad word”? I explained that it was not the word but the doers that called themselves by that word. True Christian’s are those that just follow the teachings of Christ. I do not see any such actions by our government,especially Republicans today. I do hope that we are headed for some sort of reckoning. It is so disheartening to watch evil continue to succeed.
Indeed. While I am a practicing Catholic, there are parts of the dogma I don't agree with (why do I continue to attend? Many reasons, too much to explain here) .I have always liked the "WWJD?" that came out of the conservative faction, what a shame that they don't FOLLOW that thought. And come to think of it, I see less and less of WWJD? these days.
Thank you, TCinLA. Fundamentalists in the traditions you name interpret the texts of their traditions in ways that use literalism to understand single words and sentences, argue that the text is inerrant (has no relationship to the culture or audience of its time because humans did not write it), miss the foundational breadth of love that undergirds the ideas being presented, and have no time for ambiguity. They miss the point and endanger everyone because the point of faith is an expansive welcome to others rather than a wall-building project.
Melinda. Best post of the day. No doubt.
This is just a super-perfect post. Thanks!
The Holy Bible is GOD talking to each one of us as the individual HE created.
Every time we re-read the same sentence of Scripture it's ever changing dynamics speaks to us about wisdom in the moment, from moment to moment.
So very fascinating!
I agree it is fundamentalism but they are clearly using Christianity to further their cause and attract evangelicals
Christianity has been used to “further causes” practically since The Council of Nicea in 325 AD
Indeed, Lee. That is why Barr mentioned "Christianity" (NOT Fundamentalism).
You're so right. The quote below, while a Christian reference, applies to all other major religions as well.
"Love and justice go together. Justice without love can be brutal, and love without justice can be banal. Love is the heart of justice, and justice is the social form of love."
Marcus J. Borg and John Dominic Crossan, The First Paul: Reclaiming the Radical Visionary behind the Church’s Conservative Icon (New York: HarperCollins, 2009), 26, 138, 204–205.
Professor Marcus J. Borg served as Canon Theologian at Trinity Episcopal Cathedral in Portland, Oregon for many years.
His Sermons and Bible study classes were, and remain today in my memory, truly inspirationally life transforming!
Professor Borg, mostly with John Dominic Crossan have authored many must read, (in my humble opinion), easy to read scholarly concepts most pertinent to today's life living situations.
"I can't believe what you say, because I see what you do." James Baldwin.
Yes. It’s heinous. They use Christianity as bait to further their gain of Fundamentalism.
What they are doing is imposing The Patriarchy. They are Patriarchists.
Just read on the web [okay, I know] “ The most well‐known fundamentalist denominations in the United States are the Assemblies of God, the Southern Baptist Convention, and the Seventh‐Day Adventists. Organizations such as these often become politically active, and support the conservative political “right,” including groups like the Moral Majority.
Interestingly, the “Moral Majority” now includes Mormons because Jesus coming to America is the epitome of US Fundamentalists’ dream. And for the commonality with the Catholic Church on women’s roles, reproduction, and LGBTQs.
Exactly
Precisely & marvelously cogent...Thank you!
Exactly. Thanks TC.
Chris, I disagree that Fundamentalism is not "another religion" but comes from the "core" of religious traditions, and here is why: Think about the "originalism" of some of our Supreme Court justices. It follows the same damaged and damaging rubric about the Constitution as Fundamentalists do about the texts on which they rely. Interpretation of founding documents (Constitution and Declaration of Indepence for the U.S. and the Bible for Jews and Christians) is a complex and ever-evolving enterprise UNLESS you are an "originalist" or a Fundamentalist. Then, you grab onto the understanding of the texts that most fits your political or theocratic goals which, in both cases, aim to rule over others in detrimental ways. Fundamentalism is limited and limiting and doesn't honor the richness of the texts under examination. That is what makes it a different "religion."
Melinda, great insight. What I take away from your comment is that fundamentalism is basically an over-simplification of concepts, and using that over-simplification to control others.
Well said
Seems to me you are seeing a lot of stuff in Melinda's post than is actually in there. Make me wonder why.
I believe that Melinda Quivik has your answer, just below. She is more eloquent than what my initial response to your question would have been. She says it better.
Ally, were you replying to me or to Chris Buzinski? Melinda wrote a deeply insightful response to Chris's first post. Chris responded with what can only be called a truly bonehead reinterpreation of what Melinda wrote. My brief response was to Chris (brief because I saw no need to point out the apparently deliberate misreading Chris gave to what Melinda wrote. I agree with you that Melinda writes with clarity and eloquence.
Chris is who I was responding to.
Thanks for clarifying, Ally. Good response, btw. The way substack arranges responses is confusing!
Indeed it is...
Good point, but the corruption of anything positive (teaching of Jesus) is universal with the Barr’s and Franklin Grahams of our society.
Their goal is to roll back the Enlightenment. Nothing less.
Their goal could also be stated as: the roll back of sharing power.
As fast as they can, but they have corrupted the teachings of Jesus as only evil can. Why their self-righteous blather is the best evidence that they are Pharisees.
Jeri, it could be argued that the Pharisees were the original fundamentalists of Judaism. Their legalism was what has become an identifier of today's fundamentalist aberration of any given religion. Paul was a Pharisee, licensed to kill under LAW. Fortunately the Pharisees restricted themselves (in the main) to their fellow Jews, both politically and within religious boundaries.
Hey, thanks for all your comments and replies to others tonight! I always slow down and think about what you have to say, and have largely restrained myself from joining all the discussions. A lot of good stuff to read...
The monotheistic God is almost always interpreted as patriarchal. He is the Father and we are the children. You pray to him for personal protection ("I alone can fix it"). You want to please him, "or else". You have a personal relationship with him/his son, making you and what you want quite special and important, and it gives you the right to go and take it. Sound familiar?
Blame those who “wrote” the Bible as we know it today. I’m surprised the translators included the statement that God created Man AND Woman.
"You never know when yhe Inquisition will come calling"
The Republicans would call Democrats the Inquisitors, except they don't know or can't spell that big word.
The goal of the far right religious leaders, since at least the 1980s, has been to take over the government at all levels, in order to impose their views on the rest of us. I remember very clearly reading, in the late 1980s, about how they were organizing using fax machines, phone trees and mail, before the internet and social media, to get their members to pressure Congress on social issues and anything their leaders decided was “evil” (pretty. Y h anything they didn’t agree with). Anyone remember the uproar over Robert Maplethorpe’s photos? That was all manufactured by those religious leaders ( with help from Jesse Helms and his ilk) and they continue to do the same- they have always been very open about their goals and no one seemed to take them seriously. And now here we are.
Yes
Of course it is. Back to the 1950’s and “Father Knows Best” and before Civil Rights took center stage.
I meant the 1650s.