My step daughter is a property tax attorney. She said it would be a hard sell. I can't see why. Flying meatballs wrapped in spaghetti are just as valid as any other origin story...right?
тАЬWe are offering an alternative,тАЭ Everett said. тАЬAnd ultimately, we believe in the separation of church and state, but we also believe in religious pluralism and religious freedom.тАЭ
The origin of the Pastafarian Religion was an effort to protest teaching "Creationism" as a legitimate alternative to Evolution in Kansas schools. If you can teach bible myths, why not a ball of pasta creating the Universe?
And after that it became an internet phenomenon. So if Satanists are interested in a separation of church and state and don't stab anyone with a pitchfork...cool!
Here's a bit of meat on Satanic Temple. Seems it might be a blend of Ayn Rand inspiration and a secular stand on the culture war against Creationism. Tax exempt status. Confess to not quite my " cup of coffee" which i'm having right now. As for FSM, that's a satirical spoof I believe.
If you're looking for some universal truth seeking community/institution thing, I'd say you're best bet is modern science. Never had a physics "mormon" show up at the door! Religions and spiritual movements seek to serve truth with a heavy emotional component, "facts" take a backseat to religious truth claims. Pick your poison, Bill :) the "4000" speak to religion's ancient origins and human personal and social competitiveness i would hazard. How many flavours already are there of Baptists, Pentecostals etc. I can see why the RCC with its history an universalist claims so adamantly refused to accept its breakup in mainly northern Europe, back when, with all the attendent "wars of religion" which ensured. Lotta history there eh!
You are so right Frank Loomer. They knock on the door when you are going through a difficult life event. JWs are good for that. Fortunately when they knocked on my door...I already knew how they spread their message!
My i havent had a JW visit since about a year ago post-covid I politely informed the two missionaries of my views in general. I was once curious about how JW got their famous 1914? "2nd coming" event calculated, and got a series of entertaining misinformation sessions which i eventually let go, it's amazing how much numerical detail and calculation can be had from a piece of scripture (Daniel i believe) which had a contemporary context. Ditto for modern, otherwise very intelligent, wits who go on about End Times, ad infinitum. There was a reason my Golden Books of Science severed me from my Baptist roots. In those days i could never understand how "all the others" didn't get the John the Baptist truths preached at us fine young bigots. Of course, my mother did a LOT to disavow me of picking up all those Catholics going "to hell", likewise a friendship with a young RCC who was taught pretty much the same thing from an RCC point of view. This was the 50s mind you. Maybe 40 years ago i had a pair of fine tall mormon boys in for soup, picked up a bit of their local worlds in the process. Utah from? maybe
Frank Loomer, my grandmother became a JW after her mother purchased "the books" for her son Curtis. I remember hearing from a great aunt that her mother had said that was the worst mistake she ever made. Eventually my grandmother married off my aunt that was only 2 years older than me to another JW family when she was only 16 years old. My aunt ended up having a split personality. She was one way when she was alone (rarely) with me and another with other JW around. She died of dementia a few years ago. I blame them. My mother was baptized in the JWs after finally divorcing my father for having yet another affair after they were married for nearly 50 years. As soon as the divorce for final the JWs would not let her out of their sight. I know that because she lived with me at the time. She had dementia when she died and didn't remember being a JW. She had another sister that was also a JW and she died with dementia and she didn't remember being a JW. I had another aunt that died that got really involved with the JWs (when she called me on the phone, I would usually have to hang up on her because of her preaching to me) but she would not let her daughters see me. She was always a little off the wall and had basically grown up with her mother being a JW. They can really mess up a family. I believe in being a good person and I think the 10 Commandments are great rules to follow. I didn't know I was a sinner until I was in a Sunday School class when I was about 12 years old. I was ask if I was a sinner and I said no. I found out that day that I was a sinner the day I was born...... that was a shocked and embarrassed. I could go on and on...I belong to the Presbyterian Church but I watch The Sunday Morning Show on Sunday mornings. I get a whole lot more watching that show than showing up and watching who is in church on Sunday morning and who isn't. Have a great day. Hugs
I dont want to sound I'm making light of any of this, when i say i greatly enjoyed reading this so very human interest story. JW has a considerable turnover with something of an unstable membership. Its beliefs are fanatically millenial with only a small portion of humanity being "saved". I get the sinner thing: as a juvenile, i could never shake the feeling i might not be saved, but it was part of the indoctrination. You just "didn't know". Even after you leave that true belief environment, some if not a lot of that emotional underlay remains onboard, colouring our inner attitudes about who we feel we are, and others as well. Thank you for sharing your story!
Thank you, Frank. The funny thing is that today I am 80 1/2 years old and I can still remember that morning. Another memory is being on the school bus and the naughty boys on the bus ask me if I was a virgin. I thought about it and I knew Mary had baby Jesus and they said she was a virgin. I didn't know how to answer that one either. You might say I was a bit sheltered. I was an only child...if that could be an excuse. LOL
lol you've got "two and half years" on me. That puts you in the Area 51 Roswell Incident Era, I came in the wake of Hiroshima / Nagasaki. I can still remember Art Belyea i think it was, or Otty Sherwood maybe, looking out the Sunday class window and dramatically pointing to the Cathedral across the valley and declaring those Catholics were all going to Hell. Mom reassured me "not likely".... she never baptised into the denomination, self declared "adherent". Sigh, "those days of religion"! Fun chatting with you. When someone crudely explained sex to me, i was repelled, in disbelief. God!
Frank Loomer, LOL I guess I don't feel so bad now just to know that I wasn't the only one. Frank, I just checked and you are an accountant. I worked 26 1/2 years as an auditor for the Indiana Department of Revenue. It was interesting work to say the least! I worked until I was 70 and wish I was still at it!
I was a community college accountant for 23 years before retiring at 63 or so. Glad it's no more, though i did enjoy the work for quite a long time, and i just plain didn't enjoy auditing myself, so there! And darn didn't i have a repetitive dream last night of having to work out some sort of accounting thing. Never got done! No sooner had I learned about how sex felt when i overheard my mother saying it would be time for me to learn the "facts of life" when i was 16. Was only 13. So confusing, thank you Ann Landers. Finishing up the day with a late Chili supper, my very first effort, and taking in Denzel Washington Equalizer 3. Gratuitous gore and righteous justice i mean revenge :)
My daughter has discovered a great Jamaican restaurant in St George Utah which was started by a couple guys who did their mission in Jamaica. This is proof that it's not an entire waste of time!
I met an apparition of the Blessed Virgin Mary at a Trappist monastery in Oregon. She said that the love of God should be in our hearts when we prepare food. I don't take that, by itself, to be evidence of the existence of God, and I don't expect others to believe me.
maybe i've been given no reason to trust your assessment of it as "reductionist", and have only ever seen that qualifier leveled by folks who prefer special pleading to appeal to unfalsifiable notions.
4000 religions on the Planet. I am trying to decide...leaning to the FSM. Nobody has died in its name. That's a feature.
/s
Googled FSM. Flying Spaghetti Monster
Love it.
He boiled for our sins. And then left us alone. Perfect.
Me too
Frankom....I was wondering who FSM was. LOL
All hal, the FSM. We are touched by his noddly appendage!!!
My property taxes have been getting a little high the past couple of years. Do you think I can get an exemption if I call my house an FSM temple?
I mean if my neighborhood Catholica and Baptist churches don't have to pay taxes, why should we?
Agreed. However.
My step daughter is a property tax attorney. She said it would be a hard sell. I can't see why. Flying meatballs wrapped in spaghetti are just as valid as any other origin story...right?
I love the new religions!https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2024-01-24/after-school-satan-club-is-coming-to-orange-county-its-not-what-you-think-organizers-say
Thanks for the link :)
From the article.
тАЬWe are offering an alternative,тАЭ Everett said. тАЬAnd ultimately, we believe in the separation of church and state, but we also believe in religious pluralism and religious freedom.тАЭ
The origin of the Pastafarian Religion was an effort to protest teaching "Creationism" as a legitimate alternative to Evolution in Kansas schools. If you can teach bible myths, why not a ball of pasta creating the Universe?
And after that it became an internet phenomenon. So if Satanists are interested in a separation of church and state and don't stab anyone with a pitchfork...cool!
Yeah! the LA Times didn't block me because I didn't join...
"The Satanic Temple was granted tax-exempt status by the IRS in 2019."........??!
This article explains the details: https://abovethelaw.com/2019/05/irs-grants-tax-exempt-status-to-satanic-temple/
Here's a bit of meat on Satanic Temple. Seems it might be a blend of Ayn Rand inspiration and a secular stand on the culture war against Creationism. Tax exempt status. Confess to not quite my " cup of coffee" which i'm having right now. As for FSM, that's a satirical spoof I believe.
https://thesatanictemple.com/pages/church-of-satan-vs-satanic-temple
If you have enough land you can claim farms and cemeteries
I wish I could share the photo of my friend's driver's license where he has a colander on his head! A true Pastafarian.
https://www.instagram.com/p/C2sVShuAMXc/
Awesome! He has truly been touched by it's Noodly Appendage!
Carbo Diem :)
my splinter sect goes with "carbonara diem"
If you're looking for some universal truth seeking community/institution thing, I'd say you're best bet is modern science. Never had a physics "mormon" show up at the door! Religions and spiritual movements seek to serve truth with a heavy emotional component, "facts" take a backseat to religious truth claims. Pick your poison, Bill :) the "4000" speak to religion's ancient origins and human personal and social competitiveness i would hazard. How many flavours already are there of Baptists, Pentecostals etc. I can see why the RCC with its history an universalist claims so adamantly refused to accept its breakup in mainly northern Europe, back when, with all the attendent "wars of religion" which ensured. Lotta history there eh!
You are so right Frank Loomer. They knock on the door when you are going through a difficult life event. JWs are good for that. Fortunately when they knocked on my door...I already knew how they spread their message!
My i havent had a JW visit since about a year ago post-covid I politely informed the two missionaries of my views in general. I was once curious about how JW got their famous 1914? "2nd coming" event calculated, and got a series of entertaining misinformation sessions which i eventually let go, it's amazing how much numerical detail and calculation can be had from a piece of scripture (Daniel i believe) which had a contemporary context. Ditto for modern, otherwise very intelligent, wits who go on about End Times, ad infinitum. There was a reason my Golden Books of Science severed me from my Baptist roots. In those days i could never understand how "all the others" didn't get the John the Baptist truths preached at us fine young bigots. Of course, my mother did a LOT to disavow me of picking up all those Catholics going "to hell", likewise a friendship with a young RCC who was taught pretty much the same thing from an RCC point of view. This was the 50s mind you. Maybe 40 years ago i had a pair of fine tall mormon boys in for soup, picked up a bit of their local worlds in the process. Utah from? maybe
Frank Loomer, my grandmother became a JW after her mother purchased "the books" for her son Curtis. I remember hearing from a great aunt that her mother had said that was the worst mistake she ever made. Eventually my grandmother married off my aunt that was only 2 years older than me to another JW family when she was only 16 years old. My aunt ended up having a split personality. She was one way when she was alone (rarely) with me and another with other JW around. She died of dementia a few years ago. I blame them. My mother was baptized in the JWs after finally divorcing my father for having yet another affair after they were married for nearly 50 years. As soon as the divorce for final the JWs would not let her out of their sight. I know that because she lived with me at the time. She had dementia when she died and didn't remember being a JW. She had another sister that was also a JW and she died with dementia and she didn't remember being a JW. I had another aunt that died that got really involved with the JWs (when she called me on the phone, I would usually have to hang up on her because of her preaching to me) but she would not let her daughters see me. She was always a little off the wall and had basically grown up with her mother being a JW. They can really mess up a family. I believe in being a good person and I think the 10 Commandments are great rules to follow. I didn't know I was a sinner until I was in a Sunday School class when I was about 12 years old. I was ask if I was a sinner and I said no. I found out that day that I was a sinner the day I was born...... that was a shocked and embarrassed. I could go on and on...I belong to the Presbyterian Church but I watch The Sunday Morning Show on Sunday mornings. I get a whole lot more watching that show than showing up and watching who is in church on Sunday morning and who isn't. Have a great day. Hugs
I dont want to sound I'm making light of any of this, when i say i greatly enjoyed reading this so very human interest story. JW has a considerable turnover with something of an unstable membership. Its beliefs are fanatically millenial with only a small portion of humanity being "saved". I get the sinner thing: as a juvenile, i could never shake the feeling i might not be saved, but it was part of the indoctrination. You just "didn't know". Even after you leave that true belief environment, some if not a lot of that emotional underlay remains onboard, colouring our inner attitudes about who we feel we are, and others as well. Thank you for sharing your story!
Thank you, Frank. The funny thing is that today I am 80 1/2 years old and I can still remember that morning. Another memory is being on the school bus and the naughty boys on the bus ask me if I was a virgin. I thought about it and I knew Mary had baby Jesus and they said she was a virgin. I didn't know how to answer that one either. You might say I was a bit sheltered. I was an only child...if that could be an excuse. LOL
lol you've got "two and half years" on me. That puts you in the Area 51 Roswell Incident Era, I came in the wake of Hiroshima / Nagasaki. I can still remember Art Belyea i think it was, or Otty Sherwood maybe, looking out the Sunday class window and dramatically pointing to the Cathedral across the valley and declaring those Catholics were all going to Hell. Mom reassured me "not likely".... she never baptised into the denomination, self declared "adherent". Sigh, "those days of religion"! Fun chatting with you. When someone crudely explained sex to me, i was repelled, in disbelief. God!
Frank Loomer, LOL I guess I don't feel so bad now just to know that I wasn't the only one. Frank, I just checked and you are an accountant. I worked 26 1/2 years as an auditor for the Indiana Department of Revenue. It was interesting work to say the least! I worked until I was 70 and wish I was still at it!
I was a community college accountant for 23 years before retiring at 63 or so. Glad it's no more, though i did enjoy the work for quite a long time, and i just plain didn't enjoy auditing myself, so there! And darn didn't i have a repetitive dream last night of having to work out some sort of accounting thing. Never got done! No sooner had I learned about how sex felt when i overheard my mother saying it would be time for me to learn the "facts of life" when i was 16. Was only 13. So confusing, thank you Ann Landers. Finishing up the day with a late Chili supper, my very first effort, and taking in Denzel Washington Equalizer 3. Gratuitous gore and righteous justice i mean revenge :)
My daughter has discovered a great Jamaican restaurant in St George Utah which was started by a couple guys who did their mission in Jamaica. This is proof that it's not an entire waste of time!
LOL for sure!
I met an apparition of the Blessed Virgin Mary at a Trappist monastery in Oregon. She said that the love of God should be in our hearts when we prepare food. I don't take that, by itself, to be evidence of the existence of God, and I don't expect others to believe me.
"Modern science" peddles the absurd "reductionist materialist" solution to the old mind-body problem.
you forgot to put scare quotes around "absurd" as well, since you appear to be smuggling in dubious assumptions throughout your loaded sentence.
babaganusz,
You clearly don't see reductionist materialism as absurd.
that's clear to you? neat mind-reading trick.
maybe i've been given no reason to trust your assessment of it as "reductionist", and have only ever seen that qualifier leveled by folks who prefer special pleading to appeal to unfalsifiable notions.
It was implicit in what you wrote. "Reductionist" here means the view that everything reduces to material phenomena that can be measured.