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Annabel Ascher's avatar

Well, there goes separation of church and state.

Also, Columbus was a genocidal, sadistic, and a pedophile rapist.

Happy INDIGENOUS PEOPLE’S DAY everyone!

Alexandra Sokoloff's avatar

Happy INDIGENOUS PEOPLE'S DAY.

This is complete Project 2025 stuff: "The proclamation goes on to present a white Christian nationalist version of American history, with much more emphasis on Christianity than rump’s previous, similar proclamations." Miller is handling the militarization, Vought is trying to force Christofascism into every aspect of government.

It's Come To This's avatar

It's all like trying to force toothpaste back into a mythical tube. Trump's "proclamation" reads like a 3-year-old version of an 11-year-old's comic book. It's just too stupid for words.

I realize I'm not saying anything new or revelatory here. I keep wondering when the dam of idiocy they keep trying to build will finally fall apart. It isn't strength or honor or respect they transmit -- but weakness, idiocy and desperation. I suspect the number of those who get that are growing faster than most of us can imagine.

Happy Indigenous People's Day and onto No Kings Day...

GJ Loft ME CA FL IL NE CT MI's avatar

Unfortunately, Trump's knowledge on any subject could fit in a thimble. And hanging around with the WCN Vought and the Fascist Sadist Miller will never result in anything good.

Bill Alstrom (MA/Maine/MA)'s avatar

Vought and Miller are essentially running the nation. They act with the authority bestowed upon them by the Demented Orange One. They are the Himmler and Goring. Vought bullies and neuters Congress. Miller instructs Kegsbreath.

The DOO likes blonds so he orders Bondi around like a personal assistant.

Normally, the president's "Chief of Staff" wields enormous power and influence. Like the COO to a CEO.

My questions for the day:

What does COS Susie Wiles do all day? Bring the DOO Diet Cokes?

Who actually writes the nutty stuff like that statement about Columbus? Smells like Paula White.

Dale Rowett AR OK VA PA NY's avatar

Paula White-Cain isn't really involved. She's busy at home in Apopka, FL, fleecing her television audience with high-priced, cheap tchotchkes.

Don't underestimate Vought. He is the author of all the christofascist content. He's a graduate of Wheaton College, a longtime educational bastion of evangelical dogma. Wheaton is where one goes to learn the most sophisticated methods of biblical cherrypicking.

My guess is Susie Wiles is the regime's headmistress, settling squabbles among the staff, but chiefly protecting Donald from too much exposure as he sinks into dementia.

Ryan Collay's avatar

How do we call them out for the ridicule they so richly deserve! This backstage story needs serious attention and daylight…soon! The emperor has no clothes!

Jocelyn B's avatar

Who here is underestimating Vought?

Alexandra Sokoloff's avatar

Bill, yes - Vought and Miller are essentially running the nation. It's crucial that we amplify that fact and the depravity and soullessness of these guys.

Miselle's avatar

As incredible as it sounds to us, I believe many people are clueless as to who Miller and Vought are! I have had to educate some friends and family over the past summer, as the names meant nothing to them.

L B Rose's avatar

Absolutely. We can watch this all unfolding on MTV -- Miller, Trp, Vought. The new Three Stooges with a Nazi twist.

Liz V's avatar

Actually, Vought and Miller are acting on the authority bestowed upon them by the Republicans in Congress (Trump is merely an old, tired clown)

Ryan Collay's avatar

Loud and often, from the highest of highest! There is no there there! No longer just Putin’s Puppet!

The ‘Rectal Polyp’ is running the show! Slathering and sniveling as he goes…

Linda Slater's avatar

I suspect history will record this horrible era as the Trump/Vought/Miller reign of terror.

Terry's avatar

definitely not the felon child rapist writing that

Jon Rosen's avatar

I actually think Vought and Miller are more like Goebbels and Bormann than Himmler and Goering. The latter two were military/police men. Himmler was in charge of the SS and Goering was in charge of the Luftwaffe.

On the other hand, Goebbels was "Minister of Public Enlightenment" (i.e., propganda) and Bormann was head of the Party Chancery, which were both non-military positions of political power. Neither Vought nor Miller appear to be "military" in any sense, but both wield a HUGE amount of power in the Trump administration just as Goebbels and Bormann did during the reign of Nazi Germany.

Kelly Peacock Wright's avatar

YES! I use that analogy all the time. It’s perfect.

Kelly Peacock Wright's avatar

I was just wondering about Susie Wiles yesterday. Does she do anthing at all? Expensive.

Jon Rosen's avatar

If ANYONE is pulling Trump's strings, it is Susie Wiles.

Michele's avatar

Bill, we know it certainly was not death star. Could be any of the monsters who are actually running things.

Ellie still in the mix in 26's avatar

He also believes every lie they tell him, because he is so easily manipulated.

Susan Stone's avatar

I think we need to fit tiny thimbles into our repertoire along with tiny violins. His knowledge would not even begin to fill up a normal-size thimble. IMO.

Susan Troy's avatar

I sincerely hope the dam of public opinion breaks soon. Project 2025 is an insult to American democracy and to the Christian faith as most people understand it. Putin uses the Orthodox Church in Russia in much the same way. These are desperate and fanatical people. Not good.

Miselle's avatar

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8VFcBmE53A

Everyone who considers themselves "Christian" or actually just anyone should watch this excellent 19 minutes of HCR with Tallerico.

Susan Troy's avatar

I just watched this and liked it very much. Thank you for sharing the link.

Liz V's avatar

The Russian Orthodox church under Patriarch Kirill has used Putin as much as he has used it. It is the unholy alliance between church and state.

Martha Joan's avatar

Perhaps HCR can give us a lesson on the Pope and Mussolini. Another unholy collaboration.

Jon Rosen's avatar

There is no "dam of public opinion". Trump has a good solid hold on about 40% of the voting public and that isn't going to change much, unless there is a HUGE backlash not just from Democrats but from line Republicans in Congress. So far, such a backlash has shown ZERO chance of materializing, as the GOP sycophants in Congress continue to just follow along. Every once in a while, one will go out "on a limb" for a moment, but the others hold the Trump line and soon the stray is back in the fold (look at Susan Collins for a classic example of her wobbling).

The democrats probably have a hold on maybe 45% of the voting population which is more than the GOP but not enough to overturn the Presidency of a validly elected President (and yes, I said VALID, please don't harangue me with more nonsense about a stolen election, while there might be some small threads of truth there in isolated precincts, there is virtually ZERO chance that the entire national election was "stolen" by anyone except the disaffected voters who either voted for Trump because they hated Biden AND Harris and loved Trump or the disaffected voters who stayed home because they hated Biden and Harris too. There is virtually no chance that the election was actually "stolen", yet NO ONE in the ensuing 12 months who was actually involved has spoken out about such a huge "conspiracy").

So I wouldn't hold my breath on any breaking of a dam. I doubt such a thing will happen unless something REALLY "earthshaking" happens (like the start of a nuclear war). Our American system doesn't provide for any realistic options other than peaceful protest and impeachment. Anything else could land people in jail and right now for liberals, that's a BAD place to be.

Cynthia Walat's avatar

I like that trying to force toothpaste back into the tube 😒 so true. And Saturday is looking to be partly sunny here in Boston. Onward!!!!!

Gary Pudup's avatar

It's the movie Idiocracy come to fruition.

Jon Rosen's avatar

Yeah, except that movie was supposed to be a satire.

This government is NO satire.

Pat Dinsmoor's avatar

Yes!!! Thank you for putting it so succinctly. I'm feeling more hope every day and this 80-year-old will attend rallies on October 18, and any other time I am able.

Susan Troy's avatar

Me too. I have had it with the idiot goon squad and Putin praises. In my day, the leftist extremists worshiped Chairman Mao. I distinctly remember standing up in a political theory class and saying, “I don’t believe power comes from the barrel of a gun” then sitting down abruptly. Silence followed…

Cindy Gailey's avatar

Wish I'd been in class with you! Quite a statement Susan.

Ryan Collay's avatar

And I will bet dollars to donuts that his pudgy little hands didn’t create, nor type, any of this! This has a ‘Whittle Stevie’ smell, fire and brimstone, hell on Earth.

George Baum's avatar

Its Come To This. Thank you.

Jean(Muriel)'s avatar

And you have stated it even better! Thank you . “The dam of idiocy” has many creative meanings.

Kimberley M Mueller's avatar

Thanks for the nuanced view.

Cindy Gailey's avatar

ICTT, I keep swearing at the words used by the 'All white Club' & asking the air in the room when? When will the damn dam break? Heather wrote a good explanation of what historians do. You all don't get your own version of history while discounting the rest! Weak, idiotic, mean. That poor Capitol bldg. needs fumigation to get rid of the vermin. Oh wait, the republicans aren't there yet!

J L Graham's avatar

The weird part is that it isn't even Christianity, except in name only. Just like it's not even Republican, were the originators of the party consulted.

Alexandra Sokoloff's avatar

Yeah, it's a total perversion of both.

Craig Gjerde's avatar

Evangelicals are corrupting the word Christian; they wear the name to get votes, but they don’t do the good acts taught by Jesus.

Alexandra Sokoloff's avatar

Craig, I agree - they seem to search the Bible for quotes that are directly in opposition to what the Bible says Jesus taught.

KMD's avatar

That's because they only read passages from the Old Testament, with all its smiting of enemies.

Never do we hear them quoting Matthew 25, where Jesus says"Feed the hungry, shelter the homeless, care for the afflicted, and Welcome the Stranger!"

Gary Pudup's avatar

And no one knows what Jesus taught. We only know what editors, commentators and perhaps screenwriters have told us Jesus taught.

For all we know Jesus didn't say or do any of the things in the New Testament.

It could all be fiction.

MLMinET's avatar

John Fugelsang’s new book, “Separation of Church and Hate,” addresses this head on.

Dale Rowett AR OK VA PA NY's avatar

Alexandra, I've written at length about evangelicalism, here, but here are some insights, gleaned from my having been born into the culture and escaped with my life and sanity.

Before anything else, we have to acknowledge that "The Bible" as we know it is a fabrication on many levels. The Old Testament was originally known as The Hebrew Scriptures, based on a collection of myths and legends originally handed down orally from one Israeli generation to the next. With emerging literacy, these stories were transcribed on scrolls. These stories, meant to provide Jews with a cultural heritage, were fiction that often referenced actual historical figures. Also included were poetry and proverbs.

Similarly, The New Testament is a collection of 5 apostolic journals, but mostly "letters" from one disciple to another or a group. Most of the letters attributed to Saul/Paul were actually not written by him. Revelation was tacked on because it doesn't fit anywhere else. It was included because certain "theologians" endowed it with a false prophetic quality. It was actually a coded critique of the Roman occupation in the Middle East.

It is crucial to understand that the modern Bible is not based on any original manuscripts. Even those claimed to be "original" are copied translations which were edited, abridged and appended. Even the venerable King James Version has been doctored. In recent years, a scholar at Oxford University discovered a whole section of the biblical canon that had been omitted from the Bible on orders from King James, who didn't like that content.

Evangelicals gravitate to the Old Testament because they indulge in a collective persecution complex; they like the idea of a jealous, vindictive deity who will smite their enemies and vindicate them. But all those Hebrew rules are problematic, so they ignore those that are inconvenient, but choose others as bludgeons to judge and browbeat people they dislike. These rule lists vary by sect.

Evangelicals believe in the Trinity. God the Father is like the Wizard of Oz or a religious ATM. One prays to God when one wants something, either a gift or an action. Jesus the Son is like a good luck charm. Jesus said you have to pray in his name to make God do what you want. Great emphasis is placed on The Holy Spirit, the invisible something that makes people good. Charismatic evangelicals believe the Holy Spirit makes extra-special believers jabber in gibberish or convulse on the floor, known as "speaking in tongues" or "being slain in the spirit."

Evangelicals devote most of their attention to "the epistles" because they are primarily opinions that generally mind other people's business, which is appealing to people who feel put upon and want to lash out.

J L Graham's avatar

And the Bible is an anthology. No?

Ryan Collay's avatar

Harvard seems to have invented a new way to ‘study’ the Bible, not Hermeneutics, weird textualism—and this form of knowing is also the answer to so-called ‘originalism’, by the way.)

Al Keim's avatar

See "Separation of Church and Hate' Fugelsang

Ryan Collay's avatar

You know what’s really funny, up until very recently so-called Evangelicals believed they were required by the teaching to stay out of politics! He does say this…Billy Graham and Richard Nixon broke this dam, Damn! Reagan perfected it and the neo-nationalist powers took charge…zealots.

Kimberley M Mueller's avatar

It isn’t even true to their evangelical roots!

Cindy Gailey's avatar

Hell anyone? Misery while still on earth? Justice for the people with forked tongues.

Susan Troy's avatar

That would take hard work and self sacrifice. Not going to happen with followers of the prosperity gospel as preached by Billy Graham & Son and the Billionaires.

Bill Alstrom (MA/Maine/MA)'s avatar

J L - Brilliant. Ask the originators!

Are there any playwrights here?

Concept:

Jesus is walking down a dusty road, bumps into Abe Lincoln. Instantly, they take a liking to each other.

As they walk along, they encounter hungry people. They feed them.

An exhausted guy sitting on the side of the road. They cut his chains.

They come upon a family - their home just burned down. They grab an axe, a hammer and start to rebuild.

They don't ask what race or religion or nationality these people are. They just help.

Pat Cole's avatar

Was that Jesus or Jimmy?

Susan Troy's avatar

Faithful America has some tee shirts for No Kings. One features Jesus on a donkey, with the caption, “He didn’t need tanks.”

Cindy Gailey's avatar

Oh, I want one! Great shirt.

Bill Alstrom (MA/Maine/MA)'s avatar

This agnostic really likes this guy. Believe what one wants.

But keep it out of government policy. This young guy may be just the leader we need to bring the "faithful" on board.

Wandyrer's avatar

I mean if you look at the actual HISTORY of Christianity rather than what it tells itself about its actions, there is very little that better represents Christianity than Colonialism, the native American genocide, and the African slave trade.

Very few Christians want to talk about what their religion actually does, they just want to talk about how they perceive their religion, and as Heather already pointed out, societies which are built in fiction generally struggle to survive.

Christianity provides a fine counterpoint to her assertion though.

Terry's avatar

It's like growing up in an abusive family - those who can see it are marginalized and shunned, so better to play along with the fallacy, with the narrative of how wonderful it all is...the catholic church is the epitome of abusive behavior towards women and children and non believers - or as I call them those who see the truth...how many wars over christianity, how much raping, pillaging and slaughter of native peoples, wild animals and the environment has happened because of the lie that "man" read white men, are above everything...this civilization is falling fast because the foundation is a lie. This country was founded on genocide and slavery...and misogyny and rape of children!

Susan Troy's avatar

I don’t quite follow the rape of children. But if these creeps are hiding the Epstein Files because they believe child rape is okay and their god given right, that would make sense. Gag me with a spoon.

Pat Cole's avatar

When the SAINTS AND THE LIONS went head to head in the colosseum in the Super Bowl that year martyrdom was established by the extinction of true Christian worship. The saints were not up to their billing as their quarterback was a no show. You can find the highlights buried in the archives of Fox Snooze.

Kimberley M Mueller's avatar

Finally, much to MAGA Catholics’ dismay the American Catholic Church is stepping away from this nonsense and stepping back into the pro immigrant role it has traditionally held. Unfortunately for them, the RCC is hierarchical and opinions on principles aren’t solicited, so they can be mad all they want

Mar O’Malley's avatar

Yes the new document about getting back to the poor is important but so many other things that still need to be addressed. And it seems there is Leonard Leo and Timothy Bush and Thomas Monaghan among others that put all on the money into this Catholic prosperity gospel including Peter Theil who is scary ( check his latest speech) and he mentored JD Vance.

Kimberley M Mueller's avatar

It’s a weird conglomeration of men- Peter Thiel is a libertarian, non American, gay man married to a man, who isn’t Catholic. “Libertarian” is the only one of those categories I find objectionable, but it’s odd to me that he is influencing the faith of so many rich, high profile Catholics.

Mar O’Malley's avatar

Well the new pope is beginning to stir. So we will see. The Vatican Bank and intrigue and huge monies pushing certain agendas has I think been difficult to overcome.

Mar O’Malley's avatar

I think he is late to the game in influence in RC orthodox circles. Thomas Monaghan of Dominio’s Pizza, Leonard Leo with his Red Masses and Federalist Society, ETWN, many others over along period of time. The Knights of Malta and some of the old Vatican order seats also have played a role.

Ryan Collay's avatar

As one of these strange folks noted, we can’t call them out because when they say they are followers of Jesus, that’s enough…no questions, no consistency, no other actions needed, so no duplicity…just more lies.

WWJD? Really!

Bob Tinsman's avatar

It's Christian nationalism or Christofascism, take your pick.

Janet Gillis's avatar

Absolutely my first thought — Vought and Project 2025 hands are all over this Proclamation. Besides, trump doesn’t have the intellectual capacity to create such a document. Happy Indigenous Peoples’ Day!

Pat Cole's avatar

Don’t worry Janet it’s only Columbus Day down in the Golf of America.

TCinLA's avatar

These people need to be taken out and hanged in 2029. Every last one of them. And then tax the damn megachurches.

Alexandra Sokoloff's avatar

TC, I'd go even further on your second point. The megachurches need way more than taxation to curb them. They're probably more responsible for this dismantling of democracy and imposition of a fascist regime than any other factor in the mess.

JDinTX's avatar

Except maybe Rupert and Fox

Alexandra Sokoloff's avatar

Yes! But that's so overt, and the billions that megachurches and my god, the Mormon church alone, have pumped into this church over state conspiracy is less known and completely mind-blowing.

Cindy Gailey's avatar

Hell isn't full yet Alexandra.

JDinTX's avatar

So true, my one interaction with Morman Church was mind blowing. A cult indeed.

Gordon Berry's avatar

Tax all churches! Synagogues and chapels, etc.

Their flocks should be the ones funding them.

T L Mills's avatar

A long term sentence in a cold dirty prison would be about right.

Bill Alstrom (MA/Maine/MA)'s avatar

Trump's cell lined with history books - no TV time. All the wagyu cheeseburgers he wants.

Diana's avatar

The burger is much too good- let’s feed him what was being fed to the detainees in the Florida ICE facility.

Cindy Gailey's avatar

And almost constant audio of HCR!! Either would cure him or make his brain blow up.

Jen Andrews's avatar

It's cruel. And a guillotine is kinder and somehow more historically appropriate.

Ellen's avatar

Not hanged, but certainly prosecuted for their crimes.

Carol Taylor Boyd's avatar

I agree, we must demand that billionaires, millionaires and churches pay their fair share of taxes!!!

Riversong Pond's avatar

TC- We are not them. Nor would we ever aspire to be. If you want to help the movement win, please dial it back.

Cindy Gailey's avatar

Yes. Tax the megachurches & if a church spends 10% of its income on charity, their tax base would be reduced.

Wandyrer's avatar

why wait until 2029?

Lori T.'s avatar

A real rush to crush before October 18, NKD 2. , on top of the 2925 agenda. We can expect the cruelty , fear rhetoric to be on steroids this week.

Stand up be safe.

Thankfully we have the information portrayed by Heather to help arm us .thankyou all for strong sane comments

Be safe.

I for one “older white woman”, never political before will be at front of March.

For our future generations

Michele's avatar

Alexandra, I am sure that death star did not write this, but members of the cabal. As i read it, i thought about all I have read about the behavior of Spaniards in the Americas and then other Europeans. Yes, happy Indigenous People's Day, a time to remember how white Europeans have treated them and yet they persevere with pride.

Pam Taylor's avatar

Alexandra, and Trump is trying to hang onto the last vestiges of his warped mind. He can't utter a sentence without blaming the radical left, in hopes of riling up the same people who have fallen for his propaganda, and can't let go.

Pat Cole's avatar

If you think he shit his drawers when Obama was elected, wait until Crockett is president!

Ryan Collay's avatar

And the new ‘conservative’ emperor Peter of the Palantir!

Linda Slater's avatar

With the active support of billionaires like Thiel and the tacit support of Zuckerberg , Bezos and others who may be geniuses at amassing money, but who are too selfishly focused of their own greedy lives to understand what is really going on and where this is headed. This kind of religious fervor always leads to revolution, as it is the only way to disabuse these idiots of their assuredness that they are the "chosen of god", but instead are just gullible books who are too stupid to understand how they are being used. Trump chief among them.

Ruth Sheets's avatar

Alexandria, yep, Trump's troika of Trumplandi have no clue. Now, Trump is speaking from Israel whining that there is peace in the Middle East which he has no clue about. He says he is "going to help," when he has no idea what that would even look like. Trump wants to claim full credit for what happened in Israel, freeing hostages and stopping Israeli bombing, and I am guessing he had a bit to do with it because his buddy Netanyahu depends on us for weapons and money and Trump has the power or thinks he does to just cut it off or threaten such a cut-off. Hamas had no part in the "peace process" which means they probably haven't bought into it because Israel has not bought into it either. Netty just wanted the hostages freed so he could get the world's people off his back. He will work to cause Gaza more pain in the near future, blaming Hamas for his own actions. So typical!

Jon Rosen's avatar

You gotta just love that a Jew, Miller, is handling the militarization for Vought who is trying to force Christofascism into every aspect of the government. One would wonder where that will leave Little Stephen when they start up the ovens.

We know where it left the Jews when Hitler took over.

alex poliakoff's avatar

Yo Dutchka (Alexandra).., this is not only " the gang that can't shoot straight "..., but the gang that that can't think straight. And now even Hamas realizes the futility of dealing with him and must quietly resort to a different angle of settling things, out there in the desert. There's plenty of 'back door buddies' in the Hamas world. We meanwhile.., are only provided what 'we' are deemed 'needed to know', and we have to scratch for that, at least while 'the prick himself' is in charge. Should he be vacated we'll really be in a free fall.

Public Servant's avatar

Happy Indigenous People’s Day, Annabel! Columbus was a genocidal colonizer and we live on stolen land. Thank you Heather for enlightening us about our history - I wrote a song for her in honor of her bravery: https://democracydefender2025.substack.com/p/heather-cox-richardson-song-letters

Betsy Smith's avatar

Many meetings on the Cape and Islands recognize at the start that we are occupying Wampanoag land.

Bill Katz's avatar

Admittedly, this or these issues are complicated. They pit one group against another. Historic revisionism is good if it recreates a more accurate version of events. Yes we must and should celebrate Indigenous Peoples Day. Maybe there is a place not to celebrate Columbus but place him in the mix of western colonial domination taking place in those times. Trump wants to whitewash history alla 1984 in a revision of the past. Hopefully, we will white out Donald J. Trump and remove any physical remains of his person. I still insist that I will one day in the not to distant future, drop bodily fluids on the spot where his bones rest and be the first in line so I can get into the Guinness Book of World Records, lol.

Jim Riley's avatar

Isn’t it horrendously sad that there are some evil people who seem to motivate good people and some others to think and want to act out evil thoughts? “trumpelthinskin” is one of those people and I hope that there are fewer of them populating planet earth!

Riad Mahayni's avatar

Or better yet, polluting the earth.

Jim Riley's avatar

Yes, a more truer, meaningful and accurate description!!!

Judith Smith 1111's avatar

Jim Riley -- “trumpelthinskin” !!! Now that is good!

.

Jim Riley's avatar

Thanks, would love to take credit for it Judith; however, it has been around since the 1980’s, based upon my research.

Ally House (Oregon)'s avatar

In the Willamette Valley, we acknowledge the Kalapuyans and coastal Siletz and Alsean

Betsy Smith's avatar

Good to know. Those tribes are all new to me--just reminds me of how little I know of our history and the great variety of cultures that have played and still play a role in who we are.

Cindy Gailey's avatar

An itty bit of Penobscot out here in WA celebrates Indigenous Day. Not enough repair down but I want our written & spoken history to TELL the TRUTH about the treatments suffered.

Apache's avatar

Hello Public Servant... Columbus, who was not Spanish, or Catholic, was so Bad to the Indigenous, that he was Seized by Catholic Church Authorities, and returned to Spain in Chains on his 3rd Voyage...

Linda Weide's avatar

There was money and politics in his voyages as well. Seems like corruption all around. It is interesting that we hear much less of the Vikings that settled in what is now Canada far longer ago. Perhaps because they did not survive.

https://sonsofvikings.com/blogs/history/evidence-of-vikings-in-north-america-before-columbus?srsltid=AfmBOopOvkTqogjBGR5B1tJwYrAVQaHivQZZjDZyBSynC-t0w-_cTERM

Apache's avatar

Hello Linda... Jared Diamond's Book, "Collapse", discusses the Collapse of several Early European Settlements in the Western Hemisphere.... OBW: The Indigenous drove out the Vikings...

Gary Pudup's avatar

Have you read Diamond's Guns, Germs and Steel?

He explains how Europeans came to power over the world.

Apache's avatar

Hello Gary... I have that Book, however I haven't Read it... OBW: European Disease, and 'Jack Daniels' killed most of the Indigenous...

Linda Weide's avatar

That is what I had always read. It makes sense.

MLMinET's avatar

Apache, isn’t this the month in which something is supposed to happen to Trump? We’re almost halfway …

Miselle's avatar

I believe Apache said the Indigenous leaders were prophesizing something big on Oct 19th.

I hope the MASSIVE NO KINGS rallies turn out give Trump a massive M.I.

Judith Smith 1111's avatar

MLMinET -- ?? Is this something from Diamond's book? Or are you speaking astrologically?

Mar O’Malley's avatar

As an Irish person to know the Vikings got some sort of comeuppance great to know. For centuries they invaded Ireland and other counties so thanks. I was unaware that their History in Vineland had been further gathered up and summarized.

Craig Gjerde's avatar

They likely survived and went back to Greenland. Their colony did not survive.

Linda Weide's avatar

Still the whole thing is interesting and too little is known about it.

Kathy Hughes's avatar

One of the reasons Greenland’s colonies collapsed was because they were established in a warmer climatic period which allowed Europeans to establish farming settlements there. Over the next few centuries, the climate became colder and it was too cold for the descendants of the settlers to continue farming.

Apache's avatar

Hello Kathy... The Vikings also didn't adapt to Greenland... They tried to stay Scandinavian, and their were not enough of them to create a Synergy of Numbers...

cameron mcconnell's avatar

It's mentioned in the Icelandic Sagas. They took some trees for ship lumber and returned to Greenland and Iceland.

Bill Pierce's avatar

I don’t think there is any intent in the Project2025 proclamation to celebrate Catholicism. Rather it embraces a version of “Christianity” that is deeply racist, honors superiority by wealth, embracing a profound anti-intellectualism, and establishes a might makes right view of human affairs. Basically, as we always have felt, they wish to confirm and elevate the literal union of gangsterism and fascism.

Robot Bender's avatar

There isn't. The far right Protestants think that Catholics are heretics. I hope Whiskey Pete and Coney-Barrett (among others) are aware that they're on the long term chopping block.

Bill Pierce's avatar

These folk on the far right may be protestant, but they are in no way Christian. Actually, they aren’t even Abrahamic.

HulitC's avatar

Columbus was indeed Catholic, of the Franciscan order. Circumstances were different then …

https://ewtn.co.uk/article-what-you-should-know-about-christopher-columbus/

Apache's avatar

Hello Hulit.... Read This:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_theories_of_Christopher_Columbus#Crypto-Judaism

According to these Theories, backed by Simon Wiesenthal, Columbus may have been mostly backed by Shephardic Jews in Italy, and was looking for a place to start a new Zion... Columbus was guided by his reading of the Book of Isaiah... This is Speculation of Course...

HulitC's avatar

Sorry for the delay in responding. Thanks for this. I've also read that only some Jews were forced to leave Palestine but that many others remained. Of course many then also converted to Islam... At the same time (earlier even) many Jews had moved to other places around the Mediterranean like the Greeks and other pre Christian era peoples. Those that left have no right to massacre the ones that chose to remain even if they did decide to change their religion.

Cindy Gailey's avatar

Yeah Apache! Show me one school child who was given any part of the story about Chris's end!. Grew up in MA- never heard a word. Just saw celebrations.

Apache's avatar

Hello Cindy... I believe that the 5th Grade Fairy Tale is, 'In 1492, Columbus Sailed The Ocean Blue, and Found an Empty Land...' ...

Bryan Sean McKown's avatar

Yes, thank you Professor Heather Cox Richardson. Annabel Ascher & Public Servant AND Alexandra Sokoloff.

HCR: "Italian mariner Christopher Columbus, who worked for Spain's monarchs Ferdinand & Isabella ...".

The mariner's real name is "Cristofo Colombo" but, in Spanish "Cristobal Colon".

Regardless, everyone, have a safe Cristobal Colon day off.

Gary Pudup's avatar

So to get rid of Columbus should we have a Colon-oscopy?

Ally House (Oregon)'s avatar

🤣🤣🤣

You beat my Junior High brain to some sort of "colon" related smart aleck response.

Bryan Sean McKown's avatar

I am a JD not an MD Gary but, definitely sort of virulent lesion.

Gary Pudup's avatar

Couldn't find a real job? /s

Shellee L.(NY now SoCal)'s avatar

Thanks for sharing Freberg. What a breath of fresh air.

Dale Rowett AR OK VA PA NY's avatar

My pleasure, Shellee. You may have noticed there are more episodes, all of them hilarious. In fact, Freberg first released the work on vinyl. Unlike most most albums, there were no "tracks." It was one long, continuous performance, except of course, when one had to flip the record over. Later, it was released on CDs, and a "Part 2" with additional chapters was released. I had the vinyl album then replaced it with CDs. It is well worth the listen.

Having spent most of my adulthood in graphic design and advertising, I've encountered more than my fair share of clients who think they know best, their lack of education and experience notwithstanding. My favorite episode is the one in which Betsy Ross reveals her design for the new flag to George Washington. "Everybody Wants to Be an Art Director."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mlc8FTIqvoE

It's Come To This's avatar

"History is different from commemoration." History is different from resentment, from drooling anger, from silly 3-year-old justifications for current idiocies. 'I DESERVED those cookies I stole!...In fact, I didn't steal them because they were always MINE...if you say anything about it, I'll put YOU in jail!'

A former Professor of Historiography (the discipline of writing history itself) from days long past at the University of Michigan once said in a seminar I took that history -- if studied correctly -- will simply break your heart. How could it do anything less? It should break your heart, she added. If it doesn't, there's something profoundly wrong with the way you're going about looking at it.

One day, this ridiculous, childish, falsifying cult of stupidity and psychiatric lunacy will be a distant memory from a past that one-day future historians will study diligently to uncover the great mystery -- how and why so many millions could let themselves be had by a cult of duplicity that lies about literally everything it touches.

Let's do everything we can today to make sure that future arrives as quickly as possible.

AK dude's avatar

Spent the day yesterday learning about some of the "history" of Scotland....progressions of wars.....many ostensibly about religion (clan vs. clan, protestant vs. catholic, nation vs. nation), but really about the "divine right of kings...or as we now see in our country, the "divine right of self centererd, egotistical, megolomaniacal dipshits - who have coagulated around the dumbest of them to try and "take back our country". "History" does not look back fondly on "Bonnie Prince Charlie" -- who embodied many of the characteristics of our "Bonnie Prince Trump". It will not look back on Trump with fondness either...assuming we have history in the future.

Kathy Hughes's avatar

Bonnie Prince Charlie became a cantankerous old drunk and angry man. His wife left him for other men, and his daughter by his mistress took care of Bonnie Prince Charlie during his last days, even though she herself was dying.

Ally House (Oregon)'s avatar

As I am married into the Campbell clan, I generally maintain quiet when amongst the Scots. I have "fam trad" ancestry from County Mayo in Ireland.

Mar O’Malley's avatar

County Mayo! My grandmother from Curran near Clew Bay.

Ally House (Oregon)'s avatar

Nice, cousin!!

The “fam trad” is from about 3 or 4 generations back where the “dad” wasn’t…

ynot1965's avatar

I have seen the study of history described as studying the wake of a boat through the wrong end of a telescope.

lauriemcf's avatar

Well said. I'm also a UM alum from the way back!

Robot Bender's avatar

Yes, it will. It indicates that one of Humanity's defining characteristics is its inhumanity to Humanity.

Betsy Smith's avatar

It is also, in some communities, called a day of mourning.

Johnny Marcus's avatar

Columbus actually ignored thousands of years of knowledge bout the geography of the earth

J L Graham's avatar

My 5th or 6th grade public school teacher told us that Columbus was the very first person to realize the the world was round. As time went on, I learned that wasn't actually true, and I was nearly an adult before I knew that Eratosthenes had long ago astonishingly accurately measured the earth's circumference. I also learned in school that Columbus was one of the greatest heroes of all time. A large percentage of the "history" I learned in elementary school turned out to be folklore, and that real history is a lot more complex and gritty. Some people really don't want to face the more troubling parts, including some in my circles. I think it's a mistake to only look at the troubling parts, but they are part and parcel of the admirable stuff. Meanwhile, our culture evolves, and we have some say in what direction.

The main thing is that it's history to the degree (and often, that's pretty iffy) it is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth; at least as far as we can manage. Accuracy is our friend. The world seems to be a mix of opportunities and terrors, but we shift the odds in our favor with accuracy. Accuracy enabled a huge array of people, from the present and the past, to contribute to turning a pile of minerals into the device I am typing on. Accuracy and honesty also contribute to the quality of human relationships, along with empathy. Real intimacy is the depth to which people know and respond to what is real in one another.

TCinLA's avatar

Columbus' big problem geographically was he thought the Earth was 1/3 smaller than it is, which is why he thought he could sail west to India.

Pat Cole's avatar

Funny how we learned the world was nearly round. I think that from prehistory onwards to the time of JL today that people figured it out. I visited my grandfather when I was 4. He took us out of sight of land and we saw the curve. Horizon to horizon was an arc. I asked him if we might start to slide when we got to the edges. That was the pacific. He said it was the same way in Texas the way it curved on the plains. I was older and he had long passed when as I drove a big truck towards the sunset I saw it. Plain as day the Texas plain curved on the horizon. Of course by then I knew the world was roundish. I suspect our new history revisions should include flattening the globe again.

Terry24x's avatar

When I was in elementary school I was taught that Columbus and the indigenous people (called natives then) were friendly. Supposedly the “natives” were in awe of the great ships and thought they were carrying gods. I didn’t learn about any violence until I was much older.

Gary Pudup's avatar

“There are no facts, only interpretations.”

― Friedrich Nietzsche

Judith Smith 1111's avatar

Gary Pudup -- Nietzsche was a philosopher, not an inquisitive scientist.

Gary Pudup's avatar

I know...history is not a science.

Lady Emsworth's avatar

"Columbus was a genocidal, sadistic, and a pedophile rapist."

I wondered why trump thought he was so wonderful . . .

Harvey Kravetz's avatar

Sexual Slavery and Exploitation of Children: (It is behavior trump would approve of)

The evidence here is particularly disturbing and comes from Columbus's own writings:

In 1500, Columbus wrote: "A hundred castellanoes are as easily obtained for a woman as for a farm, and it is very general and there are plenty of dealers who go about looking for girls; those from nine to ten are now in demand. This documents a sex trafficking operation involving prepubescent girls.

One of Columbus's crew members wrote about taking a "beautiful Cannibal girl" whom "the admiral gave" to him, describing in graphic detail how he tied her up with rope when she resisted his sexual advances.

Broader Context:

The main sources of controversy involve his use of violence and slavery, forced conversion of native peoples to Christianity, and the introduction of diseases that had dramatic long-term effects.

The historical record, including Columbus's own letters and crew journals, provides disturbing documentation of these atrocities. This is why many communities have replaced Columbus Day with Indigenous Peoples' Day.

Kristin Newton's avatar

The Vikings discovered North America 500 years before Columbus and called it Vinland. It was clearly documented in the Icelandic sagas but people thought that was a myth, until Viking ruins were found in Newfoundland. As it happens, thanks to my Icelandic father, I’m descended from some of the Vikings who went to North America, as well as Snorri Sturlasson, who wrote the sagas. By a quirk of fate, thanks to my mother, I’m also descended from William Brewster, senior elder and the leader of Plymouth Colony, who arrived in America on the Mayflower. As a result, I’ve always been keenly interested in the ramifications of these voyages. My father was instrumental in having October 9th declared Leif Erikson Day. What Columbus did to the kind, gentle tribe of people he discovered was horrendous.

Kristin Newton's avatar

And looking at the White House website just now, tRump’s staff posted a pompous message:

…”To honor Leif Erikson, son of Iceland and grandson of Norway, and to celebrate our Nordic-American heritage, the Congress, by joint resolution (Public Law 88-566) approved on September 2, 1964, has authorized the President of the United States to proclaim October 9 of each year as “Leif Erikson Day.”

NOW, THEREFORE, I, DONALD J. TRUMP, President of the United States of America, by virtue of the authority vested in me by the Constitution and the laws of the United States, do hereby proclaim October 9, 2025, as Leif Erikson Day. I call upon all Americans to celebrate the achievements and contributions of Nordic Americans to our Nation with appropriate ceremonies, activities, and programs.

IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this ninth day of October, in the year of our Lord two thousand twenty-five, and of the Independence of the United States of America the two hundred and fiftieth.”

DONALD J. TRUMP

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/10/leif-erikson-day-2025/

Janet Myers's avatar

Oh goodie. Another win for the Whiteys.

TJB's avatar

Using "year of our Lord" and "year of our independence" together, while they denote entirely different time frames, is literally all you need to know he's a megalomanic. Honestly. How does he even take himself seriously, anymore???

Beth B's avatar

As though they have noting more important to declare or DO with our tax dollars....

Papa’s Pancake Paradise's avatar

Kristin, I am just the opposite: Through my Mother = Swedish-Norwegian (with plenty of genealogical evidence of Viking ancestry). Through my Father = related to George Morton, the financial secretary of the Pilgrims, who came over to the “New World” on the third voyage of the Pilgrims in 1623. (Also, he was the apparent author/editor of “Mourt’s Relation” in 1622.)

I have not visited L'Anse aux Meadows in Newfoundland, but I hope to see it one day.

It’s an interesting dichotomy in my life - exploration, superiority-inferiority, self-improvement, escaping persecution, inflicting persecution, striving for a better life, but hopefully not at the expense of others, etc….on both sides of the family tree.

I would love to see a World Wide Day of Peace & Love - a day that ALL people on Planet Earth would agree to observe. It would be a day of true charity, honest forgiveness - both giving and receiving, total humility.

Make it a Do Unto Others Day - a concept that is prevalent in many societies and religions around the world.

Why don’t we have such a day? This is not a new concept - to call for a day of world-wide respect and dignity. Of course, EVERY day should be a day of world-wide respect and dignity.

Why don’t we have such a day? “The answer, my friend, is blowin’ in the wind.” But, what does that mean? Here’s what Bobby Dylan said:

“There ain't too much I can say about this song except that the answer is blowing in the wind. It ain't in no book or movie or TV show or discussion group. Man, it's in the wind – and it's blowing in the wind. Too many of these hip people are telling me where the answer is but oh I won't believe that. I still say it's in the wind and just like a restless piece of paper it's got to come down some ... But the only trouble is that no one picks up the answer when it comes down so not too many people get to see and know ... and then it flies away. I still say that some of the biggest criminals are those that turn their heads away when they see wrong and know it's wrong. I'm only 21 years old and I know that there's been too many wars ... You people over 21, you're older and smarter.”

Maybe rather than Do Unto Others Day, we should work toward a Blowin’ in the Wind Day?

Mar O’Malley's avatar

Actually the UN and some others do have a day and several depending. There are several what I think important declarations that the United States has not signed such as the UN Children’s Rights Declaration. It is a very imperfect organization but something nd perhaps another iriteration is needed once again.

Judith Smith 1111's avatar

Kristin Newton -- And what about the Indigenous people already living in Canada and in the U.S.?

Linda Weide's avatar

Yes. We are an occupying nation, and yes, Queen Isabella did send CC to save Christianity, which she thought would lose out to Islam, a growing religion. Thus we have the Spanish Inquisition, and Queen Isabella, supposedly very devout (this seems to have been historically important for women to be), is told in the book "Isabella: The Warrior Queen" by Kristen Downey. I think it is important to also understand what seeing naked people would have been like to people who covered up to the tops of their necks and then some. No bare skin was showing in those times. It would have been really hard for the different cultures to understand each other, and I would say that the religion brought to the Americans by the Europeans was anything but tolerant.

I was raised with classic stories of our history which I could then later deconstruct. It takes a lot of work to do that. It would be good if our children got honest versions of our history in age appropriate ways.

While I am not for teaching children about anything but Native American agency until a certain age, I certainly think we should all be aware of the way we have not honored our treaties. Ruth Ben Ghiat had a First Nation guest on her Friday Zoom, Julian Brave Noisecat and there was discussion about how little treaties are discussed when one mentions the original documents. This is just part of the talk because she forgot to put the camera on for a while, and because he did not stay that long, and they never video the Q and A. https://youtu.be/nD4d_JSL84k

It's Come To This's avatar

Queen Isabella and King Ferdinand were the authors of the Alhambra Decree, which ordered all Jews to convert to Catholicism or leave the country by July of that same year 1492. Massacres of Jews in the 1390s had already led to half the country's Jews self-converting in the face of torture and death. As a result, Sephardic Jews became scattered all over Italy, Greece, the Netherlands, elsewhere.

Lovely, charming "Christian" monarchs Ferdinand and Isabella also inaugurated the Spanish Inquisition and the Doctrine of the Purity of Blood, which stated that both Jewish and Muslim "blood" was tainted, impure, and ineradicable. The forced expulsion of Muslims took place at the same time, and stood in place as Spanish law until the 1920s. One of the last Prime Ministers under the Bourbon monarchy then allowed Sephardic Jews who could prove ancestry to reclaim Spanish citizenship.

I somehow don't remember the Orange Putzface mentioning anything about THIS in his gushing praise for Columbus and the monarchs who paid for his expeditions to the New World.

Kathy Hughes's avatar

I think the forced expulsions and conversions of Jews to Christianity and the rise of the Inquisition (which was designed to be an enterprise to make money for th Crown) were one of the most self-defeating moves monarchs made. They rid themselves of an enterprising group of citizens who provided wealth to Spain. When Ferdinand and Isabella proposed to marry their eldest daughter Isabella to King Manuel of Portugal, young Isabella insisted that Manuel expel all Jews from Portugal, and Manuel did so. Spanish explorers discovered gold and silver in the Americas. The result led to inflation in Spain, and Charles V, his son Philip II and other Habsburgs used their newfound wealth to finance their European was. During Philip II’s reign, Spain’s government underwent 4 bankruptcies.

One of the Inquision’s tasks was to root out former Jews who clung privately to Jewish traditions. They faced severe punishment if they were caught practicing Jewish worship and other traditions IThese people were known as anusim, or forced ones. Some were to emigrate to remoter parts of North American (including what is now New Mexico, and to worship more freely there. Ironically enough, some of Catholicism’s known saints, such as St. Teresa of Āvila (Teresa de Ahumada y Cepeda) and St. John of the Cross, themselves had Sephardic ancestry. St. John of the Cross spent a number of years in the Inquisition’s prisons because they distrusted his spiritual writings. Some historians believe Columbus himself may have had Sephardic ancestry.

Sultan Bayezit encouraged Sephardic Jews to settle in the Ottoman Empire, and many did. They moved into the Balkans, Greece (especially Thessaloniki, which was known as Salonica,) and Constantinople itself. They had to pay the tax due to the Empire for not being and Muslims, but they were free to worship as they chose and to internally govern their own affairs. Unfortunately, many of their descendants were still living in the Balkan countries and Greece when they were invaded by Nazi Germany, and the Nazis rounded them up and sent them off to die in Nazi extermination camps. The late singer Eydie Gorme (born Edith Gormezano) and Neil Sedaka both came from Sephardic families.

Several years ago, Spain’s govern reopened its offer to grant citizenship to descendants of Sephardic Jews who could prove their ancestry.

Steve Abbott's avatar

Some Sephardim with specific skills were invited to England, my own shoe making ancestors among them. They were promised they would not have to convert to Christianity, but this was not true. In the 1630s, the entire extended family emigrated to Boston, later splitting up. Some to Philadelphia, some to New York.

Kathy Hughes's avatar

Oliver Cromwell permitted Jews to resettle in England and to worship as Jews after they had been expelled by Edward I ) Edward Lomgshanks) in the late 13th century. Like many monarchs of the time, he saw Jews as a people to be extorted as a source of ready cash.

Mar O’Malley's avatar

There was not just one Inquisition. Many from

Mexico City to Manila to Goa, India. It was awful and I am hoping the new pope either his family history which reflects our messiness will open up and discuss the history of all the Inquisitions and speak truth to power. Don Quixote the fantastical novel written by Cervantes takes place in a prison fir those imprisoned by the Inquisitikn. Why the concepts of windmills still fascinates me.

Kathy Hughes's avatar

True. Portugal and Italian states including the Papal States had their inquisitions, which were set up along the same lines as the Inquisitions in Spain. The Inquisition in Spain was established to make money for the crown and wound up lasting until Napoleon invaded Spain in the early 19th century. Historian Henry Kamen has argued there were fewer victims of the Inquisition than claimed. There is admittedly a strain of Anglo American historiography which tends to paint Spain as a source of peculiar evil and destruction. This is called the Black Legend or Leyenda Negra interpretation of history, and it has tended to distort historical interpretation in Anglo American circles.

Mar O’Malley's avatar

Thanks. I know there is much more but hard to find and also sometimes hard to read as well as the research.

It's Come To This's avatar

thanks for the additional tutorial. News about Edie Gorme and Neil Sedaka I didn't know for sure, not to mention St Teresa of Avila.

Spain was indeed ruled by a long succession of idiots until the 1970s. A warning to us all who think idiots running countries are the best thing around since crunchy peanut butter...!

Linda Weide's avatar

Yes, Jews who did not want to be Converso, many went to the Ottoman Empire where religions diversity was tolerated. I read a lot about the fate of Jews of the time, and found several children's books that document things like Jewish characters who were sent to the "New World," in various capacities, etc...

Kathy Hughes's avatar

Perhaps the most prominent person among the exiled Sephardim who did much to help her community was the immensely wealthy widow Doña Gracia Mendes. She had been raised in a converso family and was given the name Beatriz de Luna. She married a man who was a wealthy merchant, and had one daughter with him before her husband died of an illness. Beatriz eventually left Europe and settled in the Ottoman Empire, where she lived openly was a member of the Jewish faith and proved to be very successful in carrying on her late husband’s business. She used much of her wealth to assist other members of the Sephardic people in need, and she married her daughter to her cousin, the son of her brother Joseph Nasi, whom the Sultan had named Duke of Naxos.

Richard Sutherland's avatar

The book that really opened my eyes to the reality of what happened is "1491" by Charles C. Mann. What happened in the Western Hemisphere at the hands of the European, or white", Christians since 1492 is nothing short of devastating. It continues to this day. Many, perhaps most, of the Christians are Christians in name only. Today a large number of white Christians are white Protestant Christian Nationalists. Trump knows this and exploits it.

At the Believers' Summit on July 27, 2024, a gathering hosted by Charlie Kirk's group, Turning Point Action, Trump told the assembled gathering: "Christians, get out and vote, just this time. You won't have to do it anymore. Four more years, it'll be fixed, it'll be fine, you won't have to vote anymore my beautiful Christians." (Wall Street Journal News, You Tube July 27, 2024.) There is zero doubt about what Trump has in mind - a dictatorship.

Harvey Kravetz's avatar

A web search: (This is how great Christopher C was. (It is behavior trump would approve of)

Sexual Slavery and Exploitation of Children:

The evidence here is particularly disturbing and comes from Columbus's own writings:

In 1500, Columbus wrote: "A hundred castellanoes are as easily obtained for a woman as for a farm, and it is very general and there are plenty of dealers who go about looking for girl This documents a sex trafficking operation involving prepubescent girls.

One of Columbus's crew members wrote about taking a "beautiful Cannibal girl" whom "the admiral gave" to him, describing in graphic detail how he tied her up with rope when she resisted his sexual advances.

Broader Context:

The main sources of controversy involve his use of violence and slavery, forced conversion of native peoples to Christianity, and the introduction of diseases that had dramatic long-term effects.historical record, including Columbus's own letters and crew journals, provides disturbing documentation of these atrocities. This is why many communities have replaced Columbus Day with Indigenous Peoples' Day.

Michael Corthell's avatar

Heather's Final Insight Is Powerful and Timely...

Emerson’s Law of Compensation reminds us that every cause produces its inevitable effect, and every lie brings the debt of its own correction. America has for too long sown the causes of delusion, glorifying conquest as courage, greed as progress, and myth as identity. The effect, now ripening, is a nation losing the ability to tell truth from propaganda.

When a society builds itself on illusion, it forfeits its balance. Nature and truth will always collect what is owed. The refusal to acknowledge historical violence, the insistence on sanctifying colonizers as saints, and the political theater of white Christian nationalism are not harmless cultural habits; they are the moral debts that accrue interest.

Emerson wrote that “the universe is represented in every one of its particles.” The same holds true for nations. The energy a country projects, truth or deceit, justice or domination, returns in kind. America is not exempt from the laws it breaks. If it continues to rewrite history to flatter itself, to mistake myth for destiny, the effect will be collapse from within.

A democracy cannot survive on fantasy. Its endurance depends on honesty, humility, and the courage to face the mirror. The bill for our illusions is coming due.

Vivian T.'s avatar

No wonder miller, vought and the pedophile are using Columbus as a model for their own hate-filled America.

Ned McDoodle's avatar

Well, Annabel, you have kicked off quite a thread! I was skeptical of your second statement. But, yes, Columbus was brutal. If you do not mind, I would like go off-topic -- or, in the case of Cristobal Colón (if my shrinking grey matter still serves), 'off-tropic" -- and post this essay that I came across today about the degradation of our republican culture. 💔

https://www.lincolnsquare.media/p/kirby-smart-is-a-liar-does-it-matter

Perhaps the most threatening part of Trumpism and its cult of wessonality. This seemingly trivial incident says it all. In the eyes of a regressing culture, honor is as obtuse as compassion is weak. What disturbs me, too, is that too many public figures and role models act like six year olds. When I was a kid, I lied to avoid spankings; I am no longer a kid. 🫣

Mary Tyler Knowles's avatar

Genuinely curious—your sources?

Annabel Ascher's avatar

@Mary Tyler Knowles--Sources for what? The information about Columbus and his men is recorded in any honest history book. So, my sources are books on American History. I do not have a bibliography but I bet you could get some good suggestions by doing an internet search.

George Dunn's avatar

Happy Columbus Day! There is no Indigenous People's Day, yet. If you want one it has to be a day different from Columbus Day. You don't have my vote. They were savage tribes and did not live in peace. So go for it.

Punkette's avatar

Thank you, Annabel! Well said, sister. And Happy Hispanic/Latino Heritage Month which continues through October 15th. I have not seen the Dump regime acknowledge it at all.

Janete's avatar

Columbus: the first "illegal" immigrant. ICE would have abducted and deported him - and blown up his ships.

Dutch Mike's avatar

Right you are. And then this one: “Columbus’s journey carried thousands of years of wisdom, philosophy, reason, and culture across the Atlantic into the Americas” - aaand destroyed thousands of years of wisdom, philosophy and reason already present in the Americas.

Joanie's avatar

Arson, indeed. Thank you once again for shining a bright light on our past, with all our faults for us to see. And learn from. The constant erasing of our nation’s true history will only lead us to further sins against our fellow man. We are not perfect beings and we have to acknowledge that in order to learn and do better. Great newsletter Professor Richardson. THANK YOU !

D4N's avatar

Great observation Janete ! If only the natives had considered having ICE.

Thomas Mani's avatar

They were fine until the curious population found peculiar the spaniards were adamant on getting more and more of the soft yellow metal that they had no use for. And it all went downhill from there.

Ned McDoodle's avatar

Good one; thank you for the giggle quickly followed by a distressing sense *of your accuracy of sentiment.

Annie Silbey's avatar

Right on Heather,yet again you put history and today’s politics into perspective. Indigenous people deserve this day to be theirs of remembrance and to celebrate their existence!

Leslie McKenna's avatar

Columbus accidentally found the West Indies

Never got to America . Also, accidentally discovered Ireland on a couple of attempts to find spice route.

Rational Rants's avatar

And ICE did not get rid that that illegal immigrant. And look what happened because of it! You make a great supporting argument for ICE and the deportation of ILLEGAL immigrants.

John Beale's avatar

And yet he was not illegal according to the indigenous tribes at the time; he was (initially) welcomed by the natives- at least according to his own account. What I see is evidence you should treat people according to how they behave, as eventually the Spanish crown did, arresting him for his misdeeds obvious even to them.

Rational Rants's avatar

You do realize that your argument strengthens the support of ICE and the removal of people who just show up on someone else's property without the right or their consent?

John Beale's avatar

I argue both that people should be treated according to the law, AND that we should take care the law is just and equitable. Are immigrants truly unwelcome, if they are somehow 40% of all hired crop labor in the US, for example? https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/farm-labor

Illegal entry can be charged as a misdemeanor under 8 U.S.C. § 1325(a) for a first offense. Once someone is inside the U.S., their continued presence without authorization is legally not a crime. Overstaying a valid visa is also not a criminal offense. ICE has treated both situations with the kind of aggression (smashing windows etc.) normally reserved for felony crimes.

Linda Morland's avatar

We must learn from history, not try to change it. Thank you for providing historical insight into daily issues. In looking at the comments, please folks, this is not the place to post name calling and prejudice. Columbus was a person in the 15th century whose outlook was dramatically different than ours. What the Europeans did to the indigenous peoples was horrible. But wait. Take a look at how we are currently treating them.

Lynell(VA by way of MD&DC)'s avatar

Hi, Linda. My husband is native to the island of Antigua in the West Indies. They and the other Caribbean island natives have always known the truth about Columbus.

D4N's avatar

Right ? Columbus, an Italian sailing for the greater glory of Spain, never stepped a foot on mainland North America. He could be accurately described as the first European to step foot on South America's soil; There and perhaps other spots in the Carribean islands and Central America, but definitely "not" North American mainland.

Linda Morland's avatar

We live on St. Croix, USVI. Columbus tried to land here. He was met with arrows.

Robot Bender's avatar

I grew up in Puerto Rico. STX was a favorite spot for my family.

Joanne Beck's avatar

Oh do I wish I was your neighbor!

Robot Bender's avatar

I grew up in Puerto Rico and believe me, the Caribbean history I was taught is FAR different than what is taught on the mainland.

Ally House (Oregon)'s avatar

Morning, Lynell. I can only imagine his knowledge of the "real" history of Columbus.

Lynell(VA by way of MD&DC)'s avatar

Morning, Ally! He's a lives-in-the-moment kinda guy, but knows enough to scoff at those who hold a fascination for the "discoverer."

Ned McDoodle's avatar

Thirty years ago, I read a book about the fate of the indigenous peoples; in either the Americas or in North America. The statistics that Dr Richardson cites accords with those that l encountered. At that time, I remember speaking with my mother on the telephone and she told me, in effect:

"Well, the Spaniards wanted the gold and needed miners to get it, so they enslaved Indians.

"The French were nicer, since they were furriers and needed partners among the natives to trap those animals.

"And then the British came and they wanted farms, so they got the natives out of there."

The interesting thing for me was that, thirty years before that, I was kid in Sydney. A new-boy showed up from South Africa. He was bullied badly for what South Africa was doing to indigenous people.

I told my mother about the hazing after school. She chuckled and said something like, "Hah! The only difference between South Africa and us [i.e., Australia and America] is that we have enough room to get away with it [i.e., apartheid]."

Jude Ellen's avatar

Ned, you had a very smart mother!

Ned McDoodle's avatar

Thank you, Jude. She sure was. Sadly, I ended up in the shallow of that gene-pool.

Jude Ellen's avatar

That's odd. I didn't add what else I was thinking, having read many of your comments. And that is that your having a mother like you did explains why you are so thoughtful. So I doubt you were in the shallow end.

Ned McDoodle's avatar

Sad but true. She did have compassion. One time I forgot to invite a class-mate to my birthday party. He, too, was new. So, my mother and *I looked up and started calling every 'Ryan' in Sydney; there were a lot of Ryans in Sydney.

My mother kept me going and, after two hours, we tracked my class-mate down and *he was thrilled we had called. His mother and mine talked for a few minutes; the boy had felt badly for being overlooked and so his mother deeply appreciated my mother and me calling her son, I would never have done that, except for my mother's sense of fair-play.

Jude Ellen -- interesting name, by the way --- you are very kind to compliment me. My parents made my sister an me considerate of others. Nonetheless, I did not enjoy anything near my mother's abilities intellectually. Not meant to *be modest or fishing for another compliment; it is true.

Ally House (Oregon)'s avatar

Ned, I also find myself in the shallow end of that gene pool; I had incredible parents; I'm average.

D4N's avatar

Yes Linda; That's the point for rational people.

D4N's avatar

I absolutely adore your pictures from the “No Kings” rallies.

Vickie Berry's avatar

Yes, especially the guy with the poster about Stormy Daniels being trump’s only qualified hire. 😁

J L Graham's avatar

She clearly has a strong stomach.

D4N's avatar

Oh yes Vickie; That one caused me to blurt coffee on my PC screen..

Evelyn Scolman Lemoine's avatar

Thank you, Heather, for so cogently explaining why many Americans no longer celebrate Columbus Day in order to honor the people who should have been celebrated in the first place, the native peoples who predated him. Your excerpts of the president's proclamation make it clear that these are not his words... And as you point out, "...a society grounded in fiction, rather than reality, cannot function." A regime grounded in fiction cannot function either.

Carthago Delenda Est's avatar

It's all (you should excuse the expression) for white sales anyway.

Need new linens? Come on down for our Columbus Day white sale!

J L Graham's avatar

There is a snap sale on white wash on isle 3.

JDinTX's avatar

Laugh at 4am, thanks

Nancy K's avatar

There’s a Blue Light Special in aisle (h) ate!

J L Graham's avatar

Though therapy and careful use of anti-psychotic drugs may help.

Reader/Writer's avatar

It just seems that the mango moron wants to play these games by taking the most contrary stand, the one that been proven to be wrong and harmful and hateful to the most people, and throw that against the wall and stir up the most trouble. Such a psychopath. And he’s still in the epstein files.

D4N's avatar

I have a meme I saved that I really love along those lines Reader; "He who stirs the s_ _ _, should have to lick the spoon." lol

Jim Riley's avatar

Talk about picturesque…oooouuuuwww…ugly, it’s got to be distasteful in some form and/or fashion!?!?!

Patricia F. Neyman's avatar

These ideas are not all his by any means. He is being coached, instructed and bribed.

It's Come To This's avatar

I disagree. It all fits perfectly with the way he sees the world. Of course, the sadists who work for him know this as well. He is a sociopath indeed. One who's hired other sociopaths. Both of these things are true, not just one.

Janet Myers's avatar

That’s why the chose him to be the front man.

D4N's avatar

There it is JL; Beat me to it. Bravo ~

Jane Ketcham's avatar

I swear he has hired Russian and North Korean propagandists to write his pronouncements. They are SO over the top.

Samuel Brayfield's avatar

Yes. Trump absolutely does not not have the verbal skills to compose this. His minions use him to broadcast their ilk.

MLMinET's avatar

That’s exactly what I was going to say.

L.D.Michaels's avatar

I very recently read a commentary by a former United States Attorney (not Joyce Vance) who politely characterized the majority of the Justices on the U.S. Supreme Court as showing increased "deference" to the Executive branch's expansive readings of its powers under the U.S. Constitution.

In 1803, in the case of Marbury vs Madison, the U.S. Supreme Court established the bedrock doctrine of "judicial review" that has been religiously adhered to - up until today. In that decision, Chief Justice John Marshall, in affirming the bedrock Constitutional principle of checks and balances among our three branches of government, declared that the judiciary is not only a co-equal branch of government but has the duty to serve as the final authority on the constitutionality of actions taken by each of the other two branches.

Marbury vs Madison does NOT stand for the proposition that the Courts should defer to the President of the United States on his interpretation of the outer limits of his authority or whether there are any limits at all.

In a myriad of decisions and in a myriad of rulings without decisions, six of the Justices on the Supreme Court have been ruling along the lines of a far right-wing cabal to confer upon Donald Trump an inflated latitude to ignore the plain language of statutes enacted by Congress and signed into law by former Presidents that place clear constraints upon Presidential authority.

Yes. This Court is not only deferring to but blessing Donald Trump in trodding rampant upon our laws and in abusing his authority in the furtherance of his vision of an almighty President who, in Trump's own words, "rules the country and the world".

Fred W. Cox's avatar

Thank you for a timely and important comment. But I (with an apology) disagree with something that was stated in the comment - that the three branches of the federal government are “co-equal”. Since the Reagan Administration, ultraconservatives have pushed the “unitary executive” theory that the executive branch has the Constitutional power to overrule Congress. But almost all nonpartisan current Constitutional scholars now challenge that “theory” and say the Constitution was written to give ALL the legislative power to Congress and the enumeration of powers was not intended to be limiting but to ensure the enumerated powers were clearly stated. See premier Constitutional scholar Richard Primus’ new book “The Oldest Constitutional question” and his interview by Noah Feldman.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yju6kl6nSBs

Thanks again for your comment. Many Constitutional questions are in the docket for the current SCOTUS and as you suggest are a risk for our democracy. Readers of Heather’s newsletter may be interested in following the progress of these cases and can do so at Democracy Docket, lawyer Marc Elias’ podcast on YouTube. Marc Elias has argued five cases before the SCOTUS and he and his law firm defeated 60 cases brought by Trump lawyers in their attempt to overthrow the 2020 election.

Fred W. Cox's avatar

makes logical sense that the members of the Constitution Convention would not write a Constitution giving extraordinary power to the executive branch. They were escaping from a dictatorial monarchy and logically wouldn’t want to create another one. The first sentence of the Constitution is: “We the people…(to)…secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity,….”

They purposely added a Bill of Rights - the first 10 Amendments to protect to protect them from tyranny. They wanted the people to be in charge of the government so they gave the ultimate power to the Congress - the representatives of the people.

“We The People” now need to exercise that power.

KMD's avatar

Well said!

Mark Elias and his law firm are some of the brave warriors against the "Trump Menace", as I refer to it. The Democracy Docket is well worth subscribing to.

Chris Hierholzer's avatar

I subscribe to Marc and his hardworking team. Money well spent. They are a brave group of Americans!

Fred W. Cox's avatar

Many Constitutional questions are in the docket for the current SCOTUS and as you suggest are a risk for our democracy. Readers of Heather’s newsletter may be interested in following the progress of these cases and can do so at Democracy Docket, lawyer Marc Elias’ podcast on YouTube. Marc Elias has argued five cases before the SCOTUS and he and his law firm defeated 60 cases brought by Trump lawyers in their attempt to overthrow the 2020 election.

Fred W. Cox's avatar

It makes logical sense that the members of the Constitution Convention would not write a Constitution giving extraordinary power to the executive branch. They were escaping from a dictatorial monarchy and logically wouldn’t want to create another one. The first sentence of the Constitution is: “We the people…(to)…secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity,….”

They purposely added a Bill of Rights - the first 10 Amendments to protect to protect them from tyranny. They wanted the people to be in charge of the government so they gave the ultimate power to the Congress - the representatives of the people.

“We The People” now need to exercise that power.

D4N's avatar

"Fealty" in fact LD

Fred W. Cox's avatar

Thank you for a timely and important comment. But I (with an apology) disagree with something that was stated in the comment - that the three branches of the federal government are “co-equal”. Since the Reagan Administration, ultraconservatives have pushed the “unitary executive” theory that the executive branch has the Constitutional power to overrule Congress. But almost all nonpartisan current Constitutional scholars now challenge that “theory” and say the Constitution was written to give ALL the legislative power to Congress and the enumeration of powers was not intended to be limiting but to ensure the enumerated powers were clearly stated. See premier Constitutional scholar Richard Primus’ new book “The Oldest Constitutional question” and his interview by Noah Feldman.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yju6kl6nSBs

Thanks again for your comment. Many Constitutional questions are in the docket for the current SCOTUS and as you suggest are a risk for our democracy. Readers of Heather’s newsletter may be interested in following the progress of these cases and can do so at Democracy Docket, lawyer Marc Elias’ podcast on YouTube. Marc Elias has argued five cases before the SCOTUS and he and his law firm defeated 60 cases brought by Trump lawyers in their attempt to overthrow the 2020 election.

Gary Pudup's avatar

The problem with SCOTUS is that it is comprised of lawyers and nary an historian.

There is no requirement that a lawyer know any history beyond case law to pass the bar exam.

That's how we end up with the defense of the Second Amendment being historically confused.

L.D.Michaels's avatar

The problem is that the 6 lawyers comprising the Trump block are not following the law, including the landmark Marbury vs Madison decision. They are following and implementing their own warped political ideologies through the dunce sitting in the White House.

MLMinET's avatar

Because they share his views.

William Valenti's avatar

In 1491 it wasn’t empty

It wasn’t primitive or godless or deprived

It was a land of ancient cultures

Of a thousand ageless tribes

The equal of those who’d soon arrive

D . O. Olson's avatar

The very people that convinced my Nordic ancestors that it wasn’t a great idea to stay.

TCinLA's avatar

You guys didn't have guns. :-)

TCinLA's avatar

In many ways far advanced of the very primitive Spaniards.

David Warburton's avatar

Another disgusting performance by our wannabe dictator. Revolting, as always. Disgracing the presidency as none before have 24/7/365.

Joyce Kell-Sanders's avatar

Sure not the "history" we were taught in school. I wonder why people try to change history rather than learn the truth and deal with the lessons from it? I sure love what you teach us, Heather!

TCinLA's avatar

That "history" wasn't history. It was - and is - official mythology.

Katherine Wolf's avatar

They "change" history because they have a modern agenda. They revise and rewrite history to serve that agenda.

TCinLA's avatar

"who controls the present, controls the past; who controls the past controls the future." George Orwell

J L Graham's avatar

To make the false (con) seem true.

Katherine Wolf's avatar

Indeed. Note how successfully people in The South rewrote the reason for secession. Looking at original documents, it is clear it was about The South holding onto slavery vs The North maintaining the union. After the war, people in The South rewrote it to a war for states' rights. They were so successful that was what I was taught in as Massachusetts high school. Don't know what they are teaching now. I started reading history and learned "the truth". As much as one can know "the truth".

Robin Birdfeather's avatar

It occurs to me that the so-called culture that these whining insecure little boys and girls appear to be protecting they actually don't understand at all except in the Fox schnooze news regurgitations. Wonder how many of them failed history government and civics if indeed they took them while supposedly awake. Democritarians are so broad-minded in general that we have allowed stupidity its special protected places, issuing 'graduations' for first grade. Really?

D4N's avatar

Robin, You would love the pieces I've posted up on social media to give those opposed a major case of indigestion.

JDinTX's avatar

Be a life-long learner. Chump shut down in the crib I think

Megan Rothery's avatar

We can’t change history. We have to talk about our mistakes.

Reach out (beyond your own) to as many in the Senate and House as you can. All of this is bigger than an “I only represent my constituents” issue.

Use/share this spreadsheet (bit.ly/Goodtrouble) as a resource to call/email/write members of Congress, the Cabinet and news organizations. Reach out to those in your own state, and those in a committee that fits your topic. Call. Write. Email. Protest. Unrelentingly. We deserve better ❤️‍🩹🤍💙

D4N's avatar

Definitely; Even if reparations are out of the realm of possibility. However, as soon as "mistakes" from history come up in Nt'l dialogue, the extremists go off the deep end claiming that 'all the left wants to do is give away our stuff."

J L Graham's avatar

Zillionaires worry that they might have to share. Yeah, I think state owns everything sucks, but so too does a state controlled by wealthy oligarchs. Balance.

J L Graham's avatar

Trial and error, trial and success. That seems to be how we learn. That and contemplation. That and collaboration.

Miselle's avatar

Mike JOhnson is trying to label Oct 18 as a HATE AMERICA rally.

I agree with HCR when she has told us to carry American flags to rallies. I suggest we also wear red/white/blue and patriotic tshirts and hats. Especially wear your merch that designates you are a VET if you are one!

Susan Rohrbach's avatar

What's with Columbus planting a giant cross when he arrived? Never heard that one before. Oh--it's a misguided lie? Surprise, surprise. Trump the good Christian at work.

Phil Johnson's avatar

He also named the island he first landed on (thinking it was the Far East, I think) "San Salvador" (the Savior).

Robot Bender's avatar

He planted the Spanish flag, not a cross.

Susan Rohrbach's avatar

Thanks. I figured we would have heard if it was a cross.

D . O. Olson's avatar

Being Norwegian i just keep it simple; i ignore Columbus and celebrate my ancestors who actually “discovered” North America in around the year 900..they weren’t out for treasure, but a new life..

Katherine Wolf's avatar

Yes, the Norse got here before Columbus. However the people who discovered these continents came from Asia. And they had inhabited pretty much all of the habitable parts of both continents before any Europeans got here. I have no stake in this discovery competition being descended from Slavs and Germans who were rather late comers.

JDinTX's avatar

Damn, don’t tell chump, he will be invading there to become dear leader of the Norse

D . O. Olson's avatar

No stake either as my volga germans and norwegians came late as well; i will be cast out as a non member of the mayflower expedition; my wife can stay however.. another family separation i fear.

JDinTX's avatar

Always a few horse thieves among the heroes

Lynell(VA by way of MD&DC)'s avatar

"All this brouhaha, all this rigamarole, is about white people trying to keep brown people out of a country that belongs to red people that was built by black people." ~Rev. Terry K. Anderson, Lilly Grove Missionary Baptist Church, Houston, Texas

Some tribes of Virginia before Virginia became Virginia: the Mattaponi, Chickahominy, Monacan, Nansemond, Pamunjey and Rappahannock

Gail Adams VA/FL's avatar

An offshoot of the Mattaponi was settled in the late 17th century at Adamstown, and officially became the named Upper Mattaponi in 1921. In 2018 the Upper Mattaponi achieved federal recognition, the Mattaponi applied for recognition in 2024. Happy Indigenous Peoples Day! And yes, my husband is one of “those” Adams!

Frank Ferguson's avatar

Let's face it. Trump would like to have people dumber than he his. That's one he'll of an ask. His version of history has no basis in any reality. His version of Jan 6 is untethered enough, let alone anything as far back as Columbus.

Robin Birdfeather's avatar

Not to forget that his grandfather was already in disgrace for not signing up for the German army and it's too bad we didn't kick him out

J L Graham's avatar

Trump wants confirmation that he is the most important person (essentially, the ONLY important person) on the planet, if not the Universe.

JDinTX's avatar

Send him to Mars, with muskrat

Mike Giammaria's avatar

The President is right on time with the next distraction--god forbid anyone asks about those Epstein files. The only reason Trump ran in 2024 was to try to stay out of jail. One of these days he'll decide he wants to give Merrick Garland a medal for his stirring portrayal of an Attorney General under Biden.

Scott F. Brown's avatar

Two messages brought by others come to mind. "Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced" . James Baldwin. "The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off". Gloria Steinam. Radical right propaganda is the manifestation of resistance to facing the truth and panic about the truth of injustice and oppression. Truth is always more complex and layered than it may appear.