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Are you on Putin’s payroll? Are you projecting your denial?

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Seth, he’s Projecting I suspect. Putin has other worries

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Dave Dalton,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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HA, HA...

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I named him Sméagol and imagined he looks like him too

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Nancy Kish,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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Anti-semite?

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Kool-aid addict?

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@Seth:

Are you capable of actually considering my detailed point of view? My starting point is this 2019 quote from "The Nation":

"Five years ago, Ukraine’s Maidan uprising ousted President Viktor Yanukovych, to the cheers and support of the West. Politicians and analysts in the United States and Europe not only celebrated the uprising as a triumph of democracy, but denied reports of Maidan’s ultranationalism, smearing those who warned about the dark side of the uprising as Moscow puppets and useful idiots. Freedom was on the march in Ukraine.

"Today, increasing reports of far-right violence, ultranationalism, and erosion of basic freedoms are giving the lie to the West’s initial euphoria. There are neo-Nazi pogroms against the Roma, rampant attacks on feminists and LGBT groups, book bans, and state-sponsored glorification of Nazi collaborators.

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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"There are neo-Nazi pogroms against the Roma, rampant attacks on feminists and LGBT groups, book bans, and state-sponsored glorification of Nazi collaborators."

Sounds like Trump at Mara Lago to me John. Or maybe Fox and Friends.

Not Ukraine.

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And DeSantis. Pure, pure neo-fascism.

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Use evil instead of pure, works better.

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But, to say "evil fascism" wouldn't that be redundant?

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Yep, I been learning from the GOP.

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Nothing pure in neofascism, though I get your point.

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I invented a conspiracy theory about DeSantis:

The Establishment has decided to pull the plug on BOTH Trump (off to jail) and Biden (off to a nursing home), and DeSantis is their man. They are going to let the mounting evidence that the covid vaccines cause long-term health conditions hit the fan, and DeSantis will be praised to the Moon as a prophet who had the right idea, never mind his ineptitude on the campaign trail.

But of course, that's just a conspiracy theory.

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Not likely. You're starting to sound like Robt. F. Kennedy, Jr. There is no science that substantiates your claims about the vaccines.

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Richard Sutherland: You write as if your ignorance is evidence of "no science." I addressed this issue several days ago, which I'll repeat for you:

https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/p/july-5-2023/comment/18178988

HCR refers to "the removal of disinformation during the pandemic." Did such "removal" go far beyond disinformation and suppress any public talk that questioned the party line that the new, experimental covid vaccines were "safe and effective"?

Over at Twitter, I have been compiling a thread with links to articles by or about credentialed medical researchers who question or challenge this party line: https://twitter.com/john_schmeeckle/status/1571451172744994817

Links to some of these articles (with titles):

'Unethical’ and up to 98 Times Worse Than the Disease: Top Scientists Publish Paradigm-Shifting Study About COVID-19 Vaccines

https://archive.ph/2022.09.11-161633/https://www.theepochtimes.com/unethical-and-up-to-98-times-worse-than-the-disease-top-scientists-publish-paradigm-shifting-study-about-covid-19-vaccines_4723122.html

And from the Netherlands:

Vaccine Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome (VAIDS): “We should expect this immune erosion to become more widespread”

https://www.frontnieuws.com/vaccin-verworven-immuun-deficientie-syndroom-vaids-we-moeten-verwachten-dat-deze-immuunerosie-zich-op-grotere-schaal-zal-voordoen/

Toxicology expert warns that mRNA COVID jabs could ‘sterilize an entire generation’

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/molecular-biology-expert-warns-mrna-covid-jabs-could-sterilize-an-entire-generation/

Explosive Increase in Cardiac Symptoms after Second Injection

https://petermcculloughmd.substack.com/p/explosive-increase-in-cardiac-symptoms

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Mike S,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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HA, HA...

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You know whereof you speak because it’s you with a personal fount of knowledge? Or you have references that you are using? If the latter, it sure helps us assess the credibility of what you purport. Maybe that doesn’t matter to you.

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Selina Sutherland, my original post included a link with ten further links to sources backing my point of view. Maybe you didn't see that?

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I choose not to respond to this commenter, waste of my brain time.

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Or read anything after his first sentence.

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Actually one only has to see his/her/their name and know to ignore the post.

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Ed, it occurs to me that, paradoxically, you did comment! Silence might be your best course of action.

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yes, I understand that, but I have tangled with him before, and wanted to make an announcement this time. Silence can be construed many ways which might miss my point. Thanks for pointing this out!

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Ed,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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Jim Duffey,

Regarding Ed, I have to agree.

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Yeah, he wrote some word salad to me. Refused to acknowledge. Ignore.

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Is this a parody or perhaps you are angling for a vice-presidential spot on the Conspiracy Party ticket headed by RFK,Jr?

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Guys, this person is a troll. He/She is here often with his/her Mission Impossible conspiracy theories. Try not to engage. He/She/They’re here once/twice a week.

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I agree. I don't mind people I disagree with posting comments, but trolling is an obnoxious act meant to stop meaningful discussion in its tracks. Don't fall for this guy's rubbish. Really, who doesn't know that Ukraine was plagued with corruption before Zelenskyy was elected? And how hard his administration has worked to clean it up?

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I scroll right on by.

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Me too!

I don't have time to read his crap!

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Marycat2021,

You obviously missed the news about how, when Zelensky was caught with his hand in the cookie jar, he publicly stated that he was just like all the other (corrupt) presidents.

See "Just Like All the Others: The End of the Zelensky Alternative?" at https://www.wilsoncenter.org/blog-post/just-all-others-end-zelensky-alternative

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You're showing me a blog post as proof that Zelenskyy is corrupt? Oh gee whiz, I thought he was a comedian.

I don't appreciate the trolling, especially when it wastes my time.

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Marycat2021, here is the heart of that article. Do you challenge any of the cited facts?

"The October 2021 polls delivered a shock to the presidential team. According to the Kyiv International Institute of Sociology, Zelensky’s approval rating as president dropped from 33.3 percent in September to 24.7 percent in October, separated from Poroshenko’s approval rating by fewer than ten percentage points. The Razumkov Center’s poll demonstrates that Volodymyr Zelensky overtook Petro Poroshenko and now has the biggest “anti-rating” among Ukrainian politicians. What has happened to the once beloved leader?

"My answer: at the midpoint of his presidency, Zelensky himself has destroyed his image as an alternative politician. Here is what he did.

"First, Zelensky and his team started promoting the idea that he was “like any other businessperson in Ukraine.” This statement was repeated by everyone on the presidential team in response to the revelations of Zelensky’s offshore holdings, suddenly exposed in the Pandora Papers...."

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Karen Livolsi,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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Jerry Carbone,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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Your starting point for your assessment is over four years old. Produce some current analysis. Putin and his fascist oligarchs with nuclear missiles are the real threat now. Antonio Gramsci, "The old world is dying, and the new world struggles to be born: now is the time of monsters."

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John, let's say that you are right about Ukraine. It then comes down to the lesser of two evils. To permit Putin to gobble up Ukraine by adopting a policy of appeasement would only fuel his appetite for more, as happened in WWII with Germany invading Czechoslovakia. The West has decided that Putin must be stopped now. His atrocities inflicted on innocent Ukrainians is a war crime.

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Richard Sutherland, I respectfully disagree with your assessment. We could go through the history of how Kyiv was the mother of Moscow, how in 1921 Novorossiya ("New Russia") was tacked onto little Ukraine by the new Soviet regime, how Zelensky capitulated to neo-Nazis and un-froze the civil war in the Donbass, how the US and NATO were threatening Russia with the possibility of a reverse Cuban Missile Crisis, how errant Ukrainian anti-missiles come down in random places and the explosions get blamed on Putin, etc.

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John, respectfully, your analysis is off the mark. What matters presently is stopping a megalomaniac from expanding his reign of terror. It's a case of real politik. The Western nations do not want an authoritarian regime taking over countries on their borders. It's a case of self preservation combined with the impulse to stop someone who is commiting war crimes by killing innocent civilians intentionally.

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Richard, you and I clearly are not on the same page in our assessments of Russia's behavior and their motivation for unfreezing the Ukrainian civil war.

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HA, HA...

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Do you believe that the reports of Putin's targeting innocent Ukranian civilians to be false? If not how do you justify the murder of innocent people? Putin has now been identified as a War Criminal and an arrest warrant has been issued.

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I have seen no evidence whatsoever that Putin has been targeting innocent civilians. Zelensky let the cat out of the bag when a UKRAINIAN anti-missile hit Poland and Zelensky lied about it, blaming Russia.

Regarding Putin's indictment for war crimes, the "other side of the story" is the claim that Russia has moved displaced children whose parents are dead or missing out of the war zone. If this is all there is to it, then the ICC appears to have been mobilized as a propaganda weapon against Russia.

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and now they are the target of genocide by a far far worse regime.

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k.paschal,

Are you just saying that, or do you have a developed point of view?

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I'll take the overwhelming evidence as seen and heard from the leader and people of Ukraine fighting for their freedom and the democracies of the world. As others have pointed out, we Americans have our own characters of corruption, fascist ideals, and moral failure. Witness the interrogation of Chris Wray, who took them down with dignity and reason. Hoping for a new morning in America. Hope, "a thing with feathers" as Emily Dickinson wrote, with the power to fly high and wide.

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Lasley Gober,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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Quoting The Nation? The Nation is pro Russia. Putin is not an "autocrat". Sure.

Here's what Stephen Cohen wrote in The Nation in 2014:

In an article for The Nation, published in the March 3, 2014 issue, Cohen wrote that "media malpractice" had resulted in the "relentless demonization of Putin" who was not an "autocrat". He wrote that the American media's coverage of Russia was "less objective, less balanced, more conformist and scarcely less ideological" than it had been during the Cold War.[15] I

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_F._Cohen

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Kathleen,

The starting point for my assessment is this quote from "The Nation":

"These stories of Ukraine’s dark nationalism aren’t coming out of Moscow; they’re being filed by Western media, including US-funded Radio Free Europe (RFE); Jewish organizations such as the World Jewish Congress and the Simon Wiesenthal Center; and watchdogs like Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Freedom House, which issued a joint report warning that Kiev is losing the monopoly on the use of force in the country as far-right gangs operate with impunity."

https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/neo-nazis-far-right-ukraine/#aoh=16892411860434&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thenation.com%2Farticle%2Fpolitics%2Fneo-nazis-far-right-ukraine%2F

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