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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

Yes. That such a mean-spirited, foul-mouthed bully could have actually won in 2016, for me, suggests a decline in the morals and ethics of too many Americans.

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Mike S's avatar

Gailee, yes, the men and women of my Father and Mother's generation (who would be in the90's now), were mostly absent the cursing and foul talking that exists in the common vernacular today among large swaths of American society.

Amazingly, in the people in their thirties, I sometimes here the (mostly Dad's) saying the F word right in front of their little kids.

I have to walk away. It is so unwise to speak abusively around little kids who are, really, the best of all of us.

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Barbara Mullen's avatar

I am no stranger to the occasional curse word. But the common use of the f word and another word is unbelievable. I sound like a prude here but I am not considered one. Looking objectively I see a massive coarsening of society. Massive nudity, cursing, rage and violence. Some sociologists blame the massive covid deaths and a resultant "give a darn" attitude. That same attitude is also blamed for the serious rise in automobile accidents and deaths in this Country. Throw in the carelessness and coarsening of the so called political "leaders" and we have a pretty bad mix going on right now. I would hate to raising a child right now.

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Michele's avatar

Words should have power and meaning and I have always thought that the overuse of four letter words deprives them of that power to truly express a very bad situation. We just finished Peaky Blinders where everyone uses the f word liberally. Now we are on to Ozark and that is the same. I do love Ruth though. I was at my chiro's recently, who is Swiss, and he wondered what has happened to us. I said that the veneer of civilization has disappeared and we have a large part of the population who have no boundaries and who are also angry. I agree. I would hate to be raising a child right now too.

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Barbara Mullen's avatar

" I said that the veneer of civilization has disappeared ..." Very well said. That is it in a nutshell.

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Michele's avatar

These things start small and then escalate to larger and more dangerous behavior. Every night I hear road racing to the west of us. Earlier someone was racing on a major street to the west of us and hit someone and killed them. Then the driver threw the body in his trunk and drove the car with body to the north of Salem. He did get caught although I can't remember the details. Another person drunk and speeding mowed down some homeless tents and killed four people. In Portland a small group of people cause all kinds of havoc. One group takes over streets and bridges for road racing. The police do make some arrests. In one area business owners are having to hire their own security. One problem is recruiting officers and the other seems to me to be the police pouting because their bad eggs have been criticized and sometimes brought to trial

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Barbara Mullen's avatar

You are speaking of the same exact situation here in Louisville. I dread driving now.

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Susan Lorraine Knox's avatar

It's beginning to sound like organized. crime.

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Barbara Mullen's avatar

A lot of it is gangs.

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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

We were so happy to leave SoCal. Road rage was/is everywhere. I miss so much about my state, but we feel so much safer and happier here in Spain.

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Susan Lorraine Knox's avatar

In 1961 we had a Reading class which used the SRA(?) system. It emphasized improving vocabulary for comprehension. It seems obvious to me that the people who lack vocabulary fall back on expletives, and also the brain uses shortcuts to expletives for effectiveness when under stress

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Michele's avatar

An interesting idea. Both my spouse and I have large vocabularies, but we have an overflowing swear jar. For myself, I see it as a bad habit that started as a rebellion.

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Barbara Mullen's avatar

I vaguely remember this. My Dad was against cursing and name calling. He would say: "There is better use for the King's English." Which is odd since he was from Ireland.

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Susan Lorraine Knox's avatar

God bless the Irish!

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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

This is attributed to Oscar Wilde, JB Shaw, any many others, but when I read it years ago, it was someone from Italy or France. ┬иAmerica Is the Only Country That Went from Barbarism to Decadence Without Civilization In Between┬и .

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Michele's avatar

Hadn't heard this one. Well, America was originally overrun by people who were not, by and large, the best. England viewed America as a giant workhouse where they could send those who the upper classes viewed as the dregs of society. There are exceptions to this of course, but perhaps some of our national characteristics stem from this...I am thinking the anti-intellectualism that runs through our history for example.

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Sandra VO (Maryland)'s avatar

Reminds me of one of the takeaways from the new Hulu movie, Good Luck to you Leo Grande, there would be a lot less BS if people took the movie to heart, my interpretation.

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Nancy (OR->Paris)'s avatar

Pristine acting and a beautiful story. I feel it's just a piece of the puzzle, but yes, if we were all just more loving and accepting. тЭдя╕П

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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

I hope to see it. We don't have Hulu but hopefully can rent via Amazon.

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Michele's avatar

Haven't seen the movie although I know what it is about and read an article about Emma Thompson in the NYT. So I am not sure what you mean....not criticizing, just wondering.

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Sandra VO (Maryland)'s avatar

Thanks Michele. If people had enough pleasure in their lives, there might be less anger, aggression, wars and division in our world.

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Michele's avatar

Yep, and given the movie, this reminds of our close relatives the bonobos....who are a matriarchy btw, and given to pleasure much of the time. Just finished deWaal's book Different about gender. I read of review of it which has some criticisms, but I thought he was pretty careful throughout the book.

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JDinTX's avatar

Propaganda works, who knew?

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daria (MID)'s avatar

One of your best, in a nutshell comments, ever.

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Susan Lorraine Knox's avatar

I'm so amazed when I hear anyone use the word ethics....I guess it's still in the dictionary. Is it taught anywhere in the Ivy League schools?

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Nancy Ziac's avatar

Yes, ethics is taught at Georgetown University.

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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

Law schools. I'm hoping.

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daria (MID)'s avatar

Apparently not given the number of ivy league lawyers infesting politics today...

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Marlene Lerner-Bigley (CA)'s avatar

Just ask the Federalist Society. TheyтАЩll tell you if that is the subject taught.

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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

you are right

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Pensa_VT's avatar

тЭдя╕ПтЭгя╕П

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MaryPat's avatar

ЁЯШТ

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MLRGRMI's avatar

Yes, and also, sadly, it speaks to a certain aspect of AmericaтАЩs character that we have always struggled with. In a way, the Founders all knew тАЬWe the PeopleтАЭ was a con from the get-go. They rationalized it as тАЬthe-best-we-could-doтАЭ, while still owning black and brown humans and ignoring their own white womenтАЩs inalienable rights. But they got to keep their property and the ever slippery, shape-shifting rational for it. tump accentuating and unleashing the тАЬmean-spirited, foul-mouthed bullyтАЭ American Id always below the social surface. The aggrieved тАЬI-want-mine!!!!тАЭ, zero-sum, fear-marinated trump supporter is our embarrassing antecedent of the disingenuous Founders. Talk about тАЬOriginalismтАЭ! The problem is that others actually were inspired and attracted ( and still are!!!) to the lofty words and have worked, suffered, and bled for them . We continue that work. But the mean-spirit, and foul-mouthed bullies are formidably hate-mongered for a political end that will not serve to elevate more that their conceit.

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Ally House (Oregon)'s avatar

It always rolls back to property, and who can "own" what. It is the foundational belief of white Europeans that they can "own" the land, and "own" the "things". It was antithetical to how the Americas Indigenous Peoples viewed the land. It is one part of "how we got here as a country" so quickly. The other, of course, is another type of "ownership"; human enslavement.

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Nancy (OR->Paris)'s avatar

And the disdain we have for those who do not own anything and are living on our streets. (I don't know what my point is - maybe that because we are all in it for ourselves and not caring for each other)?

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MaryPat's avatar

Yes

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MaryPat's avatar

ЁЯШг

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Loree Byers's avatar

They are very much a minority. And rich people remember the French Revolution. That is the purpose of racism; to divide the poor people so the rich don't all lose their heads again.

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George E Dobbs's avatar

Yes!

Way too many.

But, thank GOD, still more good patriotic Americans than evil traitors of American Democracy, Eh!?

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Jun 18, 2022
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Barbara Mullen's avatar

I believe the beliefs of white nationalists are devoid of morals and ethics.

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Susan Lorraine Knox's avatar

тЬиЁЯОЗЁЯМЯЁЯТпЁЯЧ╜ЁЯТлЁЯФе. Zakly !

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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

YES!!! Zakly ЁЯТХЁЯТХЁЯТХЁЯТХЁЯТХ

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Marlene Lerner-Bigley (CA)'s avatar

CanтАЩtтЭдя╕П But yes, I agree with you.

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Hope Lindsay's avatar

All the guys in power who, de facto, are white males in this nation, whether on Wall Street or mean streets, or in conservative church pulpits, or extractive industry CEOs, tech industry, other oligarchs and politicians (here and in Russia,) on and on...all the greedy manipulators whose arrogance knows no boundaries. (Not saying women and minorities would not be the same if in power, but we just don't know.)

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Pensa_VT's avatar

A Great Experiment to imagine...people with ethics, integrity, intelligence, in it for the good of the whole because they know what it feels like to NOT be white male and privileged in America.

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Gailee Walker Wells's avatar

This reply made me think. It is as though at the moment of the abyss, there is one individual (or in the case of our founding fathers, a number of individuals) who keeps us all from either going over the cliff or propels us forward into a higher consciousness. If only, we could grow that number or become one of them.

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Pensa_VT's avatar

тЭдя╕П

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Jun 18, 2022
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Candace (NM)'s avatar

Spooky, this is the second reference to 46. I'm hoping you are actually referring to the former president and not the current one, who is number 46. Did I misunderstand your point?

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Pensa_VT's avatar

I am sure she means 45.

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Miriam M.'s avatar

I thought she meant 16, as in 2016

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Cynthia O'Connor's avatar

I think they are two sides of the same coin...

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